10.30.09
Gemini version available ♊︎Sun Microsystems and SirsiDynix Libel GNU/Linux and Free Software
Summary: Two companies are shown for their smears of Free software competitors, one using a leak (probably disgruntled employee) and another using a former employee
OUR READER David Gerard has found this new addition to Wikileaks. Titled “SirsiDynix Corp restricted lobby paper against Open Source technologies,” the paper contained therein shows an ongoing slander of Free software and it is summarised as follows:
This document was released only to a select number of existing customers of the company SirsiDynix, a proprietary library automation software vendor. It has not been released more broadly specifically because of the misinformation about open source software and possible libel per se against certain competitors contained therein.
SirsiDynix is currently embroiled in a lawsuit with one of the largest public libraries in the U.S. (Queens Borough, NY) and this document does illustrate the less-than-ethical nature of this company.
The source states that the document should be leaked so that everyone can see to what extent SirsiDynix will attempt to spread falsehoods and smear open source and the proponents of open source.
In other news, just two hours ago Pawel let us know that a former Sun employee (and one of the developers of ZFS) is spreading lies about GNU/Linux. We append the communication below for those who wish to read it in isolation. █
| pawel_pfk | hello | Oct 30 09:35 |
|---|---|---|
| pawel_pfk | I found sun is spreading FUD about Linux | Oct 30 09:35 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s probably part of solaris 10 advertisement | Oct 30 09:35 |
| pawel_pfk | last time it was Bonwick, but Dave – Linux dev wrote response on his blog to Bonwick’s lies | Oct 30 09:36 |
| pawel_pfk | http://vger.kernel.org/~davem/cgi-bin/blog.cgi/2007/04/10#bonwick_scalability | Oct 30 09:36 |
| pawel_pfk | and now, it’s some other maggot | Oct 30 09:36 |
| pawel_pfk | : | Oct 30 09:36 |
| pawel_pfk | http://www.softpanorama.org/Articles/solaris_vs_linux.shtml | Oct 30 09:36 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Solaris vs Linux .::. Size~: 24.86 KB | Oct 30 09:36 |
| pawel_pfk | he repeats Bonwick bull, but ads more text | Oct 30 09:37 |
| *pawel_pfk has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Oct 30 09:42 | |
| *pawel_pfk (n=quassel@82.177.199.102) has joined #boycottnovell | Oct 30 09:43 | |
| pawel_pfk | is there possibility to post article about this? | Oct 30 09:45 |
| schestowitz | Hey | Oct 30 09:46 |
| schestowitz | Let me see | Oct 30 09:46 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] No #Yahoo for #Microsoft, #CarlIcahn Sued by #GoldmanSachs http://ping.fm/zE2Da | Oct 30 09:46 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: No Yahoo! for Microsoft, Carl Icahn Sued by Goldman Sachs | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 114.43 KB | Oct 30 09:47 |
| *oiaohm (n=oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #boycottnovell | Oct 30 09:47 | |
| schestowitz | pawel_pfk: is this a new thing? | Oct 30 09:47 |
| schestowitz | It looks like older stuff | Oct 30 09:47 |
| pawel_pfk | yes, it’s from current year | Oct 30 09:47 |
| pawel_pfk | afaik it’s written article is made since 2005 | Oct 30 09:48 |
| pawel_pfk | it seems it’s still in ‘production’ | Oct 30 09:49 |
| pawel_pfk | they even quote m$ Balmer there and encourage to read windows evangelism documents | Oct 30 09:51 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s aimed directly against Linux | Oct 30 09:51 |
| pawel_pfk | Created Jan 2, 2005. Last modified: September 15, 2009 | Oct 30 09:52 |
| oiaohm | Balmer fear of Linux is justified. Remember Unix guys at one point said that Linux could never take over there markets due to not being able to match what there full time developers were doing. | Oct 30 09:52 |
