| PetoKraus | umm | Dec 08 00:02 |
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| PetoKraus | so i submitted iwf.org.uk to iwf.org.uk for offending content | Dec 08 00:02 |
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| PetoKraus | that huge red button is CLEARLY ripoff goatse! | Dec 08 00:03 |
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| schestowitz | British Government Violates Copyright < http://slated.org/british_governme... > | Dec 08 00:04 |
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| schestowitz | Yes, I know you can't read it... | Dec 08 00:04 |
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| PetoKraus | was that the one with the wordpress theme? | Dec 08 00:04 |
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| schestowitz | Yes. There's also this: US presidential candidate is a pirate < http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer... > | Dec 08 00:04 |
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| schestowitz | End of the Blog < http://williampatry.blogspot.com/2008/... > | Dec 08 00:05 |
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| schestowitz | BT and Phorm is not all... BT to cut off file-sharing customers < http://www.linuxworld.com.au/index.php?id=14341... > | Dec 08 00:05 |
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| schestowitz | /WHAT/ files? | Dec 08 00:05 |
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| schestowitz | That's what Web servers do... they share files | Dec 08 00:06 |
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| MinceR | gn | Dec 08 00:07 |
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| PetoKraus | it's like the priceless question i was asked once by VM tech support: | Dec 08 00:08 |
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| PetoKraus | "do you use software to download data from the internet?" | Dec 08 00:08 |
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| PetoKraus | no, i fucking type down ones and zeroes! | Dec 08 00:08 |
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| PetoKraus | Great day today | Dec 08 00:11 |
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| PetoKraus | duh, wrong button | Dec 08 00:13 |
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| schestowitz | Downloading the Internet | Dec 08 00:13 |
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| schestowitz | teh internets | Dec 08 00:13 |
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| PetoKraus | yeah, the tubes | Dec 08 00:14 |
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| schestowitz | interwebs. | Dec 08 00:31 |
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| PetoKraus | right, i've added ping monitor to my gkrellm now | Dec 08 00:33 |
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| GoblinRFD | Im off to bed...up early in the morning...take care all... | Dec 08 00:58 |
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| twitter | I've decided that copyright should be abolished. | Dec 08 01:29 |
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| schestowitz | For everything? | Dec 08 01:30 |
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| twitter | everything | Dec 08 01:30 |
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| twitter | I've used copyleft software for the better part of a decade. | Dec 08 01:30 |
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| twitter | Wikipedia and other free information sources now take care of everything I need. | Dec 08 01:30 |
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| twitter | I don't see a real use for copyright anymore. | Dec 08 01:31 |
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| twitter | People want to share and they will. | Dec 08 01:31 |
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| twitter | Copyright only makes barriers to that sharing. | Dec 08 01:32 |
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| twitter | If it were not for those barriers, P2P would create the world's best public library at next to no cost to society. | Dec 08 01:33 |
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| twitter | Every piece of information and entertainment would be available for everyone. | Dec 08 01:33 |
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| twitter | This is too great a prize to sacrifice for the very few people who will be discouraged from creating works. | Dec 08 01:35 |
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| twitter | The only thing that gives me pause is news, but even there people will find a way to produce things, like The Guardian does. | Dec 08 01:36 |
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| schestowitz | What about books that people want to stay unique? | Dec 08 01:38 |
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| schestowitz | Copyright will probably topple itself anyway. | Dec 08 01:39 |
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| twitter | I don't understand what you mean by a book that stays unique. | Dec 08 01:39 |
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| schestowitz | People prefer PDFs/ODFs they can download quickly. Some people still love the smell of books and few will go through a debit card page. | Dec 08 01:39 |
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| schestowitz | COpyright is seen as needed by the unwashed messes, so to speak | Dec 08 01:40 |
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| schestowitz | People are taught not to share | Dec 08 01:40 |
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| twitter | brainwash | Dec 08 01:40 |
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| schestowitz | They are told that they will make money this way | Dec 08 01:40 |
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| twitter | people share all the time. | Dec 08 01:40 |
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| schestowitz | No, I didn't mean brainwash in this case | Dec 08 01:40 |
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| schestowitz | But there's no scarcity anymore | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| twitter | people need to be shown that prize | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| schestowitz | No share, no business. | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| twitter | who's business? | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| schestowitz | Proprietary software companies learn this the hard way now. | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| twitter | they are the worst offenders | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| schestowitz | People would rather download Drupal in 5 minutes than buy a licence from some blob and be locked in to one vendor | Dec 08 01:41 |
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| twitter | everyone would rather have everything | Dec 08 01:42 |
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| twitter | Napster proved it. | Dec 08 01:42 |
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| twitter | and the music industry flourished while Napster was alive | Dec 08 01:43 |
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| twitter | Other things, like scientific journals, should be easier to come by than Prince songs. | Dec 08 01:43 |
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| schestowitz | They are funded by tax | Dec 08 01:46 |
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| schestowitz | This is an absurdity | Dec 08 01:46 |
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| schestowitz | Those who fund the research have no access to the outcome | Dec 08 01:46 |
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| schestowitz | The Land of "Nothing for free" < http://samba.org/samba/news/artic... > | Dec 08 01:48 |
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| schestowitz | Push for open access to research < http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/techno... > | Dec 08 01:48 |
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| twitter | A few things will have to be forbidden still, but they are not so much a matter of copyright as matter of privacy. | Dec 08 01:48 |
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| twitter | For instance, it would be wrong for people to claim you endorse something you don't. Your works should not be used for the advertising if you don't want because it's fraud. | Dec 08 01:49 |
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| twitter | Your image, is much the same, but that's more privacy. | Dec 08 01:49 |
