Solang photo manager requires no Mono
TUX Machines, which is an excellent GNU/Linux news site, has just conducted a little survey and the results -- however inaccurate they may be -- indicate that the large majority or respondents is not in favour of putting Mono in GNU/Linux. In fact, 72% say "no" to Mono. The latest episode of Linux Outlaws deals with this subject too. Skip to 13mins for a short debate on Mono & Fedora. A lot more starts around 49mins. LinuxToday readers too are quite clearly annoyed by inclusions of Mono by default. Tony Manco points out that Ubuntu even considers leaving the GIMP out due to space constraints while totally ignoring heaps of space which Mono and Mono-based applications consume. See this page for proof:
The GIMP
* rickspencer3 proposes pulling the gimp from the CD: o It takes up a lot of space that we need for couchdb, etc... o F-Spot has key features, like crop and red-eye removal o It's a power user tool, users shouldn't stumble into it * Discussion points brought up that o The gimp currently uses 26 megs of space, 20 of which are documentation, which could be moved online o The gimp, though not totally user friendly, is very useful, and does not require "importing" to edit * The current plan of record is: o Keep the gimp in the default install o If we need the room, switch the gimp to online only documentation o If we still need the room, kick it out altogether
mononono
and a new entry highlights the fact that the Mono patent covenant is considered discriminatory. It's only good for Novell.
The patent covenant is probably to be considered discriminatory in reference to other programs.
What follow apparently means that use of covered technologies, such as Mono is to be considered unsafe (for covenant purposes) for developing parts of the software cited below.
read the patent covenant: http://www.sec.gov/Archives/edgar/...
Here is where Gnote practically steps in. Gnote is a port of Tomboy to C++. No Mono, No Novell.
Fedora feels it's something to worry about, and that's why there are plans on the table to exclude Mono from Fedora 12 -- in part due to the fact that applications that would nominally require Mono are being swapped for others that don't. A big part of it is unease about the licensing, but no small amount of unease comes from the fact that .NET itself is a Microsoft creation.
[...]
Should Fedora exclude Mono from Fedora? Sure, why not? It's their distribution; they're free to include or exclude whatever they like from it. There's nothing stopping anyone from adding it on after the fact, or creating a whole derivative distribution that adds Mono back in.
It currently runs on a up-to-date Fedora 10+ installation and Debian Sid (with Gdl patch applied).
Comments
the11thplague
2009-06-19 12:40:21
Really, Gnome lacking some of the most BASIC programs that a common user needs. Some example ? F-spot still doesn't animate gifs Network manager sucks. Until Ubuntu 9.04 it was unable to even keep an assigned IP. there is no such thing as Paint (tuxpaint is not installed by default and cannot handles only fixed size images) Yes, I like The GIMP, but I DO NOT like explaining my friends how to cut out a piece of photo.
So...The OS with the best kernel of the world won't let you do the most common tasks. WTF ?!
Tip: if you need more space in your CD, strip Evoultion out, noone uses it.
btw if you something like paint for Gnome, please tell me. I seriously need it.
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-19 12:58:46
Gwenview handles videos too.
Tuxpaint is not intended for this purpose. For vector graphics, if GIMP is not something people are used to (not the same as being "difficult"), Inkspace, Xara and Krita are worth a shot. I mean, come on. You're not claiming GNU/Linux suffers for not having paint.exe, right?
Is it so much easier in other programs? And if so, why? Habits acquired in schools that Adobe et al exploit for training?
What do Windows and OS X have (by default) that puts them ahead? Paint.exe? Windows Explorer (for photo management)? OS X is not much better off, either.
the11thplague
2009-06-19 21:21:51
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-19 21:26:50
the11thplague
2009-06-20 05:39:45
NotZed
2009-06-19 15:30:49
The problem with a project like GNOME is that it's only as strong as the people willing to contribute to it. As with many projects, people are pushed away because of politics and non-technical issues and that just hurts the entire effort. You end up with an 'in-crowed' 'cabal' who make all of the meaningful decisions, who have commercial and political interests calling the shots. This is never very healthy.
I must say however, that after having recently tried KDE ... GNOME is still the only valid choice for any 'desktop' . Although personally I simply use a simple window manager with a manually configurable menu, and an xterm to run everything (else) I (ever) need. KDE is really ... (surprisingly) awful. It's worse than Microsoft Windows XP.