| pawel_pfk | so quite new | Oct 30 09:52 |
| pawel_pfk | sun wants to make more mony on dying cow which Solaris is :> | Oct 30 09:53 |
| pawel_pfk | money* | Oct 30 09:53 |
| pawel_pfk | it always attacks Linux – remember Solaris is better Linux than Linux campaign? | Oct 30 09:54 |
| oiaohm | For a time that was true pawel_pfk | Oct 30 09:54 |
| pawel_pfk | maybe  |
Oct 30 09:55 |
| oiaohm | Solaris was the techincally strongest of all the Unix’s. | Oct 30 09:55 |
| pawel_pfk | yep, but it was quite long ago | Oct 30 09:55 |
| oiaohm | Still has some techincal advantages over Linux. | Oct 30 09:55 |
| pawel_pfk | yep, ZFS and DTrace | Oct 30 09:55 |
| oiaohm | But they are fading fast. | Oct 30 09:55 |
| pawel_pfk | but this article is full of bull | Oct 30 09:56 |
| oiaohm | 2.6.32 mostly takes out Dtrace | Oct 30 09:56 |
| pawel_pfk | typical marceting crap in this case | Oct 30 09:56 |
| pawel_pfk | I know :> | Oct 30 09:56 |
| oiaohm | You forget zones pawel_pfk | Oct 30 09:56 |
| oiaohm | Linux kernel is still working on catching up with them. | Oct 30 09:56 |
| pawel_pfk | oiaohm: yes, but they’re working on them | Oct 30 09:56 |
| pawel_pfk | in few areas only | Oct 30 09:57 |
| pawel_pfk | like zones and fs | Oct 30 09:57 |
| oiaohm | Othere area is management software. | Oct 30 09:57 |
| pawel_pfk | when comes to scallability Linux owns | Oct 30 09:57 |
| oiaohm | Linux management software still needs more work. | Oct 30 09:57 |
| pawel_pfk | ok, but let’s not make a flame here |
Oct 30 09:57 |
| oiaohm | But that is the list. | Oct 30 09:58 |
| pawel_pfk | if you’ll read this article you’ll see there are many lies | Oct 30 09:58 |
| oiaohm | Link to artical. | Oct 30 09:58 |
| oiaohm | I entered after link being said here I guess. | Oct 30 09:58 |
| pawel_pfk | http://www.softpanorama.org/Articles/solaris_vs_linux.shtml | Oct 30 09:58 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Solaris vs Linux .::. Size~: 24.86 KB | Oct 30 09:58 |
| pawel_pfk | and Linux dev response to previous bull: | Oct 30 09:59 |
| pawel_pfk | http://vger.kernel.org/~davem/cgi-bin/blog.cgi/2007/04/10#bonwick_scalability | Oct 30 09:59 |
| pawel_pfk | sun definetly wants to rise solaris 10 sales by spreading FUD about Linux | Oct 30 10:00 |
| pawel_pfk | its advertisements are everywhere – phoronix, linux.com (lol) and at some other sides | Oct 30 10:01 |
| pawel_pfk | sites* sorry | Oct 30 10:01 |
| oiaohm | That is a older document reposted ie solaris vs Linux | Oct 30 10:02 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s updated in september 09 | Oct 30 10:02 |
| oiaohm | 2005 is not when I first saw it. | Oct 30 10:02 |
| oiaohm | Year 2000 I saw that document. | Oct 30 10:02 |
| pawel_pfk | alright |
Oct 30 10:02 |
| oiaohm | In the context of year 2000 most of it is correct. | Oct 30 10:03 |
| pawel_pfk | I found it yesterday and I thought it’s from current year | Oct 30 10:03 |
| pawel_pfk | however, they mentioned btrfs there | Oct 30 10:03 |
| oiaohm | Its really lacking in corrections to keep it update. | Oct 30 10:03 |
| pawel_pfk | so it’s being updated all the time | Oct 30 10:03 |
| oiaohm | Most of the corrections are making the document more and more invalid. | Oct 30 10:03 |
| pawel_pfk | this is obvious, mostly there are lies |
Oct 30 10:04 |
| oiaohm | Lazy writer at work. | Oct 30 10:04 |
| pawel_pfk | we’ll see if they start linking some sites to this article | Oct 30 10:05 |
| pawel_pfk | and then, maybe it will be worth to mention something about it? | Oct 30 10:06 |
| pawel_pfk | if it will happen of course | Oct 30 10:06 |
| oiaohm | Some of the stuff is still true. | Oct 30 10:07 |
| oiaohm | Like lack of focus on creating and maintaining the documentation. | Oct 30 10:07 |
