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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: October 16th, 2008

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twitternasty.  I see that kind of thing all the time.Oct 16 00:58
AlbertoPhi twitter !Oct 16 00:58
twitterhelloOct 16 00:58
AlbertoPwhat happened today? Did Geeko invaded another country? :-)Oct 16 01:00
schestowitzAll that these accounts do in Digg is attack people (and FOSS). They also do this in other sites/fora.Oct 16 01:00
schestowitzAlbertoP: you have an obsession with Geckos.Oct 16 01:01
schestowitzIt's like David Ike and those 'crocodile blood' thingie.Oct 16 01:01
AlbertoPschestowitz, it's just a common way of referring to suse ;-)Oct 16 01:01
twitterI'd rather you had a thing for lizardsOct 16 01:01
schestowitzNot a good cameo for a product.Oct 16 01:02
AlbertoPbtw, he is Geeko, not Gecko or whatever :)Oct 16 01:02
schestowitzSome of the alpha wallpaper/splash screens from old versions were horrid. People sent in photos of lizards.Oct 16 01:02
AlbertoPin 9.xOct 16 01:02
schestowitzGecks don't know how to wite. :-pOct 16 01:03
AlbertoPactually one was very niceOct 16 01:03
AlbertoPbut indeed not exactly "neutral" ;)Oct 16 01:03
schestowitzUsers complained. Scary monsters on booting...Oct 16 01:03
AlbertoPthey were on login...boot always was pretty flat for what I rememberOct 16 01:03
schestowitzVerbose.Oct 16 01:06
AlbertoPhttp://static.flickr.com/29/4069671...Oct 16 01:06
AlbertoPthis was one ^_^Oct 16 01:07
schestowitzIt's quite okay.Oct 16 01:08
schestowitzSome candidates were toads in a swamp... someone complained in the NG/mailing list.Oct 16 01:09
AlbertoPyepOct 16 01:14
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AlbertoPnew materials for you: sle 11 presented at brainshareOct 16 01:16
schestowitzSLE+new wallpaper?Oct 16 01:17
AlbertoPheheOct 16 01:18
schestowitzWindows 7 is under heavy work.Oct 16 01:18
AlbertoPI'm not a beta tester of SLE, so I don't knowOct 16 01:18
schestowitzLots of wallpaapers font and icons, just like Vista ME.Oct 16 01:18
AlbertoPit seems also a vista sp2Oct 16 01:19
schestowitz*fontsOct 16 01:19
schestowitzIt's a name change.Oct 16 01:19
schestowitzSelling something called "Vista SP2" is like selling sugar-coated feces.Oct 16 01:20
AlbertoPlol roy, relax...sp2 is downloadable ;)Oct 16 01:20
AlbertoPno idea of what are the plans for w7Oct 16 01:21
schestowitzThere are plans -- plans to "freeze the market," to use Microsoft own words.Oct 16 01:23
AlbertoPoh well, we'll seeOct 16 01:24
twitterThe market is relatively frozen, if no sales is cold.  M$ will go bust that way.Oct 16 01:25
kevin083what do you guys think of supposed "nontransferable" licenses? isn't it a scam?Oct 16 01:27
schestowitzPeople buy low-cost laptops, often with Linux. Even shillnalysts say so right now.Oct 16 01:27
schestowitzkentma: the MAFIAA gets away with it, I think.Oct 16 01:27
schestowitzOops, kevin083 it should sayOct 16 01:28
twitterThey have already evaporated $60 billion.  I don't think they can spread the $40 spending over so many years because they are going to run out of cash before 2013.Oct 16 01:28
twitterThere's a lot of pent up demand for computers, especially small quiet ones.Oct 16 01:29
kevin083i think if the average person knew about it they would have a problem with itOct 16 01:29
schestowitzI heard that Microsoft tolerates even a loss in 'netbooks' now.Oct 16 01:30
twitterIf people had a choice they would chose freedom.Oct 16 01:30
twitterthey typical dump ... how many things can they dump at once?Oct 16 01:30
schestowitzMeaning they dump it trying to kill Linux companies (stranglehold to chokehold).Oct 16 01:30
schestowitzdumping drugs is a long-term investment.Oct 16 01:31
kevin083heheOct 16 01:31
schestowitzThey hope to see the kids running back for a 'dose' of BilldowsOct 16 01:31
twitterdump netbooks, dump software on students, dump software on 3rd world, dump zune, dump xbox, it all ads up to the losses we have seen.Oct 16 01:31
kevin083well i used to use windows every day... if they can't even let me move my copy i paid for when i purchased the pc to a new one i don't want them getting any of my moneyOct 16 01:32
schestowitzThey call it Ultimate/Unlimited Opportunity, IIRC>Oct 16 01:32
twitterMore like a money pit.Oct 16 01:32
schestowitzWatch out for that name "Unlimited Potential... I call it codename for "anti-Linux budget"Oct 16 01:32
kevin083i'm sure there are others that feel the same way, but it is something nobody ever talks aboutOct 16 01:33
schestowitzkevin083: Microsoft insists a PC without Windows is a 'naked PC', then why can't 'clothes' be passed?Oct 16 01:33
twitterbecause they are lying?Oct 16 01:33
kevin083they are just taking advantage of the fact that 90% of people don't want to transfer their softwareOct 16 01:34
schestowitzWell, they perfume these lies.Oct 16 01:34
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schestowitzLike those who dump and convince themselves they do a favvour to the kids ('charity')Oct 16 01:34
kevin083that would be like me saying that because people don't use 90% of what i sell them i get to steal it back from themOct 16 01:34
kevin083not right at allOct 16 01:34
schestowitzDRMOct 16 01:35
twitter"Without good software and an owner who understands programming, a hobby computer is wasted."Oct 16 01:35
twitterFunction guilt, also presumes he has "good" software.Oct 16 01:36
twitterFree software has no owners, so transferring it is not a problem.Oct 16 01:37
twitterBill can keep his crap.Oct 16 01:37
kevin083but you end up paying them whether you want to or not. for example if you purchase an mp3 player that supports wmdrmOct 16 01:38
schestowitzhttp://arstechnica.com/journals/microsoft.a... : Bill Gates: "the GPL, which we disagree with"Oct 16 01:39
schestowitzkevin083: yes, it was more of a problem when I got one as a 'gift;Oct 16 01:39
kevin083it could easily be set up so that if one wants playsforsure/whatever the drm is, they must install it on their device themselves instead of bundling itOct 16 01:40
kevin083but then obviously it wouldn't take offOct 16 01:41
schestowitzYes.Oct 16 01:42
schestowitzIt's the same issue with Ubuntu (or Dellbuntu)Oct 16 01:42
schestowitzAll buyers are forced to pay for the Microsoft drek.Oct 16 01:42
kevin083it's even in cell phones now :)Oct 16 01:43
AlbertoPschestowitz, dell fixed thatOct 16 01:44
AlbertoPcurrently dell's prices are slightly lower if you get ubuntuOct 16 01:44
schestowitzNo-O/S boxes?Oct 16 01:44
schestowitzAlbertoP: that's not the point.Oct 16 01:45
AlbertoPit was suggested on direct2dell and implementedOct 16 01:45
schestowitzThey charge you for codecs and, well... essentially patents.Oct 16 01:45
AlbertoPwell, that's pretty normal, if you want codecs in a legal wayOct 16 01:45
schestowitzThey also joined Microsoft/Novell, so n surprise there.Oct 16 01:45
kevin083don't forget the right to decrypt your own dvd movies :)Oct 16 01:45
schestowitzAlbertoP: I don't need codecs.Oct 16 01:45
schestowitzThey should offer the option.Oct 16 01:46
AlbertoPyou need codecs, you just don't want to pay for them :)Oct 16 01:46
schestowitzRather than add craplets *and* charge for them.Oct 16 01:46
AlbertoPhowever DELL, on the professional line, has the "n" versionOct 16 01:46
AlbertoPwithout OS installedOct 16 01:46
schestowitzVeyr limitedOct 16 01:46
schestowitzNot many lines.Oct 16 01:46
AlbertoPyes sure, because no one requests it actuallyOct 16 01:46
AlbertoPprecision workstations and some serversOct 16 01:47
schestowitzThey should separate (unbundle) h/w and s/wOct 16 01:47
AlbertoPbahOct 16 01:47