Although I no longer have (or wish) anything to do with it, I am a little sad that Evolution is no longer considered a valid email program by some people. I spent 6 years of my life 'that i'll never get back' trying in vain to make it a competent and useful product, and in as much as possible (without getting fired, although i came close a few times) attempting to focus on performance and reliability over features or anything else. I was never happy that it was turned from being a 'good email programme' to being merely 'a clone of microsoft outlook' - you should've seen some of the code we had to dump because cloning outlook's way of doing things was just rubbish. Unfortunately the 'boss' made the final decisions in the end, and we were too busy on top of that simply working around bugs in other (server) software to `go to the next leve'l (amongst other issues). Still, when I left it, it still did some stuff better than any desktop client i've ever encountered did (before, that is - i've only used an online service since), But I haven't used it once since, and have heard some things haven't been changed for the better. Anyway, I'm still pretty confident there is some following for it, and i'm pretty certain there are few if any alternatives in the same sphere even now.
PS 'eet' ... you're awesome, I haven't laughed so hard in ages. Who ever said you Germans didn't have such a great sense of humour was sadly mistaken!
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-19 15:37:08
max stirner
2009-06-19 16:41:13
the11thplague
2009-06-19 21:25:37
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-19 21:29:32
eet
2009-06-19 13:25:21
Mono will never get into Linux because Linux is the kernel, you dumbos! :p
Needs Sunlight
2009-06-19 13:51:22
eet
2009-06-19 13:59:52
In that case, you are beyond help.
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-19 14:09:30
"Brian Goldfarb of Microsoft said in part: "it is not limited just to Novell as Mono is."
"This tells us everything. It says quite clearly that Microsoft does see Mono as infringing their patents and that the covenant between MS and Novell gives Novell's users exclusive protection for using Mono specifically.
"Now what we have long known is clear to see for everyone.
"Mono is a potential MS target and after 4 years not even Novell or their users are immune.
"Now who can question the wisdom of steering clear of all things Miguel/Novell?"
http://talkback.zdnet.com/5208-10535-0.html?forumID=1&threadID=47762&messageID=890012
eet
2009-06-19 14:22:52
WHO is Mr Goldfarb and what does he do of Microsoft? I never heard of him.
HOW does what you link relate? It's just an odd comment to a derogatory article by the notorious hater Ms. Blankenzorn. And Ms B. doesn't mention a Mr Goldfarb...
So, this is pure fantasy. And even if it wasn't, I don't give a shit about what Mr Goldfarb thinks - or Microsoft, for that matter...
eet
2009-06-19 14:27:00
Blankenhorn: "Straw man argument. I never said, or implied, that the use of Moonlight was limited to Novell distributions of Linux."
How come you didn't see that, Roy? Because you DON'T CARE whether a claim against Novell is true, as long as it is against Novell. Lousy (no) research, as usual...
You are quoting shit, as always.
John Hunt
2009-06-21 23:44:08
Mono has improved the linux desktop by allowing more programmers to write programs for linux. Nevermind if f-spot is any good etc..
By removing mono, choice is being removed. If you don't like mono, just un-install it or use a different distribution. Choice is what makes linux great. Don't remove it.
Oh, and also, Banshee fucking rules and beats all other music players on Linux.
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-22 00:03:22
Honest Injin
2009-06-22 00:17:31
(I know Gnome/KDE, but ya did say "beats all other music players on Linux."
(asking honestly, maybe you can convert me... ;^ )
saulgoode
2009-06-19 16:28:11
eet
2009-06-19 18:06:30
Well, now serious, he'll have to be an important man! (Not some troll who is trying to make himself interesting and stirr things up a bit).
Oh, boy! You are naive...
saulgoode
2009-06-19 18:29:55
eet
2009-06-19 18:48:06
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-19 18:57:50
lachlan
2009-06-22 00:51:31
Shane Coyle
2009-06-22 00:58:38
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-22 01:00:24
Shane Coyle
2009-06-22 01:07:01
((FF 3.0.11, Slax 6.1.1 heavily hacked))
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-22 01:19:12
Is there a hack for avoiding this (it's an iframe)?
Shane Coyle
2009-06-22 01:37:11
Konq 4.2.4 works as expected, right to the comment, as does Opera 9.64 (my same Slax-6.1.1 based KDE4 computer).
Anyone else experiencing this on Firefox? Could you list version as well (specifically, anyone using 3.5???)
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-22 01:41:34
David "Lefty" Schlesinger
2009-06-22 05:35:54
Penguin Pete
2009-06-24 20:37:36
The way Microsoft tries to shoot down Linux pales in comparison to how legions of Adobe zealots try to shoot down the Gimp. Let F-Spot take the heat for a while!
Good, F-Spot can be the new target for all the Adobe fanaticism. And don't forget! It must be an exact, pixel-perfect clone of Photoshop down to the logo, or else it is the greatest evil in history including the Holocaust, just like the Phtotrolls claim about Gimp now.
Finally! People will pick on some other program and leave those of us who appreciate the Gimp as being the greatest image editing application ever made, completely perfect and needing nothing changed, to use it in peace.
Roy Schestowitz
2009-06-24 20:45:34