| oiaohm | Blender conf recently almost rioted over it. | Oct 30 10:07 |
| pawel_pfk | yep, but documentation itself is dead |
Oct 30 10:07 |
| pawel_pfk | of course, there are probably some good points, but everything is written to show solaris as perfect os | Oct 30 10:08 |
| pawel_pfk | and Linux as the worst | Oct 30 10:08 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #AlexBrown is #Microsoft ’s “Insider Friend, ‘the Fox’” http://ping.fm/2R9de shameless shill for Microsoft | Oct 30 10:08 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Alex Brown is Microsofts “Insider Friend, ‘the Fox’” | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 114.38 KB | Oct 30 10:09 |
| oiaohm | Yet in recent years solarias documentatio have slipped | Oct 30 10:09 |
| oiaohm | Same issue as linux not enough people maintaining it. | Oct 30 10:09 |
| schestowitz | pawel_pfk: is Sun tied to these latest smears? | Oct 30 10:09 |
| schestowitz | They can say it’s “some guy” | Oct 30 10:10 |
| pawel_pfk | schestowits: sun always acts in this way | Oct 30 10:10 |
| oiaohm | What gets me is it is a pure recycled documents. | Oct 30 10:10 |
| oiaohm | This is no sun normal method. | Oct 30 10:10 |
| oiaohm | no/not | Oct 30 10:10 |
| pawel_pfk | schestowits: they use blogs and some people to attack others | Oct 30 10:10 |
| pawel_pfk | probably never directly | Oct 30 10:11 |
| oiaohm | pawel_pfk: Sun PR teams do act directly. | Oct 30 10:11 |
| pawel_pfk | oiaohm: yes? | Oct 30 10:11 |
| oiaohm | Normally with valid documents. | Oct 30 10:11 |
| schestowitz | Which blogs? | Oct 30 10:11 |
| pawel_pfk | schestowitz: i.e. Bonwick | Oct 30 10:11 |
| oiaohm | One document is not valid you really have to wonder who. | Oct 30 10:11 |
| pawel_pfk | this guy worked at ZFS | Oct 30 10:11 |
| pawel_pfk | oiaohm: what document? |
Oct 30 10:12 |
| pawel_pfk | http://blogs.sun.com/bonwick/entry/solaris_inside | Oct 30 10:12 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Solaris Inside : Jeff Bonwick’s Blog .::. Size~: 23.54 KB | Oct 30 10:12 |
| pawel_pfk | he spreaded FUD some time ago on his blog | Oct 30 10:13 |
| pawel_pfk | and I gave Dave response to this FUD before | Oct 30 10:13 |
| pawel_pfk | but it’s from 07 afaik | Oct 30 10:13 |
| oiaohm | It not 100 percent FUD. | Oct 30 10:14 |
| oiaohm | Around 2007 Linux was not getting the same percentage of yield from cpu cores as what solarias was. | Oct 30 10:14 |
| pawel_pfk | maybe not 100 percent | Oct 30 10:14 |
| pawel_pfk | Dave said something else | Oct 30 10:14 |
| oiaohm | He also pointed to the issue. | Oct 30 10:15 |
| oiaohm | Fs of Linux was still single data stream. | Oct 30 10:15 |
| pawel_pfk | and Dave explained why it was like this |
Oct 30 10:15 |
| oiaohm | Only fixed in 2.6.32 by the way the data stream issue. | Oct 30 10:15 |
| Diablo-D3 | [06:11:34] <oiaohm> Around 2007 Linux was not getting the same percentage of yield from cpu cores as what solarias was. | Oct 30 10:15 |
| Diablo-D3 | probably an accounting error | Oct 30 10:16 |
| Diablo-D3 | bfs > * | Oct 30 10:16 |
| pawel_pfk | oiaohm: probably not, because there’s written about this ‘issue’ at lkml and it was configuration problem | Oct 30 10:16 |
| pawel_pfk | something related to childs | Oct 30 10:16 |
| oiaohm | It was a mixture of things. | Oct 30 10:16 |
| oiaohm | When solarias put in zfs they fixed there lower filesystem stack. | Oct 30 10:17 |
| pawel_pfk | I checked and even 2.6.8 scalled easily up to 64 CPUs | Oct 30 10:17 |
| oiaohm | That did make a major performance difference | Oct 30 10:17 |
| pawel_pfk | but Bonwick said it was Linux problem, but it was just configuration problem | Oct 30 10:17 |
| oiaohm | Since 2.6.8 you are aware that Linux has many times doubled it processing on 128 cpu systems. | Oct 30 10:17 |
| pawel_pfk | there’s a thread about this | Oct 30 10:17 |