schestowitzIf Microsoft has a problem with that, then it ought to make Windows easier to installOct 16 01:47
AlbertoPthey answer to what a customer buysOct 16 01:47
schestowitzEvery m0r0n can install something like UbuntuOct 16 01:47
schestowitzEven little kids.Oct 16 01:47
AlbertoPwell, installation is not really the problemOct 16 01:48
AlbertoPthe problem is that hw companies don't really want to deal with customers calling support to have the OS installedOct 16 01:48
kevin083most PCs come with AV pre-installed tooOct 16 01:49
AlbertoPAV?Oct 16 01:49
AlbertoPantivirus?Oct 16 01:49
kevin083where by your subscription will expire in a year or so... when there are free alternativesOct 16 01:49
kevin083yepOct 16 01:49
kevin083that's what i told my mom when she got a new pcOct 16 01:49
AlbertoPkevin083, I agree with you on that. Even if usually they put a suite of tools (firewall and stuff) not only AVOct 16 01:51
schestowitzThe idea of unbundling law in different.Oct 16 01:51
AlbertoPschestowitz, they just need to add the options of the OS when you buy...that's allOct 16 01:51
schestowitzIn France they lobby (consumer group/s) for vendors to publicly display the cost of WIndows and deduct it shall the customer refuse to have it with the h/w.Oct 16 01:51
kevin083i do believe some software should be bundled, as long as it is a part of the system being installed such as a web browser and music playerOct 16 01:52
schestowitzThere's good progress for the unbundlers.Oct 16 01:52
AlbertoPa complete unbundling would be a mess, considering the average culture of who buys a pcOct 16 01:52
kevin083third-party software isn't a good idea thoughOct 16 01:52
schestowitzThe seller can provide the PC and the CD/s separately.Oct 16 01:52
AlbertoPright, and make the buyer pay 200$ to install them ^^Oct 16 01:53
schestowitzThis way they can swap PCs and the cost of a PC affected just by the s/w appended.Oct 16 01:53
AlbertoPthis really would help LOLOct 16 01:53
kevin083that's kinda what HP does... they don't give you the restore disk, but it is pre-loadedOct 16 01:53
twitter"you need codecs, you just don't want to pay for them"  The only problem with codecs is patent law and DMCA - violations of your rights.  They are available but may not be distributed in non free states such as the USA.Oct 16 01:53
schestowitzLOL @ "non free states"Oct 16 01:54
AlbertoPtwitter, codecs can't be redistributed in half europe eitherOct 16 01:54
twitterI did not claim half of Europe was free.Oct 16 01:54
schestowitzThe United States of Anti-socialismOct 16 01:54
kevin083lolOct 16 01:55
kevin083well i paid more to get an ogg vorbis playerOct 16 01:55
kevin083and i'm happy with itOct 16 01:55
schestowitzWell, Hollywood bought laws in Europe.Oct 16 01:55
schestowitzThey just needed some foolish or corruptible politicians.Oct 16 01:55
twitterCorporate and government cooperation of the current US variety has a name, Fascism.Oct 16 01:55
AlbertoPlolOct 16 01:55
kevin083most people would never do that thoughOct 16 01:56
twitterWhat, use vorbis?Oct 16 01:56
kevin083pay more for the ability to use itOct 16 01:56
twitterWhy should people pay for codecs?Oct 16 01:57
schestowitz...When they are free onesOct 16 01:57
kevin083they shouldn't have to... it puts one in a position where their content can be taken hostageOct 16 01:57
schestowitzIt binding of 'playback tax'Oct 16 01:57
kevin083that's why i did what i didOct 16 01:57
schestowitzThe EU treats some of this as a violation.Oct 16 01:57
schestowitz..while at the same time being abusing and abusive in the same way with its media 'streaM$'Oct 16 01:58
kevin083i had that happen to me a few years ago... i encoded a bunch of files using nero and then it told me the trial for the codec had expired so i couldn't access my stuff anymoreOct 16 02:01
kevin083i didn't even know it was a trial encoder because it came with the burner. basically they say "if you want your files back, you'll pay a license fee to decode them" lolOct 16 02:02
schestowitzCOdec hostage.Oct 16 02:02
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twitterVorbis works for me.Oct 16 02:03
schestowitzThe codecs were free. Free as in "Samples"Oct 16 02:03
kevin083it's great!Oct 16 02:03
twitterffmpeg2vorbis might help you out of your trap.  -v controls quality, 5 is good.Oct 16 02:04
kevin083well that was years ago... it just opened my eyesOct 16 02:04
kevin083back in early 2006 in factOct 16 02:04
schestowitzmplayer does conversions too, I think.Oct 16 02:04
twitterThe economic implosion is going to derail the DRM fucks.  They thought they could slip it into digital broadcast transitions and "high definition" but people are not going to be able to pay for the fancy new TVs and rip off content.Oct 16 02:06
twitterAdvertisers will route around that.Oct 16 02:07
schestowitzTheir issue might be backlash. They try to expire old 'content'.Oct 16 02:08
schestowitzPeople are stupid, but only to an extent. They'll sooner or later realise they they were rented content, not sold.Oct 16 02:08
twitterThe expiration was going to be a quality improvement.Oct 16 02:08
kevin083did you hear about those authentication servers for music which were gonna shut down?Oct 16 02:09
twitterThey don't really care about owning video, especially video they can manipulate because they are not used to doing that.Oct 16 02:09
kevin083they pulled out at the last minute like cowards and kept them running :)Oct 16 02:09
schestowitzThe MAFIAA sets the rules such that buyers (paying customers) lose their product, which 'expires'. Those that 'steal' (copy) get to keep their data.Oct 16 02:09
twitterThey will care less when they have trouble buying dinner.Oct 16 02:09
kevin083i SO wish they would have shut them down... people would have come after themOct 16 02:09
schestowitzkevin083: those severs won't last forever.Oct 16 02:09
schestowitzIt's the same with MSN.Oct 16 02:10
twitterPays for Sure.Oct 16 02:10
kevin083it was yahoo, msn, and wal*martOct 16 02:10
schestowitzYahoo! and Google issued some lousy refunds, IIRC>Oct 16 02:10
twitterfailureOct 16 02:10
schestowitzWal*Mart and MSN responded only after being blasted in public.Oct 16 02:10
twitter"unlimited" music rental never worked.Oct 16 02:11
kevin083it'll be interesting to see what the world is like 10 years from now... either there will be insane DRM or no drmOct 16 02:12
twitterRadio is dead because the RIAA's arrangement only allowed stations to have 3 or 4 hundred songs.  Sad isn't it?Oct 16 02:12
kevin083once the servers start shutting down people will catch onOct 16 02:12
twitterMy wife put it, "you mean I have to buy Sony music for my Sony music player?  How stupid!"Oct 16 02:13
schestowitzIt's called C.R.A.P.Oct 16 02:14
kevin083... and it won't play on that appleOct 16 02:14
schestowitzFind the video from David Berlind in YouTube.Oct 16 02:14
AlbertoPsmall question: do you use acrored?Oct 16 02:17
schestowitzMe? No.Oct 16 02:20
twitterOh man! The Corry Doctorow interview, about how a free author has moved to free software, comes up like this, " The article you are trying to access requires you to be a registered Linux Journal print or digital subscriber."  :'(Oct 16 02:20
schestowitzYes, I know. But it was too good to not quoteOct 16 02:20
kevin083wowOct 16 02:20
twitterGood quotes alright.  Well thanks.Oct 16 02:20
twitterIt was kind of like seeing a RMS in wmv.Oct 16 02:21
twitterWatch for Novell to publish like that.Oct 16 02:22
kevin083i can't believe people "patent" fonts... lol that's just funnyOct 16 02:22
kevin083but i guess that's just because i'm the guy who always uses the default one because it looks just fineOct 16 02:22