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| twitter | bbl, babies and the wife are crying. | Dec 08 01:50 |
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| twitter | ooooohhhhhh, no peace. | Dec 08 01:54 |
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| schestowitz | What's wrong? | Dec 08 01:55 |
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| twitter | just screaming babies. | Dec 08 01:55 |
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| schestowitz | It sounds like you have more important duties there. | Dec 08 01:55 |
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| twitter | things were taken care of as best as they could be :) | Dec 08 01:56 |
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| schestowitz | Why is the wife crying? | Dec 08 02:02 |
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| twitter | The wife was not really crying, just frustrated. | Dec 08 02:03 |
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| schestowitz | Oh, *that* kind of crying. | Dec 08 02:03 |
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| twitter | all is calm now. | Dec 08 02:03 |
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| schestowitz | For "Crying out loud" | Dec 08 02:03 |
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| twitter | We'll do the other kind if I don't find good work in the next month or two. | Dec 08 02:04 |
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| twitter | from "low point" " "These guys say they're going to cure cancer, what are you going to do for us ?" is the request that anti-software patent lobbyists have to learn to counter" | Dec 08 02:04 |
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| twitter | They are not curing cancer, they are inhibiting knowledge which puts harms treatment today and puts cures off further. | Dec 08 02:05 |
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| schestowitz | Yes, for self gain. | Dec 08 02:06 |
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| twitter | He's talking about patents, which I still have some grudging, theoretical respect for. | Dec 08 02:06 |
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| twitter | Not business method or software patents though, those make me see red. | Dec 08 02:06 |
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| twitter | Others have seen red over more legitimate patents and shown they are harming medicine and healthcare. | Dec 08 02:07 |
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| schestowitz | Research funds can come from tax | Dec 08 02:09 |
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| schestowitz | Then, knowledge can be pushed into a pool. | Dec 08 02:09 |
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| schestowitz | When professors make inventions while on tax money, the patents are assigned to the academic institute, AFAIK. | Dec 08 02:09 |
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| schestowitz | Maybe it's partial ownership | Dec 08 02:09 |
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| schestowitz | Industrial knowledge should work in the same way | Dec 08 02:09 |
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| twitter | It depends on the institution. | Dec 08 02:09 |
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| schestowitz | BillG and Co are snapping university patents to troll with right now (extortion) | Dec 08 02:10 |
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| schestowitz | In India for example. | Dec 08 02:10 |
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| twitter | Rogallo had his nifty wing ideas when working at NASA, he assigned them public domain because he wanted to but NASA considered the ideas his. | Dec 08 02:11 |
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| twitter | IV is going everywhere, bribing a few big U to screw the rest. Very evil. | Dec 08 02:11 |
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| schestowitz | They should be arrested | Dec 08 02:12 |
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| twitter | Stallman is right to worry about patents being used to defeat freely available knowledge. | Dec 08 02:12 |
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| schestowitz | Not in land of the fee though. | Dec 08 02:12 |
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| schestowitz | It loves corrupt people that loot other nations. | Dec 08 02:13 |
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| twitter | Yeah but BillG's loot of China is not going very well. People in Washington might realize they've been taken for a ride. | Dec 08 02:15 |
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| schestowitz | Mr. Bean makes a move: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/07/embra... | Dec 08 02:20 |
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| schestowitz | I was just about to write about Microsoft's latest WA corruption. | Dec 08 02:20 |
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| schestowitz | DC that is, not state | Dec 08 02:21 |
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| schestowitz | But I'm getting tired. | Dec 08 02:21 |
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| schestowitz | 2:30AM | Dec 08 02:21 |
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| twitter | night night | Dec 08 02:42 |
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| schestowitz | Cya tomorrow. I'm doing one last post | Dec 08 02:42 |
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| twitter | cool | Dec 08 02:42 |
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| kentma | mornin' | Dec 08 08:20 |
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| MinceR | j0 | Dec 08 08:45 |
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| schestowitz | Hey | Dec 08 09:16 |
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| kapipi | morning | Dec 08 09:24 |
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| schestowitz | What's new today? | Dec 08 09:27 |
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| kentma | dunno... I was reflecting on the German Gov electing ODF... that's a massive step. | Dec 08 09:44 |
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| schestowitz | They join many more. | Dec 08 09:45 |
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| schestowitz | OOXML was called "death format walking". They have nothing but marketing going. | Dec 08 09:45 |
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| kentma | yes, but German Gov is 4th or 5th largest economy in the world, UK is just behind... this is a *huge* decision... | Dec 08 09:48 |
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| kentma | oh - and the announcement of ARM and Ubuntu collaborating for a desktop computer is the first sign of the "death of the IBM PC"... killed by the mobility world. | Dec 08 09:49 |
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| kentma | It'll be a huge blow for AMD and Intel. | Dec 08 09:49 |
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| kentma | Very interesting news is that eBay have finally realised that skype is worthless, so they're going to float it (ie., stop funding it). | Dec 08 09:50 |
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| kentma | calls from skype to PSTN are very expensive anyway - it's cheaper to use your land line. | Dec 08 09:50 |
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| schestowitz | How much will ARM devices cost? | Dec 08 09:52 |
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| schestowitz | Weirdly, I think Maplin already has them. | Dec 08 09:52 |
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| kentma | They're not all that expensive now - otherwise they wouldn't be in all those phones... | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| kentma | and satnavs | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| kentma | and pdas | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| kentma | the netbook is the clear next step. | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| schestowitz | re: Skype, you must be biased | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| schestowitz | The Telcos would love to see Skype going away | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| kentma | eh? no, it's just the costs. skype off-net is extremely expensive. | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| kentma | Just look at the numbers. | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| schestowitz | But people will always find some voice P2P service... it's inevitable. | Dec 08 09:53 |