| oiaohm | Ie its yield numbers. | Oct 30 10:18 |
| oiaohm | These days the 2007 stuff is pointless the issues that caused the yield to be low is mostly gone. | Oct 30 10:18 |
| pawel_pfk | but it’s not related |
Oct 30 10:18 |
| oiaohm | Locks filesystem particular vfs kernel locking . | Oct 30 10:19 |
| oiaohm | Yes the Blasted big kernel lock. | Oct 30 10:19 |
| pawel_pfk | Bonwick said Linux scales worst then Solaris, but Linux scalled much better those times | Oct 30 10:19 |
| pawel_pfk | and it scales far better now | Oct 30 10:19 |
| pawel_pfk | he just lied | Oct 30 10:19 |
| oiaohm | Under particular work loads Bonwick was right. | Oct 30 10:19 |
| oiaohm | Filesystem work loads. | Oct 30 10:20 |
| pawel_pfk | no, he mentioned SGI | Oct 30 10:20 |
| pawel_pfk | and it was explained it was just configuration problem | Oct 30 10:20 |
| oiaohm | Guess what section Bonwick works on in Solarias | Oct 30 10:20 |
| pawel_pfk | he worked on zfs | Oct 30 10:20 |
| *binky (i=56848487@gateway/web/freenode/x-wfcgfbrqmsflvlth) has joined #boycottnovell | Oct 30 10:20 | |
| pawel_pfk | but it doesn’t matter too much | Oct 30 10:20 |
| pawel_pfk | if sun paid him, he sold his mind  |
Oct 30 10:20 |
| oiaohm | Solarias filesystem vfs did not have a big kernel lock in it like Linux. | Oct 30 10:20 |
| oiaohm | Hitting the lock to lock everything in the vfs was not a good thing. | Oct 30 10:21 |
| pawel_pfk | however, Linux had and has RCU | Oct 30 10:21 |
| pawel_pfk | and it makes a big difference | Oct 30 10:21 |
| oiaohm | Only recently did Linux vfs move to RCU | Oct 30 10:21 |
| binky | morning folks. has anyone heard more about the layoffs at novell this week? | Oct 30 10:21 |
| pawel_pfk | those time Bonwick was lying, Linux had RCU | Oct 30 10:22 |
| oiaohm | If people had taken Bonwick answers in context to where it works we might have got the vfs in Linux fixed sooner. | Oct 30 10:22 |
| pawel_pfk | oiaohm: its explained in Dave’s response | Oct 30 10:22 |
| oiaohm | Dave responed to general all round pow | Oct 30 10:23 |
| oiaohm | pawel_pfk: | Oct 30 10:23 |
| oiaohm | General all round Dava was right. | Oct 30 10:23 |
| oiaohm | But there was a pocket of hell. | Oct 30 10:23 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s just sun’s nature |
Oct 30 10:23 |
| pawel_pfk | they always attack via blogs etc. | Oct 30 10:23 |
| oiaohm | Its knowing sun developers. | Oct 30 10:23 |
| pawel_pfk | why they didn’t make official statement? | Oct 30 10:23 |
| pawel_pfk | because they feared | Oct 30 10:24 |
| oiaohm | Sun developers work inside a particualy field and are known to be tunneled vissioned. | Oct 30 10:24 |
| pawel_pfk | hehe ;D | Oct 30 10:24 |
| oiaohm | So if you take there blog posts with that. They can point you to critical areas of issues. | Oct 30 10:24 |
| pawel_pfk | but usually those isues are imaginable | Oct 30 10:25 |
| pawel_pfk | normal devs don’t play in such games | Oct 30 10:25 |
| oiaohm | I am sorry to say it happens to normal developers as well. | Oct 30 10:25 |
| *krenso (n=krenso@91.146.240.107.ip.abpl.pl) has joined #boycottnovell | Oct 30 10:25 | |
| pawel_pfk | normally any dev don’t attack others imho | Oct 30 10:26 |
| pawel_pfk | till he’s paid | Oct 30 10:26 |
| oiaohm | Its like the developers in the Linux kernel saying having to scheduler at fault. | Oct 30 10:26 |
| oiaohm | Even when it was major locking issues. | Oct 30 10:26 |
| pawel_pfk | they’re talking about their project | Oct 30 10:26 |
| oiaohm | Or that Linux out benches something else. | Oct 30 10:26 |
| pawel_pfk | I never saw they something like this | Oct 30 10:27 |
| oiaohm | Most of the time they do include the context sometimes they forget including. | Oct 30 10:27 |
| pawel_pfk | usually they responed to other benchmarks | Oct 30 10:27 |