AlbertoPkevin083, people patents also plugs, wires, ...Oct 16 02:23
AlbertoPdon't ask me what's innovative there ^^Oct 16 02:23
twitterA particular plug might deserve a patent.Oct 16 02:24
AlbertoPreaaaally particularOct 16 02:24
AlbertoPusually they patent the design more than the plug thoughOct 16 02:24
kevin083perhaps in those cases where one tiny plug serves tuns of functions. e.g. charging, tv-output, line input etcOct 16 02:24
kevin083i've got a device like that and the plug is real small... impressiveOct 16 02:25
twitterI'd think of mechanical and or electrical improvements.Oct 16 02:25
twitterIt's hard to imagine a plug that has not already been invented though.Oct 16 02:25
AlbertoPthat's the point ^Oct 16 02:25
AlbertoP^^Oct 16 02:25
AlbertoPa font at least if new-looking, requires a looooot of workOct 16 02:26
twitterYes, if it's a non obvious invention, it might deserve a patent.Oct 16 02:26
AlbertoPbtw, opensuse has new, free and open, fonts thanks to jimmac 8-)Oct 16 02:26
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schestowitzFonts don't need patents.Oct 16 02:30
schestowitzIt's more to do with art, i.e. copyrights.Oct 16 02:30
AlbertoPinfringe one of the two...and you'll be happy in the same way :)Oct 16 02:33
AlbertoPn8Oct 16 02:38
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twitterIt also shows some of the problems of a system that was made for paper publishing.  Fonts are a real art form and a particular expression, but they have to reside on the users machine to be useful.Oct 16 02:58
twittercopyright was never supposed to put restrictions on readers, just publishers.Oct 16 02:58
schestowitztrue.Oct 16 02:58
twitterit would be a crime to put restrictions on the machines themselves, even for publishers.Oct 16 02:59
schestowitzIt assumes no parity.Oct 16 02:59
schestowitzNo peer communication, either.Oct 16 02:59
twitterso you are left with M$ bluster about just that kind of crime.Oct 16 02:59
twitterHere's a funny for you, http://bayimg.com/iAlohAabhOct 16 02:59
schestowitzWhat separates gossip from publishing (consumer-producer relaltionship)Oct 16 03:00
twitterI don't know.Oct 16 03:00
twitterthe question is strangeOct 16 03:00
twittergood night all.Oct 16 03:01
schestowitzIt was not a question.Oct 16 03:02
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MinceRhayOct 16 05:51
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schestowitzAh, the irony! SAP freezes internal IT purchases: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13...Oct 16 07:47
schestowitz Giant database plan 'Orwellian': http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_pol...Oct 16 08:55
schestowitzMicrosoft to ditch MSN Groups? : http://news.cnet.com/8301-13577_3-100671...Oct 16 08:57
schestowitzhttp://commit-digest.org/issues/2008-09-28/ "Richard Dale committed changes in /branches/KDE/4.1/kdebindings/csharp: * Promote the C# bindings from the trunk to the KDE 4.1 release branch * Regenerate the KDE and Plasma sources from the 4.1 headers"Oct 16 09:56
twitterI wonder if anyone will use it.  There are already plenty of scripting languages.Oct 16 13:37
schestowitzYes, I've just sent this information to other people.Oct 16 13:40
schestowitzBTW, re: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/16/n... , The Unlimited Potential Group is being portrayed as 'charitable'; instead, it should be reported to the FTC for abuse (anti-competitive dumping).Oct 16 13:41
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brunomiguelhello :)Oct 16 14:15
schestowitzHey. what's up?Oct 16 14:16
brunomigueldon't know. i'm reading the news to find out. :POct 16 14:17
schestowitzOh. I need to post some more links. :-)Oct 16 14:23
schestowitzEurope makes some more moves to Free software now.Oct 16 14:23
brunomiguelthey finally ditched all the dictator software?Oct 16 14:25
schestowitzNot yet. One day at a time, esp. when there's financial stress.Oct 16 14:29
twitterhard to compete with free, isn't it?  :)Oct 16 14:44
twitterdive, dive, dive!  http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:MSFTOct 16 14:44
twitterhttp://finance.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:NOVLOct 16 14:44
twitterbusiness as usual makes people angry, http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2008/oc...Oct 16 14:46
schestowitzEek!Oct 16 14:46
twitter" They are not going to have the party and leave the hangover for taxpayers."Oct 16 14:47
twitterWhy not, they obviously left the shareholders and customers that way.Oct 16 14:48
PetoKraushmm, shane is posting agian?Oct 16 14:48
schestowitzYes. :-)Oct 16 14:48
PetoKraus*ainOct 16 14:48
PetoKrausthat's good news!Oct 16 14:48
PetoKrausnot that i didn't like your posts... :DOct 16 14:48
schestowitzHe's the founderOct 16 14:48
twitterthe more the merrierOct 16 14:49
schestowitzReaders are encouraged to contribute posts as well.Oct 16 14:51
schestowitzSomething strange happened.Oct 16 14:56
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schestowitzSome days ago Firefox stopped opening ogg as emdded page media player with streaming. Now it just opens them once downloaded in external programs. :-(Oct 16 14:57
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_Doug.Oct 16 15:12
_Doug..Oct 16 15:12
_Doug...Oct 16 15:12
_Doug....Oct 16 15:12
schestowitzPoor Sun is below $5Oct 16 15:12
_Doug.....Oct 16 15:12
_Doug......Oct 16 15:12
schestowitzBut you don't like talking about the economy.Oct 16 15:12
_DougAw shucks ..Oct 16 15:12
schestowitzSun down almost 80% in one year.Oct 16 15:12
_Dougwho me ?Oct 16 15:13
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_Dougnobody likes talking about the economy .. @Oct 16 15:13
schestowitzYes, you. I was not talking to your cleavage.Oct 16 15:13
_Doug$$$$$$ where have all my dollars gone ?Oct 16 15:13
schestowitz:-)Oct 16 15:13
schestowitzConverted to Euro  by Iran.Oct 16 15:14
_DougYou do realize that if the Do$$ar collapses, the rest of the global economy will follow suit ..Oct 16 15:15
schestowitzYesOct 16 15:17
_DougEvery Email In UK To Be Monitored ..Oct 16 15:17
_Doughttp://yro.slashdot.org/yro/08/10/15/2222209.shtmlOct 16 15:17
_DougWe of the Tuting popular front will just have to go underground .. :)Oct 16 15:18
schestowitzYou and I have no more control over the US$ than 6 billion other peopleOct 16 15:18
schestowitzI already encrypt mail where possible.Oct 16 15:18
_Dougtooting :)Oct 16 15:19
_DougUK Court Rejects Encryption Key Disclosure Defense ..Oct 16 15:19
_Doughttp://it.slashdot.org/it/08/10/...Oct 16 15:19
_Doughttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen_SmithOct 16 15:20
_Doug"twelve monkeys" was on last night ..Oct 16 15:24
_DougDid anyone notive that it was Cole who gave the idea for the virus to the son while in the looneybin ?Oct 16 15:24
_DougJeffrey Goines an  animal rights activist and possibly a Linux user :)Oct 16 15:28
_DougThey sent him back in time to discover who stole the SCO source code ..Oct 16 15:32
_Dougwe must have a pure strain :)Oct 16 15:32
_DougSo, if Cole never went back .. the outbreak would never have taken place .. time paradox .. discuss ...Oct 16 15:37
schestowitzFilms? Why films?Oct 16 15:38
schestowitzSpeaking of animal right activist, there's this article: http://www.schneier.com/blog/ar...Oct 16 15:38
schestowitz*rightsOct 16 15:38
_Dougjustv trying to encourage the conversation ...Oct 16 15:38
_DougI like animals, but we have to eat them and use for medical experiments .. to survive ..Oct 16 15:39
_Dougas long as the distress is kept to a minimum ..Oct 16 15:39