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| kentma | Of course, but there's no money in it... | Dec 08 09:54 |
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| schestowitz | People are connected a lot of the time. | Dec 08 09:54 |
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| schestowitz | So landlines can become irrelevant. | Dec 08 09:55 |
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| kentma | how will people connect without a landline? they can connect wirelessly, of course, but how do you know where they are? | Dec 08 09:55 |
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| kentma | Mobile networks use the imsei number to track people. | Dec 08 09:55 |
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| schestowitz | Yes, I know. | Dec 08 09:57 |
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| schestowitz | That's one of the reasons I don't use them. | Dec 08 09:57 |
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| schestowitz | The main ones being other considerations. | Dec 08 09:57 |
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| kentma | okay, but the infrastructure cost of being able to track people is very high indeed, and if you don't do it, people cannot be contacted. | Dec 08 09:58 |
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| schestowitz | For authorities, there's lots to like about cellphones. | Dec 08 09:58 |
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| kentma | imagine a position where everyone can only make outbound calls - the whole thing breaks down at that point. | Dec 08 09:58 |
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| schestowitz | Human kind survived for hundreds of thousands of years without being contacted remotely. | Dec 08 09:58 |
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| kentma | yeah, legal intercept laws are so thorough, though, that tracking mobiles is just one tiny bit. all your paper mail can be opened, all your phone calls listened to. | Dec 08 09:58 |
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| schestowitz | Paper mail? | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| kentma | yes | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| kentma | all your paper mail. | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| schestowitz | I'm joking. Well, people can search garbage too | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| schestowitz | They do | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| schestowitz | Who uses paper mail? | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| schestowitz | All I get there is junk. | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| kentma | bills, bank account details, etc. | Dec 08 09:59 |
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| schestowitz | I'd say "open my mail.. and keep it" :-D | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| kentma | my point is that HMG can track every aspect of your life if they choose to. | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| kentma | hehe :-) | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| schestowitz | I stopped bank statements like 6 years ago. | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| schestowitz | Which was hard because they were used to people requiring it. | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| kentma | anyway, back to the story, eBay have realised that skype is worthless, so they're floating it off. They got stung for a few €£billion, though. | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| schestowitz | Waste of paper and extra labour for Mr Postman. | Dec 08 10:00 |
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| schestowitz | You could argue that by not giving redundant work you actually harm postmen (and women) | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| kentma | I'm about 50% electronic at the moment, but preferring to get more so. | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| schestowitz | kentma: I heard about people who were in the MI5 | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| kentma | ah, no, post has never been in better shape - all that online purchasing :-) | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| schestowitz | But you can limit what they get | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| schestowitz | I was under surveillance in 2006 | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| schestowitz | By the network admin. | Dec 08 10:01 |
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| kentma | ah, yes, you said. | Dec 08 10:02 |
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| schestowitz | They only told me afterwards. | Dec 08 10:02 |
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| kentma | has that all stopped now? | Dec 08 10:02 |
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| schestowitz | I don't know. | Dec 08 10:02 |
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| kentma | did you ever find the real driver? | Dec 08 10:02 |
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| schestowitz | Post!=Fedex | Dec 08 10:02 |
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| kentma | parcel force == royal mail, though. | Dec 08 10:03 |
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| schestowitz | kentma: reason was the Munchkins | Dec 08 10:03 |
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| kentma | Ah, nasty people, aren't they? Still, the new arrangement seems to work. | Dec 08 10:03 |
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| schestowitz | That too will suffer | Dec 08 10:03 |
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| schestowitz | With the Depression and all...... | Dec 08 10:03 |
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| schestowitz | Yes | Dec 08 10:03 |
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| schestowitz | No signs of harassment of this kind since. | Dec 08 10:04 |
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| kentma | Sorry - what will suffer? | Dec 08 10:04 |
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| schestowitz | The post | Dec 08 10:05 |
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| schestowitz | Eveyrthing will | Dec 08 10:05 |
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| schestowitz | I could think of only one exception: public transportation. | Dec 08 10:05 |
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| kentma | ah, I think we'll see that post will increase, as people buy more things online, because it's less expensive. | Dec 08 10:05 |
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| kentma | skype story here from earlier in the year: http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/04... | Dec 08 10:06 |
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| schestowitz | A friend's parents work at the rail station, so they see rise in business, so to speak. They are understaffed. | Dec 08 10:06 |
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| schestowitz | You're assuming that people will still buy | Dec 08 10:06 |
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| schestowitz | This was also an odd purchase... eBay and VoIP | Dec 08 10:07 |
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| kentma | skype was a brilliant con... there never was any money in it. | Dec 08 10:07 |
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| schestowitz | http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archive... | Dec 08 10:07 |
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| kentma | My school is doing well out of the recession, as people take their kids out of public schools. | Dec 08 10:07 |
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| schestowitz | To private? | Dec 08 10:08 |
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| kentma | no, my school is a state school. | Dec 08 10:09 |
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| kentma | http://www.techcrunch.com/2008/10/15/as-ebays-c... | Dec 08 10:09 |
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| kentma | public school == fee paying school (anyone can go) | Dec 08 10:09 |
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| kentma | state school == british/EU citizens only | Dec 08 10:09 |
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| kentma | grammar school == british/EU citizens who've passed the 11+ | Dec 08 10:10 |
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| kentma | catholic school == british/EU who pass the religiousness test | Dec 08 10:10 |
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| kentma | etc. | Dec 08 10:10 |
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| schestowitz | It impacts college too. | Dec 08 10:11 |
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| schestowitz | I can't imagine student loans going on the cheap | Dec 08 10:11 |
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| kentma | I'm sure the universities are getting worried. | Dec 08 10:11 |
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| schestowitz | .It can't be good for research funds. | Dec 08 10:11 |
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| kentma | They might have to focus on getting british/eu students rather than oseas ones. | Dec 08 10:11 |
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| schestowitz | I have some prof friends who are furious | Dec 08 10:11 |
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| kentma | I'm not surprised... things are tough. HMG should look at pushing more money into universities - better to have people studying than unemployed. | Dec 08 10:12 |
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| schestowitz | Good point | Dec 08 10:13 |
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| schestowitz | I thought the opposite though. | Dec 08 10:13 |
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| schestowitz | Research is luxury. | Dec 08 10:13 |
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| schestowitz | I can't imagine many funds being available. | Dec 08 10:14 |
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| kentma | Agreed, but consider that social security/unemployment benefits are also luxury... | Dec 08 10:14 |
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| kentma | If you're going to pay people to do nothing, better to pay them to study, I think. | Dec 08 10:15 |
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| schestowitz | Yes, I see your point | Dec 08 10:16 |
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| schestowitz | Based on history, other options are making war | Dec 08 10:16 |
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| kentma | war is a really expensive play, though, and the public in general don't have the apetite they used to for it. | Dec 08 10:16 |
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| schestowitz | Well, it's a bad time to be a student like my brother. | Dec 08 10:18 |
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| kentma | oh - where is he and what's his principle? | Dec 08 10:19 |
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| schestowitz | The "war" thing is a worst case scenario | Dec 08 10:19 |
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| schestowitz | WW2 came about like 5+ years after the depression began, I think. | Dec 08 10:19 |
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| schestowitz | His principal is computer science. | Dec 08 10:19 |
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| kentma | yeah, but wwII was also about the final collapse of the old european power structures, including the British Empire, plus the Japanese empire and the US empire. The rise of the "common man", the collapse of aristocracies, a move to social justice, state healthcare and education, in fact, loads of massive change. | Dec 08 10:22 |
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| kentma | I think that was one of the best positive outcomes of wwii, although one cannot neglect the intense misery for millions upon millions of people, of course. | Dec 08 10:24 |
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| schestowitz | I hear it's rough in the US though. | Dec 08 10:25 |
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| kentma | Yes, it's very bad, I hear, too. | Dec 08 10:25 |
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| schestowitz | People I know (friends and family) lose a huge proportion of what they have). | Dec 08 10:25 |
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| kentma | If they had money in shares or in banks, then there are problems, and that's about 95% of people... | Dec 08 10:26 |
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| schestowitz | Yes, even housewives had shared | Dec 08 10:26 |
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| schestowitz | Everyone saw the casino making good returns | Dec 08 10:27 |
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| kentma | yeah... a saying from my Yorkshire youth "poor people should invest in gold and land". | Dec 08 10:27 |
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| schestowitz | Bonds too.... lots of things tied to one-trick ponies like Citigroup | Dec 08 10:27 |
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| kentma | yes... risky stufff... | Dec 08 10:50 |
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| schestowitz | Everyone pays for it (Citigroup) now. | Dec 08 10:52 |
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| schestowitz | Bailout.. | Dec 08 10:52 |
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| kentma | It's very annoying that a few people have lined their pockets with €£millions, are now lounging around in hotels in the caribean, whilst the rest of us bail out the banking system so that they can return in 3 or 4 years and to it again. | Dec 08 11:04 |
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| kentma | Further, we should never have permitted de-mutualisation of bld socs, and never have allowed banks to offer mortgages, and never allowed retail banks to get into commercial banking, and so on. | Dec 08 11:05 |
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| schestowitz | Is this not a swing or power shift? Won't the east rise soon? | Dec 08 11:07 |
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| trmanco | http://icculus.org/prey/ Prey Linux Retail Client Released "An so it starts. Games are now being ported to Linux and MS loses it's strangle hold on the gaming market" | Dec 08 11:20 |
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| schestowitz | Where is the quote from? | Dec 08 11:21 |
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| trmanco | digg | Dec 08 11:21 |
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| trmanco | http://digg.com/linux_unix/Prey_Lin... | Dec 08 11:22 |
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| schestowitz | I thought it would be odd for Icculus to say that. | Dec 08 11:24 |
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| trmanco | Where will Linux be in ten years time?: http://it.toolbox.com/blogs/locutus/wh... | Dec 08 11:25 |
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| schestowitz | Proposal for More Waste to Energy Plants in the UK < http://technocrat.net/d/2008/12/7/55287 > | Dec 08 11:26 |
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| schestowitz | 10 years is too much for predications | Dec 08 11:26 |
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| schestowitz | And there will be greater issues than Free software. | Dec 08 11:26 |
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| schestowitz | Freedom of information for example. What good is a free tool if it can't pass information freely? | Dec 08 11:27 |
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| *MinceR_ is now known as MinceR | Dec 08 11:35 |
| trmanco | dang | Dec 08 11:43 |
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| trmanco | why can't SQL statements be all the same in all the RDBMS's | Dec 08 11:44 |
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| trmanco | :| | Dec 08 11:44 |
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| schestowitz | You can use abstraction layers. | Dec 08 11:53 |
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| trmanco | I'm still a newbie :| | Dec 08 11:57 |
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| trmanco | and I don't know what abstraction layers are :| | Dec 08 11:58 |
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| schestowitz | ..Can't believe some people /still/ defend lobbying, aka legalised bribery: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/08/ms-lob... | Dec 08 12:43 |
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| schestowitz | Omissions of disclosures are only the tip of the iceberg. How quickly people forget that Novell to is paid handsomely by Microsoft, so it's only expected to advance Microsoft's agenda. | Dec 08 12:46 |
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| schestowitz | " Many Americans were misled into signing mortgages which they now cannot pay. This isn't the first time. The wave of farm foreclosures under Reagan, which wiped out the US institution of the family farm, victimized farmers who had followed government and institutional advice to take out loans." < http://www.stallman.org/archives/2008-sep-d... > | Dec 08 12:55 |
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| schestowitz | CPJ's 2008 prison census: Online and in jail < http://www.cpj.org/imprisoned/cpjs-2008-... > | Dec 08 12:57 |
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| schestowitz | Petition for free Net in Aussie: http://www.getup.org.au/campaign/... | Dec 08 12:59 |
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| schestowitz | "Sad to say, this means that Bush's cronies have more or less won their war to privatize and loot Iraq, oil and all. They are likely to control the economy as long as the government in Baghdad is a puppet that "needs" the Bush forces to stay in power." < http://www.stallman.org/archives/2008-sep-de... > Are Key Obama Advisors in Tune with Neocon Hawks Who Want to Attack Iran? | Dec 08 13:01 |
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| schestowitz | < http://www.alternet.org/story/109572/ > | Dec 08 13:01 |
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| PetoKraus | i've got reply from Be sales team | Dec 08 13:18 |
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| PetoKraus | they swear there's "no traffic throttling nor capping, nevertheless there is content filtering employed." | Dec 08 13:18 |
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| schestowitz | What content? | Dec 08 13:20 |
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| PetoKraus | no idea | Dec 08 13:20 |
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| schestowitz | Content is a bad word | Dec 08 13:20 |
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| schestowitz | It turns information into something that's just bits and bytes to underplay it. We didn't censor information, we just 'managed' content. | Dec 08 13:21 |
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| schestowitz | Our friend Obama seems to be making friends with 'friends'.... http://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/08/ms-l... ... Microsoft is no friend of net neutrality. | Dec 08 13:21 |
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| schestowitz | Intellectual monopolies, censorship, DRM... Microsoft sees that type of stuff as the future, but it's not alone. Nokia is looking for journalists' luv this week. Based on experience, they blend it with DRM and software patents. Choose Linux, not Symbian. | Dec 08 13:23 |
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| schestowitz | And problems other than culture and information show no signs of abatement, either. Brazil announces plan to slash rainforest destruction < http://www.guardian.co.uk/environmen... > | Dec 08 13:23 |
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| Eruaran | hello | Dec 08 13:25 |
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| schestowitz | Hey | Dec 08 13:25 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.getup.org.au/campaig... | Dec 08 13:25 |
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| Eruaran | I joined GetUp's campaign | Dec 08 13:35 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.computerworld.com.au/article/269615/ant... "Opponents to the government's Internet content filtering scheme will take to the streets in a series of protests planned in Australia's capital cities." | Dec 08 13:36 |
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| Eruaran | Already characterizing protesters as "rebels" ? | Dec 08 13:37 |
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| schestowitz | Where? | Dec 08 13:39 |
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| schestowitz | Rebels is code word for people who resist iron fist abuse. It's right next to "terrorist" and worse than "activists" | Dec 08 13:40 |
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| Eruaran | "Anti Internet filtering rebels hit the streets" | Dec 08 13:41 |
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| schestowitz | Idiotic writer than. Wait until they call these rebels terror sympathisers or pedophiles. That always works. | Dec 08 13:41 |
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| Eruaran | I always notice the subtle use of words | Dec 08 13:41 |
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| schestowitz | "Pirates" | Dec 08 13:42 |
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| Eruaran | Not protesters, "rebels" | Dec 08 13:42 |
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| Eruaran | Notice its not called internet censorship its called "internet filtering" | Dec 08 13:42 |
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| schestowitz | Does the dictionary already have an entry for "pirate" that says "copyrights infringer"? http://boycottnovell.com/2008/12/08... | Dec 08 13:42 |
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| schestowitz | Same thing. | Dec 08 13:43 |
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| schestowitz | Sharing -> stealing | Dec 08 13:43 |
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| schestowitz | Opposition -> Rebellion | Dec 08 13:43 |
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| schestowitz | "Value your freedom or you will lose it, teaches history. "Don't bother us with politics," respond those who don't want to learn." --Richard Stallman | Dec 08 13:44 |
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| Eruaran | China's censorship has resulted in a generation not knowing about the Tiananmen Square protests and massacare. | Dec 08 13:44 |
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| schestowitz | Or arrested for finding out. | Dec 08 13:45 |
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| Eruaran | I saw a documentary on tv that highlighted the tragedy | Dec 08 13:45 |
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| schestowitz | Stealing is when someone loses something. If I pass my book to a sibling, I don't steal from the author. I just share what's already in existence. In digital terms, there's free duplication. | Dec 08 13:45 |
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| schestowitz | Words matter | Dec 08 13:46 |
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| schestowitz | "If thought can corrupt language, then language can also corrupt thought." --George Orwell | Dec 08 13:46 |
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| Eruaran | A journalist showed the famous picture of the "tank man" standing in front of a Chinese tank... they had no idea what it was. They asked if it was part of a parade. | Dec 08 13:46 |
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| schestowitz | That's why people call the Iraq situation and invasion and practice repetition of it. Another word is occupation. | Dec 08 13:46 |
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| Eruaran | Chinese students today have no idea what that picture represents... Students from the very same university that was at the center of the protests. | Dec 08 13:47 |
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| Eruaran | If you can control the information, you can control history... | Dec 08 13:48 |
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| schestowitz | Yes, of course. | Dec 08 13:48 |
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| schestowitz | But it's not just in China. | Dec 08 13:48 |
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| schestowitz | There are records everywhere going missing or omitted from literature. | Dec 08 13:48 |
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| Eruaran | Just an example which highlights the tragedy | Dec 08 13:48 |
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| schestowitz | Some day in the future the Iraq invasion can be described like the "war" in Vietnam though control of pedagogues. | Dec 08 13:49 |
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| schestowitz | Then you make some nice films like Good Morning VIetnam | Dec 08 13:49 |
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| schestowitz | Or Pocahontas. People love film and remember them... kids especially (early experiences) | Dec 08 13:49 |
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| Eruaran | When you have a moment in your country's history that was less than 20 years ago, and you're growing up in an environment where you'll never know anything about it... that is disturbing. | Dec 08 13:49 |
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| schestowitz | That's normal | Dec 08 13:50 |
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| schestowitz | But what level of access does one get to info? | Dec 08 13:50 |
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| schestowitz | The issue arises when Internet censorship, for instance, is being introduced. | Dec 08 13:50 |
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| Eruaran | yes | Dec 08 13:50 |
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| schestowitz | The big media doesn't threaten voices. | Dec 08 13:51 |
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| schestowitz | It just ignored them... as in "first they ignore you" (not giving attention if not giving 'bad advertising', which is an oxymoron) | Dec 08 13:51 |
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| schestowitz | /if/is/ | Dec 08 13:52 |
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| schestowitz | *LOL* David taketh the pith... http://notnews.today.com/2008/12/07/uk-ci... (watch picture) | Dec 08 13:52 |
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| schestowitz | The picture also appears here: http://notnews.today.com/2008/12/05/i... | Dec 08 13:55 |
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| schestowitz | More US army brainwash in video games (this time it's not glamorisation of war for a change): http://www.pcworld.com/article/155097/a... | Dec 08 13:58 |
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| schestowitz | "Microsoft Corp. will deliver eight security updates next week, six of them marked "critical,"" Not to worry... just total hijack of the PCs is possible for a while longer.. pray while waiting... http://www.pcworld.com/article/155083/m... | Dec 08 14:00 |
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| Eruaran | more work for us... | Dec 08 14:01 |
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| Eruaran | Maybe I should start a movement for a court case against Microsoft | Dec 08 14:02 |
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| Eruaran | On the basis of criminal negligence | Dec 08 14:02 |
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| schestowitz | That gets pricy. Microsoft is a marketing/law firm. | Dec 08 14:02 |
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| schestowitz | pricey | Dec 08 14:02 |
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| schestowitz | Since the early days Microsoft has stolen people's technology. Then it got busy erasing the past | Dec 08 14:02 |
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| Eruaran | They've had many years to turn Windows into a resonably secure operating system... to do the things we all know must be done in order to have an operating system that is resonably secure. | Dec 08 14:03 |
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| Eruaran | So, we should all sue. | Dec 08 14:03 |
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| schestowitz | Obama Outlines Plan to Put Every Child Online < http://www.pcworld.com/article/15510... > Easy PEASY. Get all those machines the US dumps on Africa to keep away pollution... put DSL on it and dismantle the telecom's shared monopoly | Dec 08 14:03 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | anyone notice that the ibm/canonical announcement has been changed to include novell (and red hat)? | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| schestowitz | Lots of companies want NOT to have children connected. | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| schestowitz | mib_d3pc41: when did that happen? | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | i just checked it | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | check google cache here: | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| schestowitz | I saw one IDG article (CompututerWorld) where NOVL and RHAT/RHT are mentioned | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | http://72.14.235.132/search?q=cache:k6GXIobp... | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | yes | Dec 08 14:04 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | but before it was only ibm and canonical | Dec 08 14:05 |
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| schestowitz | Hmmm... wait a moment | Dec 08 14:05 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | now novell and red hat is added | Dec 08 14:05 |
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| Eruaran | Can you imagine a giant mesh network with its own search engine capable of recognizing both content and your friends online... It would be Google with web presence. | Dec 08 14:05 |
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| schestowitz | http://www-03.ibm.com/press/us/en/pressr... | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| schestowitz | Can't find SUSE or Novell | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| schestowitz | Eruaran: meshes scare them. | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| Eruaran | A ubiquitous mesh network would be revolutionary. | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | http://www-03.ibm.com/press/us/en/pre... | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| schestowitz | No centralised control (censorship) | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | there it is with novell and redhat | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| schestowitz | Oh wait... | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| Eruaran | schestowitz: I would call mesh the REAL web 2.0 | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| schestowitz | IThat;s the following day | Dec 08 14:06 |
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| schestowitz | 5/12 | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | ah | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| schestowitz | Maybe they revised it. Let's see the diffs | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| schestowitz | Sometimes they have two press releases with similar pitch | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| schestowitz | Novell did that with PlateSpin last week | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| schestowitz | Two PRs, small differences | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| schestowitz | But it's interesting nonetheless | Dec 08 14:07 |
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| schestowitz | Maybe they announced a Canonical-oriented desktop | Dec 08 14:08 |
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| schestowitz | Then Red Hat and Novell phoned in.. | Dec 08 14:08 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | yeah i only noticed it because of that same itwire story and didn't remember other s being involved | Dec 08 14:08 |
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| schestowitz | It was amusing to see Novell seemingly rebutting an article with me using some press release with an eerily similar headline. | Dec 08 14:08 |
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| schestowitz | Which itwire story? The troll? | Dec 08 14:09 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | the "why it will fail" article | Dec 08 14:09 |
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| schestowitz | mib_d3pc41: the first PR is about virtual desktop | Dec 08 14:09 |
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| schestowitz | The second seems to be a different product, but I'm not sure yet | Dec 08 14:10 |
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| schestowitz | mib_d3pc41: Ha. yes, the troll. | Dec 08 14:10 |
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| Eruaran | One day people will have a network that is perhaps something that mesh is a forerunner of... and they will look at our day and call this the dark ages. | Dec 08 14:10 |
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| schestowitz | He aggravates a lot. | Dec 08 14:10 |
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| schestowitz | IBM is stupid for marketing it as "Microsoft-free". They should market "free" | Dec 08 14:11 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | Yeah it seems bold for IBM to come straight out like that | Dec 08 14:11 |
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| schestowitz | I want the IBM-free *and* Microsoft-free PC. They sell Lotus... stinkin' lock-in. | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | maybe they are pissed about MS backing SCO and it's a little slap in the face | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| schestowitz | And MOOX | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| schestowitz | They corrupted ISO | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| schestowitz | ISO if tainted for some time to come | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| Eruaran | I think its just that they see an opportunity in the market | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | no doubt, a least some nations had the decency to raise a stink about the ISO thing | Dec 08 14:12 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | USA noticeably NOT one of them | Dec 08 14:13 |
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| schestowitz | The cronies keep their chairs. There's also people like Alex Brown and Lunds Stocholm. The ISO got poined. | Dec 08 14:13 |
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| schestowitz | *poinoned | Dec 08 14:13 |
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| schestowitz | Eruaran: So does Apple (MS bashing) | Dec 08 14:13 |
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| schestowitz | They are hypocrites, Apple especially. | Dec 08 14:14 |
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| schestowitz | This < http://www-03.ibm.com/press/us/en/pre... > and this < http://72.14.235.132/search?q=cach... seem identical > (first two paras). No Mandriva for IBM? | Dec 08 14:16 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | yeah sorry for the false alarm. I was going off memory of Novell not being in the original release | Dec 08 14:18 |
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| schestowitz | IBM helps the kernel and Linux helps IBM sell hardware | Dec 08 14:18 |
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| schestowitz | This is no charity to them. They owe a lot to F/OSS. | Dec 08 14:19 |
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| schestowitz | Does anyone sponsor the FSF? http://www.fsf.org/associate/ | Dec 08 14:20 |
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| PetoKraus | umm? | Dec 08 14:20 |
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| schestowitz | Heh. https://www.fsf.org/associate/car/ | Dec 08 14:21 |
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| schestowitz | It would be bad though if the FSF accepted money from companies. | Dec 08 14:21 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | FSF takes money from companies: http://www.fsf.org/donate/patron | Dec 08 14:22 |
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| schestowitz | https://www.fsf.org/about/leadership.html | Dec 08 14:22 |
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| PetoKraus | i'm member #6128 | Dec 08 14:23 |
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| schestowitz | IBM is there. | Dec 08 14:23 |
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| schestowitz | Col, PetoKraus | Dec 08 14:23 |
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| schestowitz | Novell was caught lying about supporting FSF | Dec 08 14:23 |
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| PetoKraus | over a year now, i think | Dec 08 14:23 |
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| schestowitz | Justin Steinman was the fool.. | Dec 08 14:23 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | It's funny too, because Microsoft has an internal program where they match employee contributions | Dec 08 14:24 |
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| mib_d3pc41 | so there is a sizeable donation from that to the FSF | Dec 08 14:24 |
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| schestowitz | This is listed under FSF?? http://endsoftpatents.org/ | Dec 08 14:25 |
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| schestowitz | Weird... it's the FFII guys | Dec 08 14:25 |
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| schestowitz | ping zoobab | Dec 08 14:25 |
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| PetoKraus | hmm HP's there | Dec 08 14:25 |
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| PetoKraus | evil is becoming less? | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| schestowitz | Oh, wait.. I seee... | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| MinceR | the HP logo is funny there | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| PetoKraus | yeah | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| schestowitz | End Software Patents is FSF-related... that only links to /Stop/ Software Patents, which is more FFII-oriented | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| PetoKraus | MinceR: much better HP logo http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikip... | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| schestowitz | H-P... turncoats | Dec 08 14:26 |
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| schestowitz | Perens left the buggers | Dec 08 14:27 |
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| MinceR | :D | Dec 08 14:27 |
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| schestowitz | But they now have influence in GNOME... Stormy Peters | Dec 08 14:27 |
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| PetoKraus | schestowitz: i dunno man | Dec 08 14:27 |
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| PetoKraus | i am afraid my next box will be HP | Dec 08 14:27 |
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| PetoKraus | i don't see dell or lenovo approaching AMD | Dec 08 14:27 |
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| schestowitz | The FSF site is small. | Dec 08 14:28 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.google.com/search?sourceid=mo... | Dec 08 14:28 |
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| schestowitz | PetoKraus: Acer does AMD | Dec 08 14:29 |
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| schestowitz | Also Novatech | Dec 08 14:29 |
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| PetoKraus | acer, come on | Dec 08 14:29 |
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| schestowitz | In the UK, go here: | Dec 08 14:29 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.novatech.co.uk/novatech/ | Dec 08 14:29 |
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| schestowitz | AMD, no Windows tax | Dec 08 14:29 |
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| PetoKraus | http://images.novatech.co.uk/titles/rang... | Dec 08 14:30 |
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| PetoKraus | i wish they sold the chick as well | Dec 08 14:30 |
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| PetoKraus | *were selling | Dec 08 14:30 |
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| schestowitz | They can't . You can get the sofa though. | Dec 08 14:32 |
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| schestowitz | They are a shop, not a pimp. | Dec 08 14:32 |
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| PetoKraus | it depends how much you pay | Dec 08 14:32 |
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| PetoKraus | :) | Dec 08 14:32 |
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| trmanco | http://colatrolls.blogspot.com/20... | Dec 08 14:33 |
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| *mib_d3pc41 has quit ("http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client") | Dec 08 14:33 |
| trmanco | new entry, and there is already an anonymous comment stalking schestowitz | Dec 08 14:33 |
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| schestowitz | *LOL* "Roy Schestowitz is paid by Microsoft. He won't deny it if you ask." | Dec 08 14:36 |
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| MinceR | lol | Dec 08 14:37 |
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| MinceR | schestowitz: are you? | Dec 08 14:37 |
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| schestowitz | Yes. :-S | Dec 08 14:39 |
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| kentma | paid by MS - wow - how would that assertion be justified? | Dec 08 14:39 |
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| schestowitz | I help them document their crimes | Dec 08 14:39 |
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| schestowitz | It turns SweatyB on. | Dec 08 14:39 |
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| MinceR | lol | Dec 08 14:43 |
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| PetoKraus | lol | Dec 08 14:51 |
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| PetoKraus | the PC i'd like to get costs $840 now | Dec 08 14:51 |
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| PetoKraus | it's the only thing that matches my requirements, though | Dec 08 14:52 |
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| schestowitz | Mine cost under GBP400, excluding the monitors | Dec 08 14:52 |
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| PetoKraus | this is laptop | Dec 08 14:53 |
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| PetoKraus | i hope the price will drop by the end of the summer | Dec 08 14:53 |
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| schestowitz | Get a desktop+sub-notebook then. | Dec 08 14:56 |
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| PetoKraus | nah | Dec 08 14:57 |
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| PetoKraus | i don't need a desktop | Dec 08 14:57 |
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| PetoKraus | this thing is basically exactly what i need - 14.1 White LED display with AMD Turion Ultra processor and Radeon HD 3200 IGP, huge HDD, wireless N and 12 cell battery | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| PetoKraus | what i "need" | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| PetoKraus | i specifically need celeron 2400... | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| PetoKraus | though this would be "nice to have" | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| schestowitz | Intel??! | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| PetoKraus | intel? | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| PetoKraus | ah, celeron you mean | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| PetoKraus | no, i meant, that's the machine we use as our media server | Dec 08 14:58 |
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| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celeron "The Celeron brand is a range of x86 CPUs from Intel targeted at budget/value personal computers—with the motto, "delivering great quality at an exceptional value"." | Dec 08 14:59 |
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| schestowitz | I have a Celeron right here (about 2.2GHz), but I haven't used it since July. | Dec 08 14:59 |
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| PetoKraus | i've got one this summer | Dec 08 15:00 |
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| PetoKraus | it's this thing... 2.4, 512 MB ram, 500 GB HDD, wireless card | Dec 08 15:00 |
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| PetoKraus | €£100 | Dec 08 15:00 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2... "Windows is the most common OS on the planet, and its usability as well as price falls somewhere in between OSX and Linux." No proof, no citations... more mythology | Dec 08 15:02 |
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| schestowitz | First hand? | Dec 08 15:02 |
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| PetoKraus | no | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| PetoKraus | ebay | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| schestowitz | Oh. | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| schestowitz | I got mine for GBP165 in 2005 | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| PetoKraus | yeah, but i doubt that with 500GB HDD | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| schestowitz | It has no graphics card for multi-head | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| schestowitz | No, just 40GB | Dec 08 15:03 |
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| schestowitz | I have two large external HDDs | Dec 08 15:04 |
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| kevin__ | speaking of microsoft, i am now a victim of what i was talking about the other day :( | Dec 08 15:10 |
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| kevin__ | i have a laptop here which i have lost the recovery disks for | Dec 08 15:10 |
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| kevin__ | of course replacements cost over %100. my mother has an old pc that runs xp that she recently replaced. in a sane world, i would be able to remove the XP from that machine and put it on this one | Dec 08 15:11 |
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| kevin__ | 100$* | Dec 08 15:11 |
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| kevin__ | the government should be standing up for our rights to do such things | Dec 08 15:12 |
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| schestowitz | The government is them. | Dec 08 15:12 |
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| schestowitz | (corporations that can afford lobbies) | Dec 08 15:12 |
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| kevin__ | the worst part is, i have software that i need to run which only runs on windows. i do not want to support a company that does this to people though | Dec 08 15:13 |
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| kevin__ | if i buy a new pc, i am just contributing to the problem. perhaps i'll look for an old laptop just to avoid paying ,icrosoft again | Dec 08 15:14 |
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| kentma | I think you need to vote with your feet here... | Dec 08 15:14 |
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| schestowitz | Richard Stallman: "I'm always happy when I'm protesting." | Dec 08 15:15 |
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| kentma | perhaps because he's not sitting back and letting the world happen to him? He's standing up to it? | Dec 08 15:16 |
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| schestowitz | *GASP* "The lack of Linux support is also going to be an impediment, especially since Adobe is making such a vigorous effort to please Linux users now." Hands-on: building rich Internet apps with JavaFX 1.0 < http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/20081207-h... > | Dec 08 15:17 |
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| schestowitz | So it's GPLv2-ed but no Linux support? What is Sun smokin'? | Dec 08 15:17 |
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| MinceR | they're smoking printouts of slowlaris source code | Dec 08 15:19 |
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| kentma | If it's GPLed, then it can be ported. There's nothing in the GPL to say that GPLed code must run on linux... | Dec 08 15:33 |
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| *kapipi has quit (No route to host) | Dec 08 15:36 |
| *kapipi (n=tor@130.226.169.143) has joined #boycottnovell | Dec 08 15:37 |
| schestowitz | Yes, but look at Chrome | Dec 08 15:37 |
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| schestowitz | Open source means all sorts of things. | Dec 08 15:38 |
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| schestowitz | What da...? "He explained the components of their system. HydroPoint has seven software patents for a system that calculates eighteen variables for any irrigation or outdoor water use system. Things like weather, soil type, grade or slope, amount of shade, crop or plant varieties." < http://blogs.zdnet.com/green/?p=1513 >. This is like BM patents. | Dec 08 16:08 |
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| schestowitz | "The co-founder of Carphone Warehouse, David Ross, has resigned, after failing to notify the board that he used his shares in the company to underwrite personal loans." http://www.theregister.co.uk/2008/12/08/cpw_co... | Dec 08 16:22 |
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| twitter | Funny, http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/241488/vista-trigge... | Dec 08 16:29 |
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| schestowitz | LOL | Dec 08 16:32 |
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| schestowitz | "Within minutes he'd submitted another, more heated update. "I have nine macs!!!!!! I don't need another f***ing mac. I just want ONE ARSING PC that isn't complete SH*T."" | Dec 08 16:32 |
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| schestowitz | "The pressure then really started to take its toll. "Listemn [sic] I have parallels, I have fusion, I have 2 distros of Linux. I need jsut [sic] one, just 1 of c***ing Vista so that I can review things." | Dec 08 16:33 |
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| schestowitz | " | Dec 08 16:33 |
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| schestowitz | Nice to see his typos. Even Sir Fry lets them be... :-) | Dec 08 16:34 |
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| schestowitz | Haha. Look at the right side of the Web site (IT Pro) | Dec 08 16:37 |
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| kevin__ | a class b subnet | Dec 08 16:38 |
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| kevin__ | i enjoyed that story about thumbdrives being banned btw :) | Dec 08 16:38 |
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