| oiaohm | Normally do correct it. | Oct 30 10:27 |
| oiaohm | Just sun developers are not known for doing the correct. They just keep on moving forward. | Oct 30 10:27 |
| oiaohm | Notice the sun developer did provide context. | Oct 30 10:28 |
| pawel_pfk | in my opinion in your interest is to protect sun and it seems a little flame is starting, so maybe we’ll better stop here? | Oct 30 10:28 |
| oiaohm | But if you were developing a storage appliance << Most people missed it including you pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:28 |
| oiaohm | In a storage appliance what is critical. | Oct 30 10:28 |
| *binky has quit (“Page closed”) | Oct 30 10:28 | |
| oiaohm | File system not data processing. | Oct 30 10:29 |
| pawel_pfk | my point is just to point sun is using blogs to attack Linux and spread lies and FUD about it |
Oct 30 10:29 |
| pawel_pfk | I don’t care about other things right now | Oct 30 10:29 |
| oiaohm | Half the issue is people only have read the post. | Oct 30 10:29 |
| oiaohm | Take there own context away and cause all kinds of problems. | Oct 30 10:30 |
| oiaohm | This problem is not unique to sun blogs either. | Oct 30 10:30 |
| oiaohm | IBM blogs have had the same issue. | Oct 30 10:30 |
| pawel_pfk | doesn’t change a thing | Oct 30 10:30 |
| pawel_pfk | they must protect themselves right? | Oct 30 10:31 |
| pawel_pfk | I said what I wanted to say, I’m not interested in other things | Oct 30 10:31 |
| pawel_pfk | the fact is sun spreads FUD about Linux using blogs | Oct 30 10:31 |
| oiaohm | Most of it read correct is not FUD. | Oct 30 10:32 |
| pawel_pfk | if IBM do the same against i. e. sun I don’t care | Oct 30 10:32 |
| pawel_pfk | nope, it is | Oct 30 10:32 |
| treestrump | any examples? | Oct 30 10:32 |
| oiaohm | That one read in context is right pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:32 |
| pawel_pfk | there’s no single proof, except some sun benchmarks which isn’t trusworthy | Oct 30 10:32 |
| oiaohm | Just everyone else reading it complete forgot the “if you were developing a storage appliance” | Oct 30 10:33 |
| pawel_pfk | you didn’t read, so you don’t know what I’m according to | Oct 30 10:33 |
| oiaohm | Its a complete different kettle of fish to developing a cluster to data process. | Oct 30 10:33 |
| pawel_pfk | some proofs… : | Oct 30 10:33 |
| oiaohm | There are a lot of different white papers that have been abused same kinds of ways taking bits out of context. | Oct 30 10:34 |
| pawel_pfk | one of the titles: | Oct 30 10:34 |
| pawel_pfk | Solaris as a cultural phenomenon | Oct 30 10:34 |
| oiaohm | The biggest classic was “secuirty by obsecuirty” taken by MS. | Oct 30 10:34 |
| pawel_pfk | they’ve got to be kidding | Oct 30 10:34 |
| oiaohm | obsecuirty is creating secrects attackers cannot simply find out. Ie closed source binaries is not secuirty by obsecuirty because too many people have copies of it. | Oct 30 10:35 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] Massive New Migration to #FreeSoftware in French Authorities; #Gendarmerie Should Delete #Mono http://ping.fm/JG30U | Oct 30 10:35 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Massive New Migration to Free Software in French Authorities; Gendarmerie Should Delete Mono | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 110.61 KB | Oct 30 10:36 |
| oiaohm | Human nature is to take context wrong pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:36 |
| oiaohm | Now you could claim sun blogger are stealthing and cause others to take up FUD by mistake but don’t do FUD themselves. | Oct 30 10:36 |
| pawel_pfk | True, micro kernels might be a “total crap” if you compare them with the simple uniprocessor kernel of the size of Linux kernel 1.0. But the situation might be a little bit different with SMP-support and related additional complexity of all key subsystems that made kernel 2.6 many times bigger. | Oct 30 10:37 |