_DougSchneier on Security: this is really scary ..Oct 16 15:41
schestowitzHe *is* scary. But nice in real life...Oct 16 15:46
schestowitzI'm off to the gym now anyway..Oct 16 15:47
_Dougsee ya .. I'm off too ...Oct 16 15:48
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tessierschestowitz: You have met Bruce Schneier?Oct 16 16:15
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*Received a CTCP VERSION from Samuel-NotAFKOct 16 16:26
twitterM$ and Novell stock have both moved more than 10% today.  Crazy fluctuations.Oct 16 16:33
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trmancohttp://www.italovignoli.org/2008/10/15/this-is-...Oct 16 16:50
twitter:) shareOct 16 16:52
twitterwith your friendsOct 16 16:52
twitterGood perspective on latest "bailouts" http://lists.essential.org/piperm...Oct 16 16:58
twitterI've used this analogy before,  "Internet space in our country has become the wall of a public toilet," but did not go where these people want to go.Oct 16 17:06
twitterMore badness from Korea http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/10/...Oct 16 17:06
twitterExploitation still thriving on Wall Street, it's just a little more personal and less lucrative than before.   http://www.nydailynews.com/money/2008/10/11/2008-...Oct 16 17:08
twitterIn other news, M$ continues to Slog Yahoo.  http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20...Oct 16 17:18
twitterHow much of the M$ offer was in M$ stock and coupons last time?Oct 16 17:18
twitterNo need for anti-trust here, no sir-ree.  This would not be like that non exclusive deal Google wants.Oct 16 17:20
twitter:POct 16 17:21
twitterWill M$ buy Yahoo with M$ debt or M$ shares this time?Oct 16 17:22
twitterI can make Yahoo a better offer.  6 rolls of toilet paper and the promise to not fire anyone.  M$ licensing costs and the elimination of bonuses should cover salaries for a while.Oct 16 17:24
twitterHere comes the usual election time gasoline price drop  http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/17/business/worldb...Oct 16 17:25
twitterI wonder if Exxon will still rack up another "best year ever".  I'd bet a nickel on it.Oct 16 17:26
twitterMore M$ hype and vapor, going for "limited" "instant on" http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/230988/wind...Oct 16 17:32
twitterACPI was supposed to give people the "full" OS experience quickly, their vaporware announcement is really an admission of power management failure.Oct 16 17:34
twitterbut ha - ha, Bill Gates, GNU/Linux works great.Oct 16 17:34
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schestowitzThe Down Jones is almost Up Jones now.Oct 16 18:39
schestowitztwitter: a friend of mine reckons an intl' currency will be introduced. I doubt it though.Oct 16 18:41
MinceRjonesin' up and down?Oct 16 18:47
schestowitzYes, it's like a trampoline. Strangely enough, I haven't seen RMS saying anything about it yet. Even Mark Shuttleworth blogged it. Linux CEOs talked about it too.Oct 16 18:49
schestowitzChart: http://beranger.org/index.php?page=dia...Oct 16 18:50
PetoKrausisn't it constantly dropping?Oct 16 18:52
schestowitzYes, fluctuates, but overall down. I get all my financial news from Beranger : Funny < http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary&... >, also funny < http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary&... > and < http://beranger.org/index.php?page=diary&am... >: "Galbraith's “The Great Crash 1929”"Oct 16 18:54
schestowitz"[...] In 1928, the richest 5 per cent of the population took in more than a third of all personal income. They averaged less than a quarter for most of the post-war period, but inequality began to rise sharply from the Eighties. In the past two or three years, the top 5 per cent have again made up to 38 per cent of all personal income, according to US data compiled by Emmanuel Saez, economist at the University of California."Oct 16 18:55
schestowitz"Galbraith calls it "devastation by reverse leverage". He describes a corporate pyramid, with vast holding companies controlling large segments of the utility, railroad and entertainment business."Oct 16 18:55
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PetoKrausschestowitz: i have it as my desktop backgroundOct 16 18:56
PetoKrausthe 1280x800 image, that isOct 16 18:57
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schestowitzCould set it to gradient red shades in KDE3.Oct 16 18:57
PetoKrausgradient red shades?Oct 16 18:58
schestowitzAll down.Oct 16 18:58
schestowitzBut then you'd be labeled an "anarchist".Oct 16 18:59
MinceRand that's a bad thing?Oct 16 18:59
schestowitzWell, if you live in a police state, it can make life inconvenient: http://www.itwire.com/content/view/21192/1054/ . A lot of this goes to the genesis of the Free software movement and what RMS foresaw in technology.Oct 16 19:00
schestowitz"The news for Australian Internet users just keeps getting worse," said EFA Board member Colin Jacobs. "We have legitimate concerns with the creeping scope of this unprecedented interference in our communications infrastructure. It's starting to look like nothing less than aOct 16 19:01
schestowitzcomprehensive program of real-time Internet censorship."Oct 16 19:01
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twitter:'( like China.Oct 16 19:13
twitterUp nearly 11%.  Crazy.   http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ:NOVLOct 16 19:14
PetoKrausoh :DOct 16 19:14
twitterStill under $5.00, haha.Oct 16 19:15
twitterThe swings are so wild they show that the valuation is arbitrary, making it worth nothing real.Oct 16 19:15
schestowitzAs long as Netware sinks, so will Novell's value. They buy back stock.Oct 16 19:16
schestowitzSteve Jobs to quit Apple : http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/n...Oct 16 19:17
twitter5%, 38%, that's bad news.Oct 16 19:17
schestowitzGood time to leave, if true.Oct 16 19:17
twitterAnother Apple rumor?  Sheesh.Oct 16 19:17
schestowitzProbably. Like Gates 'retiring' (to bribe people for Windows)Oct 16 19:18
twitterWhat a flip and insulting article.  Do they dish out the same treatment for M$ tools?Oct 16 19:22
schestowitzhttp://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inqui... How "marketing melts your brain [...] Propaganda machine [...] Isn’t marketing affecting us a bit too much? Most of us heard of the word fanboy, [...]  fanboy or fangirl sometimes by his or her entourage, sometimes by the reputation and advertising of a brand.Oct 16 19:22
twitterAt least they link to something worth while http://ipower.ning.com/netneutrality2Oct 16 19:22
twitterI don't understand the image for that link but it seems to work.  http://images.vnu.net/en/gb/inq/pic-...  :-DOct 16 19:23
schestowitzThey've had 'worse'Oct 16 19:24
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twitterI suppose M$ needed to put a damper on Apple, http://finance.google.com/finance?q=NASDAQ%3AAAPLOct 16 19:28
twitterCan't think of something good for yourself?  Make up something bad about your competitors.Oct 16 19:28
schestowitzMicrosoft attempts to sour Apple's laptop launch : http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2008/10/15/ap5...Oct 16 19:29
schestowitzTypical. Like they sabotaged VMware's event and other such things. Or Novell with OOo: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/14...Oct 16 19:30
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**** BEGIN LOGGING AT Thu Oct 16 19:30:58 2008
*Now talking on #boycottnovellOct 16 19:30
*Topic for #boycottnovell is: "Exploring the reality behind exclusionary deals with Microsoft and their subtle (yet severe) implications" [publicly logged]Oct 16 19:30
*Topic for #boycottnovell set by schestowitz at Sun Oct 5 19:20:28 2008Oct 16 19:30
-ChanServ-[#boycottnovell] Welcome to the #boycottnovell channelOct 16 19:30
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schestowitzOops. Did I miss something?Oct 16 19:31
schestowitzI hit CTRL+WOct 16 19:31
MinceRnothingOct 16 19:31
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jose_xschestowitz, I won't stay long, but did you read this.. http://www.linuxplanet.com/linuxp...Oct 16 19:36
jose_xit's interesting to read..Oct 16 19:36
schestowitzWho is "Michael Hall"?Oct 16 19:38
schestowitzNever heard of him.Oct 16 19:38
schestowitzAnyway, I'll read it now.Oct 16 19:38
schestowitzWTF? "Originally published September 28, 2000, on LinuxPlanet"Oct 16 19:39
schestowitzThey do 8-year-old reruns now?Oct 16 19:39
schestowitzBoy, it must be quite some recession if they need to bring back writers from  the last decade -- provocative ones too.Oct 16 19:39
schestowitz*LOL* "You can download a pppoe client for your machine, but you'll have to look it up on Google. The installers don't mind dual-boot machines, but have it booted into Windows in case you get a belligerent one. Oh... I wasn't here. I didn't say this.""Oct 16 19:40
schestowitz"That's why I'm Microsoft certified now... I'm one of a special group that got to beta test Windows 98 for free!" Wow! Win98. That's more modern than errr. .. Mandriva 2009? No, maybe Mandrake 6 or something with KDE 1.9Oct 16 19:41
jose_xthat part did sound funny.. sorry, roy, i did not realize it was republishedOct 16 19:42
PetoKrausit's nice article thoOct 16 19:43
jose_xit is niceOct 16 19:43
jose_xi feel relieved thoughOct 16 19:43
schestowitzNokia tries to smile as profits slump < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/16/nokia_q3/ >Oct 16 19:43
jose_xtalk about some fudOct 16 19:43
schestowitzWho reran it and why?Oct 16 19:43
schestowitzThe date at the top is deceiving.Oct 16 19:43
twitterLook, FUD for Google.  http://slashdot.org/firehose.plOct 16 19:45
twittergrrrrOct 16 19:45
twitterhttp://tech.slashdot.org/article...Oct 16 19:45
schestowitzThis phone is probably Linux/Java based and Moto might join forces with Android: Motorola touts touchscreen phone tech to Trekkers < http://www.reghardware.co.uk/2008/... >Oct 16 19:45
schestowitzCWMike.Oct 16 19:46
schestowitzThat's Mike Elgan, a self-confessed "Windows guy" (yes, he calls himself that)Oct 16 19:46
schestowitzRoughly Drafted hates him: http://www.roughlydrafted.com/2007/10... (among more)Oct 16 19:47
schestowitzMicrosoft's Fast charged with 'accounting fraud' < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/10/... >Oct 16 19:48
schestowitzMicrosoft's Fast Search Charged With Fraud in Norway < http://www.pcworld.com/article/152346/.... >Oct 16 19:49
jose_xdoes microsoft stand to gain (or lose) if fast was up to funny business?Oct 16 19:55
schestowitzMicrosoft is fradulent too.Oct 16 19:55
schestowitzI guess  Norway is just more strict when it comes to the law.Oct 16 19:56
schestowitzThe SEC let Microsoft go loose after a 'settlement' (yeah, go figure out you can fail yourself out or crime).Oct 16 19:56
schestowitz*bail, not failOct 16 19:57
twitterwhere is Elgan hiding?Oct 16 19:57
schestowitzWhat do you mean "hiding"?Oct 16 19:58
schestowitzMicrosoft actually settled at least twice -- first with the whistleblower (Charlie made $4 million out of it), then with the SECOct 16 19:59
twitterCWMike ... looking for CW article ... don't see it.Oct 16 19:59
twitterSo M$ got jacked when it bought Fast?  Ha ha.Oct 16 20:01
schestowitzWaste of money.Oct 16 20:02
twitteryeah but a bigger waste than they thought.Oct 16 20:03
schestowitzGoogle still rules enterprise search. Microsoft scrables and clings onto anything that it thinks might save it while angry investors walk away at the sight of a Web-obsessed dinosaur.Oct 16 20:03
jose_xhave you guys mentioned yahoo's almost instant 10-15% rise after ballmer made a comment today?Oct 16 20:03
twitterYeah, I saw that.Oct 16 20:03
schestowitzAt the end, Microsoft uses the Burton Group shills I assume to mock Google Apps... never forget that an infected WIndows PC is downtime too... maybe data loss too.Oct 16 20:03
twitterI wondered where a company that's going into debt would get money to buy yet another company.Oct 16 20:04
jose_xwhen i read about fast, i was thinking that maybe microsoft had ratted them perhaps in an effort to annul the buy or get something from someone.. or maybe they could benefit from excusesOct 16 20:04
schestowitzI can go /more/ debt.Oct 16 20:04
schestowitzIt was going to borrow $20 billion or so in MarchOct 16 20:04
jose_xi also pondered just as i was starting to read it that maybe ms might use them to hide their own funny businessOct 16 20:04
schestowitzOh, share the washing cycle. Let the laundry begun.Oct 16 20:05
schestowitz*beginOct 16 20:05
twitterlooks more like distraction than serious talkOct 16 20:05
twitterAll part of the slogOct 16 20:06
jose_xtwitter, if people think ms is gold then they will buy their debt offerings for whatever % gain ms offersOct 16 20:06
twitterWhy would anyone think a company that turned $60 billion cash into $20 billion debt was "gold"?Oct 16 20:07
twitterGolden flow smells like urine.Oct 16 20:08
jose_xms doesn't plead for money.. with noses high in the air they walk into a fed auction and expect everyone to drop what they are doing in order to go bid for their really really safe debt at say 1 or 2% since they are as good as a central bank if not betterOct 16 20:09
jose_x:-POct 16 20:09
schestowitzFinance Ministry of Latvia: gradual transition to open source software at government institutions should be careful considerated < http://www.baltic-course.com/eng/finances/?doc=6184 >Oct 16 20:09
twitterFUD.  Like ESR pointed out TCO is on free software's side.  The sooner they get out of M$, the more they save.Oct 16 20:12
twitterWhat's going on with the Munich migration?  Sweaty B been skiing lately?Oct 16 20:13
twitterhttp://www.heise.de/english/newsticker/news/80071Oct 16 20:14
twitterThat's from late 2006.Oct 16 20:14
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jose_xthe latvia finance ministry guy talking smells boughtOct 16 20:17
twitteror confusedOct 16 20:18
jose_xin any case, ms hooks you on an expensive deal and then that is supposed to serve as a motivator for sticking with them.Oct 16 20:18
jose_xyou already paid 10 trillion for it.. might as well use itOct 16 20:18
jose_xwe should call them out on that tacticOct 16 20:19
twitterbut the new version is so much better when they want to sell you thatOct 16 20:19
jose_xthis way after these governments make the deal, they will look foolishOct 16 20:19
twitterWhen it comes to M$, you have to live in the future.Oct 16 20:19
jose_xand not fooledOct 16 20:19
jose_xand connedOct 16 20:19
schestowitzWell, it goes backwards.Oct 16 20:19
schestowitzXP -> Vista = downgrade  WS03->WS08 = worse uptimeOct 16 20:20
twitterM$ always says the old version had problems and the new version may not be stable but you will love the features.Oct 16 20:20
twitterIf you imagine yourself five years from now, you realize that the new version is a turd too.Oct 16 20:21
schestowitzFeatures... new wallpapers, more 'rights' (digital restriction)..Oct 16 20:21
_Doug'the “Microsoft Office SharePointServer” platform is used extensively in the work of several departments of the ministry. The Finance Ministry points out that there is no analog to this Microsoft platform that would meet the ministry’s criteria and be worth the investments that have already been made into the Microsoft platform'Oct 16 20:24