| pawel_pfk | Solaris if far more complex | Oct 30 10:38 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s natural 2.6 is bigger, because it brought many imporvements | Oct 30 10:38 |
| pawel_pfk | but this person doesn’t understand this | Oct 30 10:38 |
| oiaohm | Lot of core of Linux is reducing in size pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:38 |
| pawel_pfk | so that’s good sin’t it? | Oct 30 10:39 |
| oiaohm | Sadly there is bloat and duplication to remove. But its nothing like the ammount MS windows. | Oct 30 10:39 |
| oiaohm | has in duplication. | Oct 30 10:39 |
| pawel_pfk | solaris situation is far worse | Oct 30 10:40 |
| oiaohm | Even micro kernels at times have advantages over Linux in the right locations. | Oct 30 10:41 |
| oiaohm | Higher crash resistance that micro kernels can have due to less running in ring 0. | Oct 30 10:41 |
| pawel_pfk | oiaohm: but I’m not interested in this | Oct 30 10:42 |
| pawel_pfk | Until version 2.6 Linux just cannot compete on its own outside several highly specialized areas (only SGI has limited success in this area with their highly modified fully 64-bit Linux). The situation is improved with version 2.6 that provides more or less full 64-bit support, but it might be too little and too late to change the dynamics of this flat (or even shrinking) and very conservative market, where each previous investment strongly | Oct 30 10:42 |
| pawel_pfk | suggests the next. You just need to think about IBM mainframes which are still compatible with programs written in early 60th of the last century. Linux track record in compatibility is simply horrible and as such Linux clearly is out of taste for mainframe buyers. | Oct 30 10:42 |
| oiaohm | Everything has the price if solarias could not beat Linux in someareas I would be supprised. | Oct 30 10:42 |
| pawel_pfk | this is total bull what they said here | Oct 30 10:42 |
| pawel_pfk | they mention first 2.6 kernel | Oct 30 10:42 |
| oiaohm | Not total bull SGI was replacing the 2.4 network stack. | Oct 30 10:43 |
| pawel_pfk | and how it is related? | Oct 30 10:43 |
| oiaohm | That is valid for highly modified. | Oct 30 10:43 |
| pawel_pfk | nope | Oct 30 10:43 |
| pawel_pfk | his according to scallability and 64-bit support | Oct 30 10:44 |
| pawel_pfk | and he simply lies | Oct 30 10:44 |
| pawel_pfk | and he also lies about compatibility | Oct 30 10:45 |
| pawel_pfk | Linux can run first Linux binaries | Oct 30 10:45 |
| pawel_pfk | still* | Oct 30 10:45 |
| oiaohm | Not 100 percent true pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:45 |
| pawel_pfk | this article is not even 5% true |
Oct 30 10:45 |
| oiaohm | IBM mainframes do it by virtualisation support. | Oct 30 10:45 |
| oiaohm | What Linux is now getting. | Oct 30 10:46 |
| pawel_pfk | again you’re wrong | Oct 30 10:46 |
| pawel_pfk | Linux kernel can run such old Linux binaries natively | Oct 30 10:46 |
| oiaohm | There are particular network control calls that current Linux kernel does not have. | Oct 30 10:46 |
| pawel_pfk | and how is this related? | Oct 30 10:46 |
| oiaohm | Particular programs are kernel major numbers dependant. | Oct 30 10:46 |
| pawel_pfk | and? | Oct 30 10:47 |
| pawel_pfk | it doesn’t change a thing | Oct 30 10:47 |
| oiaohm | IBM mainframes get around by being able to virtualize syscalls. | Oct 30 10:47 |
| treestrump | the ABI’s have changed | Oct 30 10:47 |
| oiaohm | Same like freebsd. | Oct 30 10:47 |
| pawel_pfk | another part of FUD: | Oct 30 10:48 |
| pawel_pfk | Dump infrastructure in linux is primitive and buggy. Tracing also leaves much to be desired and far behind the capabilities of DTrace. Due to better instrumentation with proper tuning Solaris 10 can achieve performance comparative or better then linux on X86 architecture. | Oct 30 10:48 |