_Doughttp://www.baltic-course.com/eng/fin...Oct 16 20:24
_DougDatorzinibu Centrs Ltd, Contact person, Signe Balina;Oct 16 20:26
_Doug"Recently, company has begun to deliver Microsoft Business Solutions (Axapta, Navision, CRM)"Oct 16 20:26
_Doughttp://www.epristart.org/epristart/partnerpool...Oct 16 20:26
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schestowitz_Doug:  brainwashed or just shill?Oct 16 20:28
_Douga bit of both and some $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$Oct 16 20:28
schestowitzWell, what about the World B0rk?Oct 16 20:29
_DougWhat does SharePoint do that can't be done in OpenSo~1Oct 16 20:29
_Doug"SharePoint sites are actually ASP.NET 2.0 applications, which are served using IIS and use a SQL Server database as data storage backend."Oct 16 20:30
schestowitzI was trying to find news about it being hacked. Look how much news about it today: http://news.google.com/news?hl=en&n...Oct 16 20:30
_DougJava + a browser + a database ..Oct 16 20:31
schestowitzSharePoint is just lockin under a new umbrella. I hear the banks in Europe have a real "hardon" (not my word) for it.Oct 16 20:31
schestowitzYes, but Java does not come from a company that knows how to Hoover money thanks to people's stupidity... you know, like those banks in search for like-minded products.Oct 16 20:32
_DougThe question is, how can you tie your whole business to a 'document solution'Oct 16 20:33
_Doughttp://www.sharepointalternative.com/Oct 16 20:33
_DougAnd you need more staff to maintain it ...Oct 16 20:34
schestowitzAnd Gartner to poiint at it.Oct 16 20:34
schestowitzIt's part of The Slog -- shaping of perception. Just look at their simultaneous attack at perceptions about Google.Oct 16 20:34
schestowitzFrom: http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uplo... Microsoft: "Ideally, use of the competing technology becomes associated with mental deficiency, as in, "he believes in Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and OS/2." Just keep rubbing it in, via the press, analysts, newsgroups, whatever. Make the complete failure of the competition's technology part of the mythology of the computer industry."Oct 16 20:35
_DougMakes *them* sound more like a cult, than an integrator of inferior software 'solutions'Oct 16 20:37
_DougWhat people seem to forget is, that any kind of latest innotative 'solution' reguires people to maintain it, even more so with the Microsoft paradigm  ..Oct 16 20:38
schestowitzWell, an EU govt. delegate compared Microsoft to Scientology. Go figure...Oct 16 20:39
_DougAt least with Scientology, we get a box with a dial ..Oct 16 20:39
schestowitzDoesn't matter. Dinner or free lunch in a nicer restaurant is more urgent a matter than long-term expenses. :-)Oct 16 20:39
_Doug?Oct 16 20:41
schestowitzChoice of SharePoint... nothing technical. Pair or sutis, dinner, brochures... at least in the financial sector, I'd imagine...Oct 16 20:42
_DougWell yea, the non-technical CIO reads about it in PCW and has a free lunch with the distributor and 'recommends' it to finance ..Oct 16 20:43
_DougThey think it'll wrest back control of the tech department from the techies .. :)Oct 16 20:43
schestowitzTalk about distraction... http://news.zdnet.com/2424-9595_22-241860.html ... well radiation ain't no itch (pun)Oct 16 20:43
schestowitzTechies like Mr. Childs?Oct 16 20:44
_DougChilds ?Oct 16 20:45
schestowitzThe anti-admin stance and the Childs case - http://weblog.infoworld.com/venezia/archives/01...Oct 16 20:45
schestowitzSan Francisco Admin Charged With Hijacking City's Network - http://blog.wired.com/27bstroke6/200...Oct 16 20:45
schestowitzTerry Childs: San Francisco's Imprisoned FiberWAN Administrator - http://news.oreilly.com/2008/07/coverag...Oct 16 20:46
_Dougahh so ..Oct 16 20:46
schestowitzAs the admin turns: San Francisco network soap opera goes on - http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/2...Oct 16 20:46
_DougWho is dumb enough to let a single admin have controll of a whole city .. if indeed we can believe them ..Oct 16 20:46
schestowitzOf course, giving sticky notes with passwords to the MBAs would make Dilbert proud and the city more secure.Oct 16 20:47
_DougMe thinks they are in a state of creative accounts losing :)Oct 16 20:47
_DougI wonder what really happened ?Oct 16 20:47
schestowitzWell.. San Francisco.. CA... 3 trillion in debt?Oct 16 20:47
_Doug"I don't believe it": Victor MeldrewOct 16 20:48
_DougDon't tell me they were using 'integrated innov~1'Oct 16 20:49
schestowitz$10.1-trillion national debt? Let's cut taxes! - http://www.latimes.com/news/local/o...Oct 16 20:49
_DougFiberWAN Administrator: what OS, what system, what security protocols .. like how can they not reset passwords, with physical access to the boxen ?Oct 16 20:50
_Dougwhat's wrong with cuting taxes, what are you a commie liberal ;)Oct 16 20:51
schestowitzLiberal?Oct 16 20:52
schestowitzPay up your taxes for the "liberation" of Iraqis.Oct 16 20:52
_DougIt's a scare word in the US of AmericaOct 16 20:52
_DougIf you're not for us then you're a liberal .. or too cerebral, like Obama :)Oct 16 20:53
_Dougdid you catch the 'debate' last night ..Oct 16 20:54
_DougMcCaine accused Obama of being to articulate :)Oct 16 20:54
schestowitzThis is stupid: http://business.pcauthority.com.au/dow...Oct 16 20:54
_DougYea, we want some dumb-ass like us in the WhiteHouse ..Oct 16 20:54
schestowitzSo Belnder is now: "Platform: Windows 2000,Windows XP,Windows Vista    Type: freeware"???Oct 16 20:54
_DougBelnder ?Oct 16 20:55
schestowitzBut it's PC AUTHORITY. Authority. Yes, they really know what they cover. GPL -> Freeware. Corss-platform -> WindowsOct 16 20:55
schestowitzBlender (ignore the typos)Oct 16 20:55
schestowitz_Doug: Terry Porter is back to COLA.Oct 16 20:56
_Dougwho and why is this importantOct 16 20:58
_Douggtg ..Oct 16 21:01
_Dougback later ..Oct 16 21:01
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schestowitz"Surprisingly, a large number of slot machines run Linux and the GNU system, using off-the-shelf PC motherboards and video cards" http://itmanagement.earthweb.com/osr...Oct 16 21:10
schestowitzHere's what I don't get. Perens is one of those people who put his full name in the headlines and he also /precedes' articles with his bio.Oct 16 21:11
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twitterSo?  No one outside of Slashdot and the UN knows who he is.Oct 16 21:20
twitterHe's not a journalist, so he has to tell you who he is the same way a M$ executive should disclose themselves.Oct 16 21:20
twitterHere's a funny, I know someone at WMS Gaming.  They are technically clueless, but they work there.Oct 16 21:21
schestowitzhttp://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-1006754... "Matt, according to the license agreement, Microsoft lawyers would not agree that Microsoft is "distributing" open source: ;-)"Oct 16 21:23
schestowitzThe weasels from Microsoft try to undercut Linux by bundling what they called "communism" and "Cancer"Oct 16 21:23
schestowitzhttp://news.bbc.co.uk/go/rss/-/1/hi/business/7673486.stm :  eBay warning of tough ChristmasOct 16 21:24
schestowitzhttp://www.schneier.com/blog/archives... - Terrorist Fear Mongering Seems to be Working Less Well  ..."BART, the San Francisco subway authority, has been debating allowing passengers to bring drinks on trains... but one reason that makes no sense is that terrorists may bring flammable liquids on board."   ... what's next for 'security'? No clothes on train?Oct 16 21:41
tessier_Macintosh share of the U.S. market tops 9%Oct 16 21:42
tessier_http://apple20.blogs.fortune.cnn.com/2008/10...Oct 16 21:42
schestowitzBased on /what/?Oct 16 21:43
schestowitzAccording to some random method that produces pretty graph?Oct 16 21:43
schestowitzGartner and IDC, I see... those that get their wage from the likes of Microsoft and typically slam Apple products. Gartner also said that GNU/Linux is run on 4% of the desktops, FWIW.Oct 16 21:45
MinceRgartner also said that winblows has a lower tco than gnu/linuxOct 16 21:45
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schestowitzWell, it was paid to say so, no?Oct 16 21:47
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/04/03...Oct 16 21:47
MinceRindeed it wasOct 16 21:48
schestowitzGartner is a Marketing Company... the economic collapse will hopefully drive these vain shills out of business.Oct 16 21:48
tessier_Ballmer Speaks, Yahoo’s Market Cap Jumps More Than $3 BillionOct 16 21:49
tessier_http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/16/ballmer-spe...Oct 16 21:49
schestowitzBallmer speaks, Hungarian man throws 3 eggsOct 16 21:51
schestowitzhttp://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=S30WdoEHCH4Oct 16 21:52
jose_x:-)Oct 16 21:52
twitter:)Oct 16 21:52
jose_xballmer was attentive.. he seemed only to have panicked mildly and recoveredOct 16 21:52
jose_xi'm sure he didn't think it was funny..Oct 16 21:52
jose_xbut we can laughOct 16 21:52
tessier_America Will Remain the SuperpowerOct 16 21:53
tessier_http://online.wsj.com/arti...Oct 16 21:53
twitterHe was actually scared.Oct 16 21:53
schestowitzHe and some other know they commit crimes.Oct 16 21:53
tessier_There's a nice positive long term view of things.Oct 16 21:53
twitterSo hopes the WSJ.Oct 16 21:53
jose_xyeah he was shaken but seemed to recoverOct 16 21:53
schestowitzThe financial fraud (alleged, then settled) is just one example.Oct 16 21:53
jose_xi would imagine bill g having fared much worseOct 16 21:53
tessier_WSJ does make a good point. Other countries seem to have it worse.Oct 16 21:53
tessier_The markets are down everywhere even more than in the US.Oct 16 21:53
schestowitzWSJ depends on the marketOct 16 21:53
schestowitzNo Wall Street = no WSJOct 16 21:54
schestowitz=the very same writers have no jobs.Oct 16 21:54
schestowitzI read the whole thing a few weeks ago... it was filled to the rim with fear.Oct 16 21:54
tessier_WSJ covers a lot more than just the physical activities that happen on wall street. As long as people are investing somewhere there will be a WSJ.Oct 16 21:54
jose_xfear ... sell sell sellOct 16 21:54
jose_xthe people's faces on pictures appear so fakeOct 16 21:55
schestowitzUnless they create something more global.Oct 16 21:55
schestowitzStill, the WSJ's expertise is the US market.Oct 16 21:55
jose_xthe traders' faces.. i wonder if that is intendedOct 16 21:55
schestowitzThis can't be good for their subscriber$$Oct 16 21:55
schestowitzThey already lose quite a bite due to the Web, IIRC.Oct 16 21:55
tessier_hmm....WaMu and other big banks were perceived as being too big to fail. Microsoft is too. I hope they are analagous.Oct 16 21:55
schestowitzThey considered making all the content free onlineOct 16 21:55
jose_xcan't you just walk onto a subway with a bunch of deadly diseases on you..Oct 16 21:56
schestowitzMicrosoft is checking WaMu for the money these days.Oct 16 21:56
schestowitzCan't trust banks anymore..Oct 16 21:56
jose_xyou might even have the cure for yourselfOct 16 21:56
jose_xand yet no coca cola allowedOct 16 21:56
jose_xwe can do outreach to potential terrorists..Oct 16 21:57
jose_xgates can serve us well hereOct 16 21:57
twitterTheir grip on Byzantine history is not so good.Oct 16 21:58
jose_xhe can distract and convince anyone of anythingOct 16 21:58
jose_xby outreach i mean to reach out to them and have them realize they have nothing to gain but.. instead can buy this great MS product and achieve nirvanaOct 16 21:59
twitterdebt?Oct 16 21:59
jose_xi think gates can convert terrorists into relatively harmless zombiesOct 16 21:59
twitterLike China?  Good luck with that.Oct 16 21:59
jose_xmr gates, are you listening? hope this message is passed on to him by the lurkers hereOct 16 22:00
*jose_x is now known as joseOct 16 22:03
josetestingOct 16 22:04
twitterOK, joseOct 16 22:05
josethanks.. that was the first time i changed nick on ircOct 16 22:05
joseone tiny step for mankind, but a leap for meOct 16 22:05
schestowitzSomeone is challenging Perens in BN.Oct 16 22:06
josewhereOct 16 22:06
schestowitzPosted minutes ago in http://boycottnovell.com/2008/10/16/apache... : "Are people supposed to take Perens' claim at face value, or are you planning to also paste a link to some sort of proof? You know, proof."Oct 16 22:06
twitterTypical troll claim.  No counter argument or references, just harassment.Oct 16 22:07
MinceRlolOct 16 22:08
twitterand confusing bullshit.Oct 16 22:10
schestowitzThe poster has no listed IP, I think.Oct 16 22:10
schestowitzBut it's not as though it came from a black hole like thrashers.Oct 16 22:11
schestowitzMaybe it's prejudiced, but I consider that a flag.Oct 16 22:11
schestowitzSUSE delays: http://news.opensuse.org/2008/10/16...Oct 16 22:11
twitterhttp://apache.slashdot.org/apache/0...Oct 16 22:11
schestowitzMore delays: http://news.opensuse.org/2008/10/...Oct 16 22:12
twitterThanks for the E17 and other embedded links today.  I pushed several of them into a Slashdot story that was actually accepted.  http://mobile.slashdot.org/article...Oct 16 22:13
schestowitzI notice that Xen (Citrix) has also just adopted LGPL for their news preview/product.Oct 16 22:13
schestowitzDoes Microsoft has special reason to be drawn into LGPL?Oct 16 22:14
twitterIt is less protective than GPL.Oct 16 22:14
schestowitzCool.Oct 16 22:15
schestowitzMany good links in one story.Oct 16 22:15
twitterhttp://www.gnu.org/licenses/why-not-lgpl.htmlOct 16 22:15
schestowitzI see noad hominem  troll comments in /.Oct 16 22:16
twitterinteresting.Oct 16 22:17
PetoKrausyes, though they went on bashing E :)Oct 16 22:17
twitteraccording to gnu, you should only use lgpl, "when a free library's features are readily available for proprietary software through other alternative libraries.  In that case, the library cannot give free software any particular advantage, so it is better to use the Lesser GPL for that library"Oct 16 22:17
schestowitzFor future reference (since I don't trust Xentric): "On Tuesday, Citrix Systems released a technology preview of Project Kensho as | open source software under the Lesser General Public License (LGPL). It is | available as a free download on the Citrix Developer Network." http://www.serverwatch.com/news/article....Oct 16 22:17
twitterLGPL looks like the next evolution in license FUD and sucker draw in.  It may take the place of BSD, etc. in their nonsense.Oct 16 22:18
schestowitzPetoKraus: because it's a yellow E, not a Blue E(R)Oct 16 22:18
PetoKraus:DOct 16 22:19
MinceRare you going to bash LGPL now?Oct 16 22:19
schestowitzMicrosoft spreads lots of GPL FUDOct 16 22:19
schestowitzThey have Word documents tossing FUD at it, mischaracterising it like they always doOct 16 22:19
twitterThe trolls are still busy with earlier posts of mine.  http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=998093...Oct 16 22:20
schestowitzMinceR: no, it's just that Xen is/was GPL and now I see their product having the "lesser" added.Oct 16 22:20
MinceRicOct 16 22:20
schestowitzI think it's mainly a Windows product.. desktop hypervisor.Oct 16 22:20
twitterand http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=99...Oct 16 22:20
schestowitzTroll/AstroTurf tactics.Oct 16 22:21