| oiaohm | Hopefull at somepoint cgroups provide that to Linux pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:48 |
| pawel_pfk | afaik there’s a better tool than dtrace, it’s not such invasive | Oct 30 10:48 |
| pawel_pfk | they wish solaris will achieve same or better performance on x86 | Oct 30 10:49 |
| oiaohm | Lack of Dtrace has been a major headache to sorting out performance. http://blog.fenrus.org/?p=5 << Like this. | Oct 30 10:49 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Introducing timechart « Arjan van de Ven’s blog .::. Size~: 52.51 KB | Oct 30 10:49 |
| oiaohm | What we have now. | Oct 30 10:49 |
| oiaohm | there was a way to create charts from dtrace helping massively. | Oct 30 10:49 |
| pawel_pfk | currently there are such tools | Oct 30 10:49 |
| oiaohm | They are only recent pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:50 |
| oiaohm | At the time of artical it does have some valid points. | Oct 30 10:50 |
| pawel_pfk | very few | Oct 30 10:50 |
| oiaohm | Now comared to today its dead. | Oct 30 10:50 |
| pawel_pfk | article? | Oct 30 10:50 |
| oiaohm | It has very few points total. | Oct 30 10:51 |
| pawel_pfk | yes and they’re usually not correct | Oct 30 10:51 |
| oiaohm | They are correct. | Oct 30 10:51 |
| oiaohm | Just over pushed. | Oct 30 10:51 |
| pawel_pfk | many are not correct |
Oct 30 10:51 |
| oiaohm | Most are correct. | Oct 30 10:51 |
| pawel_pfk | but you didn’t read a whole article | Oct 30 10:51 |
| oiaohm | At that time. | Oct 30 10:51 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s hard to say to what time this article is related | Oct 30 10:52 |
| oiaohm | But people are reading way too much into them. | Oct 30 10:52 |
| pawel_pfk | it seems it’s related to current year, because there was an update | Oct 30 10:52 |
| pawel_pfk | and they mention Solaris 10, so it must be related to current year | Oct 30 10:53 |
| oiaohm | Also did you not read the top of the document. “Copyright 2005-2009, Dr. Nikolai Bezroukov. This is a copyrighted unpublished work. All rights reserved.” | Oct 30 10:53 |
| pawel_pfk | yep | Oct 30 10:53 |
| oiaohm | unpublished work equals draft. | Oct 30 10:53 |
| pawel_pfk | this is a way such cowards like sun acts | Oct 30 10:53 |
| pawel_pfk | but it’s published :> | Oct 30 10:54 |
| oiaohm | Should be expected to be spreed over 2005 to 2009 of entries. | Oct 30 10:54 |
| oiaohm | Declare of unpublished says draft even if it posted or not. | Oct 30 10:54 |
| oiaohm | Its posted for feed back to correct errors pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:54 |
| pawel_pfk | I know, but google bots read it | Oct 30 10:55 |
| pawel_pfk | and some people also | Oct 30 10:55 |
| oiaohm | And that document need a lot. | Oct 30 10:55 |
| pawel_pfk | the best would be to delete this bull, too much to correct | Oct 30 10:55 |
| oiaohm | People are dumb. | Oct 30 10:55 |
| pawel_pfk | sadly, but true | Oct 30 10:55 |
| oiaohm | Its not that sun has done anything wrong as such. | Oct 30 10:55 |
| oiaohm | They are purely depending on the DUMB to turn a draft document into fud. | Oct 30 10:56 |
| pawel_pfk | nope, their marketing guys probably said it will be a nice solaris 10 advertisement | Oct 30 10:57 |
| oiaohm | Since the sections in the draft were correct at some time in the 2005-2009 time window they are home free from a white paper | Oct 30 10:57 |
| oiaohm | Now any white paper that is draft should never be quoted. | Oct 30 10:57 |
| oiaohm | Because its draft and could have to be corrected. | Oct 30 10:57 |
| oiaohm | Now if you could find SUN marketing people quoting it you would have them by the balls pawel_pfk | Oct 30 10:58 |
| pawel_pfk | it’s unfinished to not let other people act officialy | Oct 30 10:58 |
| treestrump | unpublished only means it has not been published in a journal, like most blogs | Oct 30 10:58 |
| pawel_pfk | so, it seems it’s another sun attack via ‘blog’ | Oct 30 10:58 |
| oiaohm | unpublished also does not mean released as final version treestrump | Oct 30 10:58 |
| pawel_pfk | unfinished is a shield in this case | Oct 30 10:59 |
| pawel_pfk | nobody says it’s a final version | Oct 30 10:59 |
| treestrump | nobody says it’s a draft either. | Oct 30 10:59 |
| pawel_pfk | current version is just a piece of bull | Oct 30 10:59 |
| oiaohm | unpublished documents are also not meant to be quoted from treestrump. No peer review. | Oct 30 11:00 |
| oiaohm | For defects. | Oct 30 11:00 |
| pawel_pfk | for protection and because of cowardness | Oct 30 11:00 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[thistleweb] New Blog Post – Back In Business | The Digital Prism http://tinyurl.com/yzmkbcg | Oct 30 11:00 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Back In Business | The Digital Prism .::. Size~: 11.57 KB | Oct 30 11:01 |
| pawel_pfk | I just wanted to point sun stills spread FUD against Linux, you’ll do what you want |
Oct 30 11:01 |
| oiaohm | pawel_pfk: anywhere SUN marketing quote it. Or is it SUN letting other idiots quote it missing the documents status. | Oct 30 11:01 |
| oiaohm | Its not FUD as such pawel_pfk | Oct 30 11:02 |
| pawel_pfk | they use it just to advertise Solaris 10 and to attack Linux, that’s all | Oct 30 11:02 |
| oiaohm | They are purely depending on idiot people to run it into FUD. | Oct 30 11:02 |
| pawel_pfk | other things don’t matter | Oct 30 11:02 |
| pawel_pfk | nope, it’s a fud | Oct 30 11:02 |
| pawel_pfk | but you proved you have problems to understand some points | Oct 30 11:03 |
| pawel_pfk | so we don’t have anythin more to talk about |
Oct 30 11:03 |
| oiaohm | A pure fud attack attempts to look true document. | Oct 30 11:03 |
| oiaohm | SUN ones don’t. | Oct 30 11:03 |
| pawel_pfk | if this article will be finished or more popular think of writing about it | Oct 30 11:04 |
| pawel_pfk | have a nice day, Bye | Oct 30 11:04 |
| *pawel_pfk (n=quassel@82.177.199.102) has left #boycottnovell (“http://quassel-irc.org – Chat comfortably. Anywhere.”) | Oct 30 11:04 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Blogs | Quassel IRC .::. Size~: 26.91 KB | Oct 30 11:04 |
| oiaohm | They have there own veration of it. | Oct 30 11:04 |
| oiaohm | Copyright 2005-2009, Dr. Nikolai Bezroukov. This is a copyrighted unpublished work. All rights reserved. << Note the All rights reserved. | Oct 30 11:05 |
| oiaohm | No one really has the right to publish it to use it. | Oct 30 11:05 |
| treestrump | it’s just a normal standard copyright notice, thats how they all are. | Oct 30 11:08 |
| oiaohm | Is it me or pawel_pfk was trying to get us to attack sun without 100 percent valid grounds. Yes what sun does is far more sneaky but is not FUD because can be disproven quicky. | Oct 30 11:08 |
| oiaohm | There is no other copyright notices to allow any other usage treestrump not all are that way. | Oct 30 11:08 |
| -BNc/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] #Vista7 Even Worse Than #Vista in Some Ways — Claim http://ping.fm/XQvac | Oct 30 11:10 | |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Vista 7 Even Worse Than Vista in Some Ways Claim | Boycott Novell .::. Size~: 113.96 KB | Oct 30 11:11 |
| oiaohm | http://www.softpanorama.org/Articles/solaris_vs_linux.shtml Also read the notes on that document treestrump | Oct 30 11:12 |
| phIRCe-local | Title: Solaris vs Linux .::. Size~: 24.86 KB | Oct 30 11:12 |
| oiaohm | This paper covers results of the research in progress. << The line of fear. Yes research in progress incomplete document. | Oct 30 11:13 |
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