schestowitzInsult user.Oct 16 22:21
schestowitzThen mod up the insult.Oct 16 22:21
schestowitzMod down the poster.Oct 16 22:21
twitterthe usual.Oct 16 22:21
schestowitzIf the poster defends himself, mod it down quickly.Oct 16 22:21
schestowitzIf the poster accuses the others of trolling, use words like "tinfoil" and paranoid", then mod down.Oct 16 22:21
twitterthe E17 story seems to have caught them by surprise.Oct 16 22:22
schestowitzMod up comments saying  "tinfoil" and "paranoid"Oct 16 22:22
schestowitzRinse and repeatOct 16 22:22
schestowitzIf poster walks away from site, CH-Ching! please proceed to payment from SweatyB.Oct 16 22:22
schestowitzIt's like Warcraft sorcerers with mana, casting spells on one another.Oct 16 22:23
PetoKrausdoh, the computers i'd like to get are so expensiveOct 16 22:26
schestowitzWhat about those GBP3000? ;-)Oct 16 22:26
PetoKraus:) they didn't arrive yet.Oct 16 22:27
PetoKrausthough, actually, the machines i'd like to get are not made yetOct 16 22:27
PetoKrausi wanna something based on AMD PumaOct 16 22:27
schestowitzMy current main PC cost about GBP340Oct 16 22:31
PetoKrausmine is still pretty well priced, specwiseOct 16 22:31
schestowitzExcluding the Redmond tax and monitors.Oct 16 22:31
twitterIck, look what they did to this guy.  http://www.encyclopediadramatica.com/David_GerardOct 16 22:32
twittertrolls.Oct 16 22:32
schestowitzTry to avoid NVidia.Oct 16 22:32
schestowitzHe's great.Oct 16 22:32
schestowitzI hardly know him, but he reads and supports BNOct 16 22:32
PetoKrausi bought it last year - Core 2 Duo T7200, 2GB, 120GB, Dedicated Radeon X1400 for 559 with mouse and backpack - there's not much better deals on right nowOct 16 22:32
PetoKrausthe prices went up againOct 16 22:33
PetoKrausthough, the chassis is crappy - half of glasgow has it (Inspiron 6400)Oct 16 22:33
schestowitztwitter: David must really be flattered if he annoyed trolls to the point where he gets so much harassmentOct 16 22:33
twittergot there from here http://mobile.slashdot.org/comments.pl?...Oct 16 22:34
PetoKrausthough what i wanna now is not a massive performance machine, i just want something really wee - ideally something on lines of Toshiba Portege r500. Thinkpads cost craploads, toshiba costs ?1.2k, dell offers are crappy, and i don't like HP THAT muchOct 16 22:35
twitterthe real person, http://www.davidgerard.co.uk/Oct 16 22:35
schestowitzH-P are bad... they spy on journalists and try to push them flatter H-P. They are also buddies of Microsoft, Silverlight and MOOX.Oct 16 22:36
twitterM$ hates Wikipedia.  That is what they do to those who run the place.Oct 16 22:36
PetoKrausthough i'd like to get something like... http://www.cheaplaptops.org.uk/20080626...Oct 16 22:37
PetoKrausfreaking hp.Oct 16 22:37
schestowitzDavid got a good domain: today.comOct 16 22:37
schestowitztwitter: Microsoft is 'brushing up' Wikipedia now.Oct 16 22:38
schestowitzThey glorify their technology and people in it. I've seen examples and you can track IPs too. Microsoft pays for that type of stuff.Oct 16 22:38
schestowitzI've just subscribed to David's blogOct 16 22:40
twitterLooks like a clueful person.Oct 16 22:47
schestowitzYes, he comments in BN are alright. He wouldn't be smeared if he didn't make sense. Those who make fools of themselves don't need the 'help' of others in discrediting their message the ad hominem way.Oct 16 22:48
schestowitzHere is Enlightenment in a new article: http://www.linux.com/feature/150103Oct 16 22:49
josewhen did the ms godaddy deal first take place?Oct 16 23:18
schestowitz2006 I thinkOct 16 23:18
joseyes, nevermind, i found a linkOct 16 23:18
josethanks. .. i'll reply to betto soonOct 16 23:18
schestowitzThere's more.Oct 16 23:18
josefor example straight from ms land http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/press/20...Oct 16 23:19
jose"Go Daddy to transition all its parked domains from Linux to Microsoft."Oct 16 23:19
joseit doesn't get more explicit than that from the horses mouthOct 16 23:20
schestowitzYesOct 16 23:20
schestowitzPerens wasn't even sure.Oct 16 23:20
schestowitzIt was imporant for Microsoft, in a formal PR, to describe this also as a loss for Linux.Oct 16 23:20
schestowitzNot just gaming against Apache.Oct 16 23:20
*PetoKraus has quit ("The purpose of IRC is to...IDLE...")Oct 16 23:22
*PetoKraus (n=Peter@cpc4-broo2-0-0-cust1012.renf.cable.ntl.com) has joined #boycottnovellOct 16 23:23
josethe search link was this btw http://www.google.com/searc...Oct 16 23:25
josemicrosoft godaddy parked domainsOct 16 23:25
joseit shows many other articles so there may be more interesting things in thereOct 16 23:26
joseapril 2006 btwOct 16 23:26
*pombat42 has quit ("Leaving")Oct 16 23:29
schestowitzSubmitted to Slashdot under headline "GoDaddy.com Dumps Linux for Microsoft" by http://www.dixie-chicks.com/ (*NIX server)Oct 16 23:29
schestowitzIt would be interesting to go back and see how much noise Microsoft made in the media over this. Maybe an inclusion in some shiny brochure of 'case studies' too.Oct 16 23:30
schestowitzI guess only Bob Parson knows the truth about what happened.Oct 16 23:30
schestowitzhttp://www.bobparsons.tv/Wanttosuperchargeyour...Oct 16 23:31
jose>> saying that they'll provide 'a technology platform that is security-enhanced, highly scalable and easy to manage.'Oct 16 23:31
schestowitzGoDaddy head: "I give credit for this rule to Bill Gates of Microsoft. I noticed over the years that it is rare that Microsoft gets it right the first time they release any new product. However, because they never stop development on their products, eventually they get it right and eventually their products become either the best available in their particular category, or one of the best."Oct 16 23:31
MinceRrotflOct 16 23:32
josethe wording gives impression that Linux is not as secure as scalable or easy to manageOct 16 23:32
MinceRthey let drooling idiots like that lead companies?Oct 16 23:32
schestowitzWell, maybe they got $$.Oct 16 23:34
schestowitzIn$$entives.Oct 16 23:35
MinceRgnOct 16 23:38
schestowitzShit.Oct 16 23:38
schestowitzI think my GPU is bad.Oct 16 23:38
schestowitzGone semi dark for a moment.Oct 16 23:39
schestowitzStupid NVidia.Oct 16 23:39

Recent Techrights' Posts

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Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
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Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
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Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
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Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
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DebConf8: who slept with who? Rooming list leaked
Reprinted with permission from disguised.work
Bruce Perens & Debian: swiping the Open Source trademark
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Ean Schuessler & Debian SPI OSI trademark disputes
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how they go about
[Meme] The 'Cancel Culture' and Its 'Hit List'
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Chris Lamb & Debian demanded Ubuntu censor my blog
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Ean Schuessler, Branden Robinson & Debian SPI accounting crisis
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[Teaser] EPO Leaks About EPO Leaks
Yo dawg!
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Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
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Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock