IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: September 24th, 2008 - Part 2

Dr. Roy Schestowitz

2008-09-25 10:01:51 UTC
Modified: 2008-09-25 10:01:51 UTC

Enter the IRC channel now

twitter	My work getting done was just a cool dream.	Sep 24 02:07
AlbertoP	schestowitz, anyway scientific journals (serious) are necessary. They remove a lot of shit from circulating.	Sep 24 02:07
pombat42	That's great!	Sep 24 02:07
twitter	Scientific journals are moving to be free.	Sep 24 02:07
AlbertoP	o really?	Sep 24 02:07
AlbertoP	I don't think so ^^	Sep 24 02:07
schestowitz	Once Free software outpaces blobs (think Firefox), you get equal access.	Sep 24 02:07
twitter	All the work is done by scientists in their spare time. They hate the journals.	Sep 24 02:07
schestowitz	In this case to information.	Sep 24 02:08
AlbertoP	LOOOOOL	Sep 24 02:08
schestowitz	If FOSS isn't good enough in are X, participate and make it so.	Sep 24 02:08
schestowitz	Apache, Firefox, Linux... all leading examples... all FOSS>	Sep 24 02:08
pombat42	They are the diamonds though	Sep 24 02:08
AlbertoP	what has this to do with peer review of science?	Sep 24 02:08
twitter	Really, the submitters are also the reviewers and editors. All the publisher does is put it on dead trees and charge everyone else lots of money.	Sep 24 02:08
AlbertoP	twitter, no really you speak without knowing again	Sep 24 02:09
twitter	That's what you think.	Sep 24 02:09
AlbertoP	that's sure, because it's the case I'm scientist and reviewer ^^	Sep 24 02:09
twitter	I've seen plenty of it myself.	Sep 24 02:10
twitter	what journal do you review?	Sep 24 02:10
schestowitz	AlbertoP: you don't keep in touch with OA, do you?	Sep 24 02:10
AlbertoP	so maybe I can explain how it works: you submit a paper, and I can assure that if the journal is serious (and there are a lot), the selection is hard, no matter who you are, where you work, and what you're working on	Sep 24 02:10
schestowitz	Scientists themselves are fed up with how things are arranged.	Sep 24 02:10
schestowitz	Many of them put their paper in a homepage for Google to just index.	Sep 24 02:11
AlbertoP	schestowitz, arranged?	Sep 24 02:11
schestowitz	That applies to me too.	Sep 24 02:11
twitter	are you nice enough to prepublish at http://arxiv.org/ ?	Sep 24 02:11
schestowitz	arranged, deranged, whatever...	Sep 24 02:11
AlbertoP	schestowitz, no I don't know much about OA actually	Sep 24 02:11
schestowitz	I give a journal a paper.. what do I get ? Nothing.	Sep 24 02:12
twitter	All the selection is done by scientists, it's just another community.	Sep 24 02:12
twitter	You get charged when you publish, when you ask for journals and you do all the work.	Sep 24 02:12
schestowitz	They get free labours and the closed system ensures that they continue to be funded by instiitutes that also review the same papers.	Sep 24 02:12
AlbertoP	well, I don't send a line of my work to not recognized journals. I prefer to publish less, but to be sure it's a good job on a good journal.	Sep 24 02:12
AlbertoP	twitter, no when you publish you are NOT charged	Sep 24 02:12
AlbertoP	schestowitz, the "same papers"?	Sep 24 02:13
schestowitz	Journalis are gradually dying anyway.	Sep 24 02:13
AlbertoP	hehe	Sep 24 02:13
twitter	Some journals do indeed charge you for a minimum printing of articles.	Sep 24 02:13
schestowitz	Even with Academic/Scholar search, people's laziness beats it.	Sep 24 02:13
AlbertoP	yes, like microsoft	Sep 24 02:13
schestowitz	Laugh all you want.	Sep 24 02:13
AlbertoP	twitter, not the serious ones	Sep 24 02:13
twitter	Alberto, your peers make sure your publications is good.	Sep 24 02:14
schestowitz	People who do research these days just google for fast answers..	Sep 24 02:14
AlbertoP	twitter, read for example Elsevier policy	Sep 24 02:14
schestowitz	Even people whom I work with like the head of the CD dept.	Sep 24 02:14
schestowitz	Just googling their way between pages.	Sep 24 02:14
twitter	Nicer people, read competent, have gotten fed up with journals.	Sep 24 02:14
schestowitz	schestowitz.com does about 6000 pages a day... some of it academix stuff.	Sep 24 02:14
AlbertoP	twitter, oh well, I had various works rejected, and the reasons were all valid if I have to be honest	Sep 24 02:14
AlbertoP	so yes, I can say they helped me in improving my job...	Sep 24 02:15
twitter	sure, you peers are honest.	Sep 24 02:15
schestowitz	AlbertoP: journals make some papers just open for free reading now. They give up	Sep 24 02:15
schestowitz	WSJ, NYT...	Sep 24 02:15
schestowitz	People see a subs page, they move on to other results...	Sep 24 02:15
AlbertoP	I don't say they are 100% honest. Maybe they rejected it because they were doing something similar. I don't know. I say they gave a valuable feedback. That's all	Sep 24 02:15
schestowitz	It's human nature... like claoking OK on EULAs blindly.	Sep 24 02:15
schestowitz	They wants a solution as fact as possible. Paper = fat manual	Sep 24 02:16
schestowitz	*fast	Sep 24 02:16
AlbertoP	twitter, how does the peer review process work? :)	Sep 24 02:16
AlbertoP	for example, how many peers are contacted?	Sep 24 02:17
AlbertoP	schestowitz, google for research?	Sep 24 02:17
AlbertoP	research of what? rubbish?	Sep 24 02:17
AlbertoP	there is no selection in the information, how can you trust that?	Sep 24 02:18
AlbertoP	pombat42, you seem reasonable. What are you doing here? :)	Sep 24 02:19
schestowitz	AlbertoP: multitasking ATM	Sep 24 02:20
schestowitz	Researcdhing fdor answers.	Sep 24 02:20
pombat42	just watching the bombs fly back and forth while I eat my dinner :)	Sep 24 02:20
schestowitz	Sometimes the need for some equation	Sep 24 02:20
AlbertoP	pombat42, hehe	Sep 24 02:20
schestowitz	Sometimes just the need for some pointer to actual papers.	Sep 24 02:20
AlbertoP	schestowitz, yes that's OK.	Sep 24 02:21
schestowitz	The gateway is typically the search engine.	Sep 24 02:21
schestowitz	Put a gatekeeper page damanding money in a journal and the searcher will bump past it.	Sep 24 02:21
AlbertoP	so you skip papers because you have to pay for it?	Sep 24 02:22
AlbertoP	I mean,i if you do real research, you can't afford to do that ^^	Sep 24 02:22
schestowitz	AlbertoP: yes, pay = barrier (time is money)	Sep 24 02:23
schestowitz	AlbertoP: it's a tradeoff.	Sep 24 02:23
AlbertoP	it depends	Sep 24 02:23
schestowitz	I think the way research is done is a total waste.	Sep 24 02:24
AlbertoP	I could not do what I do without journals...all the info I need is there	Sep 24 02:24
schestowitz	Nuclear garbage.	Sep 24 02:24
schestowitz	Believe me, I;ve been there.	Sep 24 02:24
schestowitz	Total watse of talent when people share work that's programming through /POSTERS/	Sep 24 02:24
AlbertoP	you're not so old :)	Sep 24 02:24
schestowitz	Show me the code, as Cox said.	Sep 24 02:24
AlbertoP	lol	Sep 24 02:24
schestowitz	I'm not old.	Sep 24 02:24
AlbertoP	posters? but who wants posters?	Sep 24 02:24
schestowitz	You are more experienced than me, I don't dispute that.	Sep 24 02:25
AlbertoP	their values is zero	Sep 24 02:25
schestowitz	Even the IEEE still does them.	Sep 24 02:25
schestowitz	Or limiting programming tasks to textual description or pseudo-code.	Sep 24 02:25
AlbertoP	oh well, all conferences do, and it is a good way to know other researcher...that's OK	Sep 24 02:25
schestowitz	You want some good IEEE CD?	Sep 24 02:25
AlbertoP	hmm no, I would not understand much probaly anyway	Sep 24 02:25
schestowitz	Drop the PDFs, shove some source cord in. Let people share knowledge not through pseudo code.	Sep 24 02:25
AlbertoP	not really IT expert :P	Sep 24 02:26
schestowitz	Let them reuse work and build on the work of giants.	Sep 24 02:26
AlbertoP	well, I'm lucky	Sep 24 02:26
schestowitz	We live in wonderful times when we can duplicate and 'plug in' knowledge, interweaving ideas.	Sep 24 02:26
AlbertoP	I work on simulation stuff...so the math is the language and the code at the same time ^^	Sep 24 02:26
schestowitz	Some paper deliberately obfuscate knowledge or have some patents related to them (fences	Sep 24 02:26
AlbertoP	they can't say much against a paper written with math...if it's correct	Sep 24 02:26
AlbertoP	well, "duplicating" knowledge is quite useless...science should be about original stuff	Sep 24 02:28
AlbertoP	the rest is crap	Sep 24 02:28
AlbertoP	but the barrier to publish on really good journal is really high, so it's not so easy to publish	Sep 24 02:29
schestowitz	Who would read it?	Sep 24 02:31
schestowitz	1 years from now, 5 years from now, 20 years from now?	Sep 24 02:31
AlbertoP	hum?	Sep 24 02:31
AlbertoP	who? everyone working in that field probably?	Sep 24 02:32
AlbertoP	I read papers of 60-70 years ago for my PhD, still valid today...	Sep 24 02:32
AlbertoP	that's the whole point of journals...keeping information	Sep 24 02:33
schestowitz	You think of key papers.	Sep 24 02:33
schestowitz	Like Entropy and Shannon.	Sep 24 02:33
AlbertoP	of course, but you don't know what's key and what's not key...that's the problem	Sep 24 02:33
schestowitz	And that's pre-digitisation	Sep 24 02:33
AlbertoP	a stupid findings today might be the base of a huge one tomorrow...	Sep 24 02:33
AlbertoP	hum?	Sep 24 02:34
schestowitz	What about likelihood?	Sep 24 02:34
schestowitz	I've read stats on readership of journals.	Sep 24 02:34
schestowitz	Back-cites too.	Sep 24 02:34
schestowitz	Very poor compared to the Web;	Sep 24 02:34
schestowitz	RMS no longer seems to write book. GNU and FSF have better reach	Sep 24 02:34
AlbertoP	how can you compare the web with a scientific, specific and higly selected journal is not really clear to me	Sep 24 02:35
AlbertoP	gnu and fsf...well, I can't really be surprised	Sep 24 02:35
AlbertoP	a book is there, and can be examined easily if you buy it, and discussed	Sep 24 02:35
AlbertoP	information on the web is so widespread it's a real job to find it, and to confute it if it's the case	Sep 24 02:36
AlbertoP	the web is a good way to exchange information, but it is too easy to manipulate	Sep 24 02:36
schestowitz	It gets easier over time. More tolls. Google Patents for instance.	Sep 24 02:36
schestowitz	*tools	Sep 24 02:36
AlbertoP	I think we will move towards scientific online journals, but not very far from that in many fields	Sep 24 02:37
AlbertoP	media might change, not the concepts behind	Sep 24 02:37
schestowitz	There's a guage or reputation.	Sep 24 02:37
schestowitz	timbl works on this a little further ATM	Sep 24 02:37
schestowitz	Google PR ain't enough for credibility gauging.	Sep 24 02:37
AlbertoP	ok, but peer review has to be anonymous...	Sep 24 02:38
schestowitz	Yes..	Sep 24 02:38
schestowitz	And it is.	Sep 24 02:38
schestowitz	Wikipedia for example.	Sep 24 02:38
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AlbertoP	well, wikipeadia is a nice idea, but the quality sucks	Sep 24 02:38
AlbertoP	I read such a big mistake about chemistry and math there...	Sep 24 02:39
AlbertoP	of course you can fix it, but well...	Sep 24 02:39
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schestowitz	It needs time to mature in some areas.	Sep 24 02:43
AlbertoP	well sure	Sep 24 02:43
schestowitz	Lots of libel there, still...	Sep 24 02:43
AlbertoP	anyway...if you want a scientific career, better you publish on good journals :)	Sep 24 02:44
AlbertoP	because they make a difference	Sep 24 02:44
schestowitz	No, I'm getting out of it.	Sep 24 02:46
schestowitz	Seems like a nightmare reviewing papers, checking exams, memorising stuff...	Sep 24 02:48
schestowitz	Anyway, I'm going to bed now. Hopefully I'll see you tomorrow.	Sep 24 02:48
AlbertoP	well, I don't teach ^^	Sep 24 02:48
AlbertoP	ok	Sep 24 02:48
AlbertoP	n8	Sep 24 02:48
pombat42	bye	Sep 24 02:55
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zoobab	hi	Sep 24 07:38
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schestowitz	Hi, zoobab.	Sep 24 08:30
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zoobab	hi	Sep 24 08:45
schestowitz	What's up? I made some changes last night (Wiki)	Sep 24 08:45
zoobab	I have launched operation "Get the list"	Sep 24 08:45
zoobab	I saw them	Sep 24 08:45
schestowitz	List?!?	Sep 24 08:45
zoobab	statement needs to be simple	Sep 24 08:45
zoobab	http://stopsoftwarepatents.org/getthelist	Sep 24 08:45
zoobab	the list of things you cannot do anymore :-)	Sep 24 08:46
zoobab	I am gonna activate our people to write to their MPs and POs	Sep 24 08:46
zoobab	you can also improve the letters if you want	Sep 24 08:46
schestowitz	You know John Doe? :-D	Sep 24 08:47
schestowitz	I went to sleep at 4 AM, so need to catch up for a while.	Sep 24 08:47
zoobab	I saw	Sep 24 08:47
zoobab	zoobab@erika /home/zoobab [5]$ wget http://research.ibm.com//files/stand...	Sep 24 08:48
zoobab	--10:51:45-- http://research.ibm.com//files/... => `standards_wikis.shtml'	Sep 24 08:48
zoobab	Resolving research.ibm.com... failed: Name or service not known.	Sep 24 08:49
schestowitz	"More recently the company has announced the availability of its services-based solutions for Microsoft Windows Server 2008 Hyper-V and the Microsoft System Center management suite – which will presumably be none of McGrath’s business" http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/ne...	Sep 24 08:49
schestowitz	CEO is leaving. Maybe another Core/Novell, i.e. company besieged by Microsoft.	Sep 24 08:49
schestowitz	http://research.ibm.com/	Sep 24 08:50
schestowitz	Server not found	Sep 24 08:50
schestowitz	Gulp Oracle.com was down some times recently.	Sep 24 08:50
schestowitz	Maybe IBM is cutting down on research. :-D	Sep 24 08:50
zoobab	http://www.research.ibm.com//files/standardsfo...	Sep 24 08:53
zoobab	http://www.research.ibm.com//files/standar...	Sep 24 08:53
schestowitz	Server is back.	Sep 24 08:55
schestowitz	http://www.research.ibm.com/	Sep 24 08:56
schestowitz	Sutor is there. He escaped my question to him about patents and IBM.	Sep 24 08:56
schestowitz	Just in like telemarketing, these people are in denial. They work for IBM, so they'll pretend and perfume those poor policies on patents.	Sep 24 08:57
zoobab	ISO certification does not make something an open standard.	Sep 24 09:02
zoobab	The recent Hague Declaration should be accommodated by all signatories to the World Trade Organization.	Sep 24 09:03
zoobab	Open standards should be defined as those that are developed in an open and transparent standards development process and are freely available. Intellectual property must be irrevocably made available on a royalty-free basis, patents, if any must be licensed for free.	Sep 24 09:03
schestowitz	Inte's 'gift': http://www.gmanews.tv/story/122389/3... Intel also dumped Windows PCs in Nigeria (sold at a loss) to defeat OLPC. How nice.	Sep 24 09:03
schestowitz	zoobab: where's it from?	Sep 24 09:04
schestowitz	More Intel 'training' (probably Windows): http://nigerianbulletin.com/nigeria-business-finance-ne...	Sep 24 09:05
zoobab	intel is chasing OLPC	Sep 24 09:07
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zoobab	they go in each country with their classmate thingy	Sep 24 09:07
schestowitz	http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/2008/apr/08/cr... Toxic shock: how the banking industry created a global crisis	Sep 24 09:08
schestowitz	"The banking industry is gripped by a credit crisis that has taken the US economy to the brink of recession. Two banks have, in effect, been nationalised, house prices are tumbling and it is harder to secure a home loan. In a major investigation, Jill Treanor looks at the flawed financial products at the heart of the credit crunch and explores how the banks brought the crisis on themselves and how it could mark a return to basics."	Sep 24 09:08
zoobab	I wanted to create the OnePenPerChild Foundation	Sep 24 09:08
schestowitz	zoobab: it's a PR charade and lock in new markets. They need to sell chips, chips, chips... "Chipzilla," remember?	Sep 24 09:08
zoobab	http://onepenperchild.wikidot.com/start	Sep 24 09:10
schestowitz	How many Wikidot domains are there?	Sep 24 09:11
schestowitz	This one is offensive.	Sep 24 09:11
zoobab	me, a lot :-)	Sep 24 09:11
zoobab	why?	Sep 24 09:11
zoobab	I could make it more offensive, but I won't enter into the laptop arena	Sep 24 09:12
schestowitz	Let them eat pens..?	Sep 24 09:13
zoobab	11541.pts-7.vic	Sep 24 09:15
zoobab	shit	Sep 24 09:15
zoobab	mplayer mms://wm.streampower.be/ep-video1_en	Sep 24 09:16
zoobab	telecom package in 20 mins	Sep 24 09:16
zoobab	10 mins	Sep 24 09:16
zoobab	they will decide whether you can filter the internet or not	Sep 24 09:16
schestowitz	Any chance against it? I doubt it.	Sep 24 09:17
schestowitz	They'll try over and over again until someone wikileaks (as in a verb) some more stuff	Sep 24 09:18
schestowitz	(Not just ACTA, more like Media 'Defender')	Sep 24 09:18
schestowitz	Yesterday: http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10047945-38.html...	Sep 24 09:19
zoobab	ACTA in NL: mms://213.75.12.106/TKStream13	Sep 24 09:29
zoobab	now!	Sep 24 09:29
schestowitz	ACTA-ion and ReACTA-ion : http://www.computerworlduk.com/toolbox/op...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Stop the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement: http://www.freesoftwaremagazine.com/community_pos...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	ACTA's Unspeakable Acts : http://opendotdotdot.blogspot.co...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Free Software leader slams NZ copyright : http://computerworld.co.nz/news.nsf/news/0064FE27...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Act Now on ACTA : http://www.computerworlduk.com/toolbox/open-source/b...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Sysadmins slam ACMA web filtering study : http://www.itwire.com/content/view/19763/1054/	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	IETF tackling P2P data traffic in Tokyo even though the same content is available on a server in London. : http://www.heise.de/english/newsticker...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Why We Must React to ACTA: http://www.linuxjournal.com/content/why-we-must-react-acta	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Senators Plan To Unveil New IP Bill: http://techdailydose.nationaljournal.com/2008/07/sena...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	FSF organizes against Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement : http://www.linux.com/feature/142403	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	ACTA threatens free software : http://www.fsf.org/campaigns/acta	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	The right to peer inside your iPod : http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Microsoft could force your mobile into silence : http://www.techradar.com/news/phone-and-com...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Digital copyright: it's all wrong : http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/news/technology/digital-c...	Sep 24 09:31
schestowitz	Embattled ACTA Negotiations Next Week In Geneva; US Sees Signing This Year : http://www.ip-watch.org/weblog/index.php?p=1071	Sep 24 09:31
zoobab	http://news.cnet.com/8301-13578_3-10047945-38.html	Sep 24 09:33
schestowitz	Yes, that's the one I've just posted (10 mins ago)	Sep 24 09:34
schestowitz	It's not just Bush. I think NZ is the only country that at least mentioned it to the public.	Sep 24 09:34
schestowitz	Hollywood Xmas wishlist + rubbing up pollies >> new law	Sep 24 09:35
zoobab	I need to make a post about the swpat urgency in NZ	Sep 24 09:38
zoobab	ACTA is hereL	Sep 24 10:26
zoobab	media.ffii.org/ActaTweedeKamer080924/tweede-or-11h31.wmv	Sep 24 10:26
zoobab	http://media.ffii.org/ActaTweedeKamer080...	Sep 24 10:26
schestowitz	Thanks.	Sep 24 10:27
schestowitz	I've just found out something.	Sep 24 10:27
schestowitz	http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=2923	Sep 24 10:27
schestowitz	Anti-FOSS	Sep 24 10:27
schestowitz	Follow the money...	Sep 24 10:27
schestowitz	http://www.kpcb.com/team/pao "Russell joined KPCB after seven years at Microsoft. At Microsoft he helped launch LAN Manager, Microsoft's first network operating system, then was the marketing manager in charge of Windows for Workgroups, a small-business networking version of Windows. For the first half of 1993, Russell worked directly for Bill Gates..."	Sep 24 10:27
schestowitz	They also work with Apple	Sep 24 10:28
schestowitz	zoobab: it's not even in EN (the video)	Sep 24 10:31
schestowitz	My mate says: "Prepare yourself for the worst. the fed cannot pump one trillion dollars of public cash to subsidise the greed and failures of the corporate hoares on wall street. Hideous Inflation will follow then full scale meltdown, this is just a finger in the dyke, any market rallies in the next few weeks are just a dead cat bouncing. Wall street has been feeding off tomorrow for far too long, well tomorrow has just come home	Sep 24 10:32
schestowitz	to roost, what a surprise."	Sep 24 10:32
*[H]omer is away: sleep beer sleep beer sleep		Sep 24 10:39
zoobab	http://media.ffii.org/TelecomPackVote080824/	Sep 24 10:39
schestowitz	Why WMV?	Sep 24 10:40
schestowitz	Kaffeine gets these, but it's bad to encourage that former.	Sep 24 10:40
schestowitz	Even MPEG is better because of the holder	Sep 24 10:40
zoobab	http://stopeptv.wikidot.com	Sep 24 10:41
zoobab	stop this shit now	Sep 24 10:41
zoobab	stop this M$ shit now	Sep 24 10:41
schestowitz	Yes, I know.	Sep 24 10:41
schestowitz	Same in the UK	Sep 24 10:41
schestowitz	"Obviously BECTA never played Frontier. They make Microsoft look like a cuddly nonprofit." from Recent:	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	Microsoft's interoperability dodge in UK schools	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	,----[ Quote ]	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| discounts only make it cheaper to fall into lock-in. The Open Source	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Consortium's president Mark Taylor says it well: "Schools can now choose	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| between long-term software freedom or a short-term discount on the next	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| lock-in play."	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\|	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Fortunately, groups like Becta, which brought the original complaint against	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Microsoft to the European Commission, are unlikely to fall asleep at the	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| wheel.	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\|	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Microsoft will no doubt eventually be forced into offering interoperability	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| alongside its discounts.	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	`----	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	http://news.cnet.com/8301-13505_3-10043997-16.html	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	BECTA Back in Play	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	,----[ Quote ]	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Just in case you thought things were getting a little dull in the world of UK	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| computing compared to, say, UK finance, here comes the BECTA roller-coaster	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| again:	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\|	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| "Becta has been working closely with Microsoft to understand how the various	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| issues identified in relation to interoperability in its Office 2007 product	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| will be addressed. Becta takes the view that effective interoperability is an	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| important component of the technology infrastructure needed to improve	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| educational outcomes, facilitate home school links and address the digital	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| divide."	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\|	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Ah, yes, interoperability: Microsoft's favourite word of the moment.	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	`----	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	http://www.computerworlduk.com/toolbox/open-sourc...	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	Open source has yet to learn it pays to advertise	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	,----[ Quote ]	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Why is it that all these open source news sites, blog sites, and resource	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| sites are still being sponsored by Microsoft?	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	`----	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=2563	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	Ian Lynch's take on the BECTA fiasco	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	,----[ Quote ]	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| Fundamentally, I’m not complaining that we were not successful in the	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| tender - I have no idea how strong the winning bid was. I’m complaining that	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| the tender process adopted was broken. This is despite the fact that 130 MPs	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	\| signed	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	Big oops!	Sep 24 10:42
schestowitz	From here: http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2008/09/23/becta_op...	Sep 24 10:43
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schestowitz	zoobab: http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.linux.a...	Sep 24 10:53
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_Doug	Schestowitz: who are all these lurkers ?	Sep 24 11:06
schestowitz	Novell folks. Some of them..	Sep 24 11:07
schestowitz	COLA trolls lurk as well based on something posted there yesterday (at least one).	Sep 24 11:07
_Doug	Well, kick them after 20 minutes inactivity ..	Sep 24 11:09
schestowitz	No. BTW, by "Novell" I mean people who defend them, not employees.	Sep 24 11:09
_Doug	Who are these COLA trolls ?	Sep 24 11:14
_Doug	new topic:	Sep 24 11:15
_Doug	how the banking industry created a global crisis	Sep 24 11:15
_Doug	http://www.guardian.co.uk/business/200...	Sep 24 11:16
_Doug	'some of the complex financial instruments being pumped out by the world's biggest investment banks were potentially "toxic". '	Sep 24 11:16
_Doug	well , DOH ...	Sep 24 11:16
_Doug	A shell game designed to confuse the 'investor'	Sep 24 11:16
schestowitz	_Doug: seen that article (via GL)	Sep 24 11:17
schestowitz	Watch me get flak from Novell lovers: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/23/nove...	Sep 24 11:17
_Doug	Black-Scholes, a rehash of some formula from physics ..	Sep 24 11:18
schestowitz	G0d bl3ss Wall Street!	Sep 24 11:18
_Doug	A sub-atomic particle borrows energy from he future, and pays it back quickly enough so as the rest of the universe don't notice.	Sep 24 11:18
schestowitz	:-)	Sep 24 11:19
_Doug	So, these sub-prime instruments, endlessly traded promised to pay back from non-existant future earnings ..	Sep 24 11:19
schestowitz	hax0r physicists.	Sep 24 11:19
_Doug	As long as you don't look under the cups, then you can't realy be sure there's nothing really there ?	Sep 24 11:20
_Doug	The principle of indeterminacy .. :)	Sep 24 11:20
schestowitz	I wodner what economics blogs have said.	Sep 24 11:20
_Doug	Don't know, I'm putting my money in gold :)	Sep 24 11:21
schestowitz	Surely lots of people saw this coming, inc.. friends of mine? Television and Hollywood? "Buy, buy... tomorrow is our dream."	Sep 24 11:21
schestowitz	As I have said before, it's those with a loan who will suffer the most. :-(	Sep 24 11:21
schestowitz	Put it in oil. It ain't gettin' any cheaper	Sep 24 11:22
schestowitz	zoobab: ta for that: http://www.digitalmajority.org/forum/t-86599/displaying-the-p...	Sep 24 11:22
_Doug	Novell would be a good buy right now ..	Sep 24 11:31
_Doug	http://finance.google.com/finance?q=novl&hl=en	Sep 24 11:32
schestowitz	How do you know?	Sep 24 11:32
schestowitz	If that was true, people would buy it until the share meets actual real/perceived value.	Sep 24 11:32
schestowitz	Stocks aren't just gambling; it's the cheaters that win.	Sep 24 11:32
_Doug	It's undervalued, the whole stocl exchange is undervalued, now is a good time to snap up real tech companies ..	Sep 24 11:32
schestowitz	"Tomorrow will /always/ be better"	Sep 24 11:34
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AVRS2	http://altlinux.info/news/world/20080922.1334	Sep 24 12:10
AVRS2	That article is talking (with typos) about Belgium moving to SU.SE	Sep 24 12:11
AVRS2	*SUSE.	Sep 24 12:11
schestowitz	Anything about the schools.	Sep 24 12:11
schestowitz	Intel and Microsoft try to foil this, you know?	Sep 24 12:11
AVRS2	No, a ministry.	Sep 24 12:11
schestowitz	Where in Belgium?	Sep 24 12:11
schestowitz	zoobab is from Belgium.	Sep 24 12:11
AVRS2	that which is called "Department of Justice" in USA	Sep 24 12:12
AVRS2	During this year, 2500 new workspaces(?) with "OS Linux" have been introduced.	Sep 24 12:14
schestowitz	Ballnux?	Sep 24 12:14
AVRS2	See above, SUSE.	Sep 24 12:15
AVRS2	oh	Sep 24 12:15
AVRS2	sorry :)	Sep 24 12:15
schestowitz	houghi is from Belgium. S.u.S.E. has some fans there.	Sep 24 12:16
schestowitz	I think the guy who makes ELive is Belgian.	Sep 24 12:16
*AVRS2 confused Ballnux with something like Belenix		Sep 24 12:17
schestowitz	:-) No, Ballnux is Ballnux. http://www.google.com/search?source....	Sep 24 12:21
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-christel-[Global Notice] Hi all, in about ten (10) minutes we will experience slight network disturbances while we physically move one of our hubs to a different rack, some client servers will during that time be missing from the network, downtime should be short and affected users in the region of 4,000. Thank you for using freenode and have a great day.		Sep 24 13:08
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PetoKraus	Is someone here using ekiga?	Sep 24 13:19
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twitter	Wow, the trolls really did come out on the issue of Novell's stock price demise.	Sep 24 14:51
schestowitz	Yes, I know.	Sep 24 14:51
schestowitz	They also defend Microsoft in another thread.	Sep 24 14:52
twitter	It's funny how they talk about "most" analysts saying buy, buy, buy. It would be interesting to see what the same analysts said about SCO stock.	Sep 24 14:52
schestowitz	What scared me most are wolves in sheep's clothing, i.e. people who purport to be Linux users and actually defend what Microsoft is doing. GL had some of these and PJ often managed to unmask them... MS agents.	Sep 24 14:53
twitter	That kind of thing is designed to disrupt the community and make people trust each other less.	Sep 24 14:54
schestowitz	Yes, Robbins and Gentoo for example.	Sep 24 14:54
twitter	M$ works tirelessly to put their message in their enemies words and minds.	Sep 24 14:54
twitter	I'm not familiar with Robbins.	Sep 24 14:55
schestowitz	">Diversionary tactics, holding action, and retreats may each seem contrary to the achievement of the overall objective when considered solely in their own terms, but taken in light of the overall conflict, may contribute to overall success. In the Chinese Civil War that followed World War II, Mao Tse Tung's Army ran away from every battle, until they won the war. They knew that overall victory, not local victory, was the objective	Sep 24 14:55
schestowitz	."	Sep 24 14:55
schestowitz	--Microsoft, internal document < http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uploads/... >	Sep 24 14:55
schestowitz	There's another big where this Microsoft document talks about creating civil wars.	Sep 24 14:56
twitter	Now I start to understand Google's strategy of conflict avoidance.	Sep 24 14:58
twitter	Someone has to point things out though.	Sep 24 14:58
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schestowitz	http://tinyurl.com/3u334u "Patricia Q. Stonesifer, who stepped down as chief executive of the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation, is expected to be named as chairwoman of the Smithsonian Institution."	Sep 24 15:00
schestowitz	There's everywhere!	Sep 24 15:01
schestowitz	Her husband 'planted' some glorifying articles about the Gates Fundation [sic] some weeks ago.	Sep 24 15:01
twitter	sad for Smithsonian.	Sep 24 15:01
schestowitz	"New Chairwoman Poised to Reform Smithsonian" .......... REFORM? What /type/ of reform? She worked for Gates for ages and now she's in govt'?	Sep 24 15:01
twitter	Oh crap. Here comes a silverblighted, drm crazy archive effort.	Sep 24 15:02
schestowitz	For future reference: http://www.nytimes.com/glogin?URI=http://www...	Sep 24 15:03
twitter	broken link.	Sep 24 15:03
schestowitz	http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Smithsonian "The Smithsonian Institution (pronounced /smÃÂªÃÂ¸soÃÅ nÃÂªÃâ¢n/) is an educational and research institute and associated museum complex, administered and funded by the government of the United States and by funds from its endowment, contributions, and profits from its shops and its magazine. Most of its facilities are located in Washington, D.C."	Sep 24 15:03
schestowitz	I was there 2 years ago.	Sep 24 15:03
twitter	second one worked. have not looked at wiki	Sep 24 15:04
schestowitz	http://www.google.com/search?num=50&hl...	Sep 24 15:04
twitter	Louisiana's archive did a crappy drm'd effort. M$ wants to own your history, it seems to be a continuation of their Encarta efforts.	Sep 24 15:05
schestowitz	Tying invaluable assets to Microsoft is something to watch out for, just in case an announcement is made some time in the future. That's what my friend means by "toxic"... people moving from place to place, but actually doing more harm than before that way.	Sep 24 15:05
schestowitz	That's how they can get bankruptcy protection.	Sep 24 15:05
twitter	From the NYT, " The organization spent the last 18 months buffeted by bad news, starting with revelations about the excessive personal spending of its former secretary, Lawrence M. Small, who resigned in March 2007. In response to increased pressure from lawmakers on Capitol Hill and its own internal investigations, the Smithsonian has implemented changes to improve oversight and to try to restore the public trust. "	Sep 24 15:06
twitter	Do you think M$ did one of their famous hit jobs, like they did to Peter Quinn?	Sep 24 15:06
schestowitz	Ivy Lessner, long-time Microsoft booster/shill/whatever: "Microsoft's Buyback: No Big Deal"	Sep 24 15:07
schestowitz	http://www.thestreet.com/story/10438890/1/microsofts-bu...	Sep 24 15:07
schestowitz	On the other hand: "Microsoft plans stock buyback, debt sale" http://www.dailyherald.com/story/?id=236715	Sep 24 15:08
schestowitz	Bloomberg: "Microsoft Plans Debt Sales, $40 Billion Stock Buyback" http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087...	Sep 24 15:08
schestowitz	Ask Ivy: since when is DEBT "No Big Deal"? The spinners are busy this week.	Sep 24 15:08
schestowitz	I posted about this in USENET and a new full-time Munchkin that never post there before showed up attacking everything and everyone.	Sep 24 15:09
twitter	Yeah, I put up a link to Forbes where they laughably called such "unorthodox" behavior "muscle"	Sep 24 15:09
twitter	The spinners are out in force because the news is so bad.	Sep 24 15:09
schestowitz	They should illegalise those pumpers/boosters... it's like'damage control' pump and dump.	Sep 24 15:09
twitter	It is against the law to do most of these things.	Sep 24 15:10
schestowitz	Those who 'dare' to claim it negative get attacked.	Sep 24 15:10
twitter	Ralph Nader nailed GM for that kind of thing.	Sep 24 15:11
twitter	He got lucky and had the backing of a big media company at the time.	Sep 24 15:11
schestowitz	I posted about Gutmann an hour ago. The smear campaign and all...	Sep 24 15:11
schestowitz	From http://billparish.com/msftfraudfacts.html "Don't let yourself be intimidated or deceived by financial analysts, TV commentators, bullies on Internet forums or Microsoft's elaborate public relations campaign. "	Sep 24 15:12
twitter	Good.	Sep 24 15:13
schestowitz	"Bill Gates has publicly said that this is his favorite publication on finance and economics. It is also generally believed to be the leading such publication in the world. In an 8/7/99 cover story, The Economist noted that a proper accounting at Microsoft would result in a loss of $18 billion for 1998 rather than the reported earnings of $4.5 billion."	Sep 24 15:13
schestowitz	"Bill Gates trusts The Economist and you should too. Abbey Joseph Cohen and Rick Sherlund of Goldman Sachs have been sent this material numerous times over a 9 month period and neither has publicly divulged this situation. "	Sep 24 15:13
twitter	You know from personal experience how the smear goes too from them writing officials at your University.	Sep 24 15:13
schestowitz	Not them, not directly.	Sep 24 15:14
schestowitz	If that at all was the case. It was the Munchins who have plagues OS/2 and GNU/Linux NGs for over a decade.	Sep 24 15:14
schestowitz	I sent Mary Jo Foley a reference the other day.	Sep 24 15:14
twitter	Someone wrote to your University the way someone wrote to Guttman's boss.	Sep 24 15:15
schestowitz	http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.os2.advocac...	Sep 24 15:15
twitter	These things need to be tied back to M$ and some kind of lawsuit needs to happen.	Sep 24 15:15
schestowitz	She did not deny.	Sep 24 15:15
schestowitz	"Ah... the good old days! When astroturfing was somewhat uncommon (as anonymous blog commentators weren't really around yet)... Thanks for a fun memory. "	Sep 24 15:15
twitter	How many publishers carry Ogg Theora?	Sep 24 15:16
twitter	as a content choice?	Sep 24 15:16
schestowitz	Very few, mainly FOSS sites.	Sep 24 15:17
schestowitz	Incentive will be provided to those who choose WMV or whatever I imagine	Sep 24 15:18
schestowitz	IOW, you need money to enter the money and be accepted, as opposed to charging some	Sep 24 15:18
schestowitz	Did you know that Microsoft 'bribed' the Library of Congress $2 million to choose Silverlight?	Sep 24 15:19
schestowitz	Ask you senator for a tax return. Microsoft is paying the government to lock you out (GNU/Linux users)	Sep 24 15:19
schestowitz	In the news: 'Halo' MMO canned by Microsoft ( http://www.digitalspy.co.uk/gaming/a130982/halo... )	Sep 24 15:19
schestowitz	Yes, "Microsoft is doing great". Going into debt? Naaaa.... "No Big Deal," says Ivy Lessner, long-time Microsoft booster (no disclosure or anything)	Sep 24 15:20
MinceR	apparently, a "no big deal" is "doing great". :>	Sep 24 15:34
schestowitz	Yes, I saw no other shills quite like that.	Sep 24 15:35
schestowitz	About 30 headlines about the buybacks I just went through.	Sep 24 15:35
schestowitz	I clicked on the "doing great" one thinking "which shill will it be this time"? Since I saw The Street, I knew it would be her.	Sep 24 15:36
schestowitz	She also published other such propaganda against Linux ("Microsoft is cleaning up with Windows").	Sep 24 15:36
schestowitz	I think it was about China. It's always just Microsoft cheering... blindly... even when going into debt. Same with Motley Fool.	Sep 24 15:37
schestowitz	Watch this fluff I just found: http://www.earthtimes.org/articles/show/m...	Sep 24 15:38
schestowitz	"Microsoft and the USO Announce Second Annual A Salute to Our Troops [...] During this year's Veterans Day weekend, Nov. 7-9, 2008, Microsoft Corp. will partner with the USO to recognize and thank the military community by hosting the second annual A Salute to Our Troops through a unique New York weekend experience. "	Sep 24 15:38
schestowitz	Bill Gates: "It's easier for our software to compete with Linux when there's piracy than when there's not."	Sep 24 15:39
schestowitz	But... in the news: Microsoft cuts prices in China to fight piracy ( http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssTechMediaTe... )	Sep 24 15:40
schestowitz	So some people are supposedly "raping of women and murdering of people" (piracy) and Gates says he likes it.	Sep 24 15:40
schestowitz	The Reuters article ought to say something like "Microsoft cuts prices in China to fight free software and addict people to Microsoft" (Gates' expression)	Sep 24 15:41
schestowitz	Another find: Microsoft co-founder, philanthropist ( http://www.smartbrief.com/news/nei... ). More blind glorification. Because, of course, those who are rich are also good-hearted and the Gates Foundation is not about tax evasion and investments.	Sep 24 15:43
schestowitz	Ivy Lessner: "Microsoft Gives Shareholders a Gift" (Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin) http://www.thestreet.com/story/10438725/1/m...	Sep 24 15:45
schestowitz	http://news.morningstar.com/newsnet/ViewNews.aspx?artic... ( Microsoft India Says Hasn't Received Tax Notice,Can't Comment )	Sep 24 15:47
schestowitz	Microsoft Jack (Jack Schofield): Microsoft plans to give away $40 billion "Yahoo money" (Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin, Spin)	Sep 24 15:50
schestowitz	http://www.guardian.co.uk/techno...	Sep 24 15:50
schestowitz	Isn't it just amazing how all the Microsoft shills flood the news with Microsoft spin? It's not debt. It's Microsoft being 'generous'. It's giving gifts to society.	Sep 24 15:50
schestowitz	"Basically, it's just replacing the last $40bn buyback with another: it's business as usual. Microsoft says..."	Sep 24 15:51
schestowitz	What does /Jack/ say? Echoing Microsoft PR is not journalism.	Sep 24 15:52
schestowitz	http://www.itbusinessedge.com/blogs/hdw/?p=3131 "Microsoft is touting the “greeness” of the massive new data center just opened near San Antonio, Texas. It’s about the size of 10 football fields, with one trip around the building a 1.3-mile walk, reports InformationWeek." Green datacentre.... go figure... like "Thin elephant" or "poor billionaire"	Sep 24 15:53
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zoobab	whois microtroll.net	Sep 24 16:14
zoobab	is free	Sep 24 16:14
schestowitz	Instead of giving one to RMS < http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/... > they give it to people with money... even kids of people with money.	Sep 24 16:14
schestowitz	zoobab: what's that?	Sep 24 16:14
schestowitz	Server not found	Sep 24 16:15
schestowitz	Are you doing another Microturf site like Pieter's?	Sep 24 16:15
zoobab	What is MicroTroll? MicroTroll is a patent which aims to get rid of a monopolitistic american company. We have a lot of patents in our portfolio, and we are interested in excluding competitors from exploiting our inventions.	Sep 24 16:16
zoobab	this is my idea to have powerful antitrust	Sep 24 16:16
zoobab	much more efficient then what the Commission is able to do	Sep 24 16:16
schestowitz	Well...	Sep 24 16:16
zoobab	trolls not only go for money, but for product removal	Sep 24 16:17
zoobab	:-)	Sep 24 16:17
schestowitz	See the reply I just for here half an hour ago: http://groups.google.com/group/comp.os.li...	Sep 24 16:17
schestowitz	It hasn't shown up yet. It said: "Don't worry---teams of lawyers with suitcases full of cash are rushing to Brussels as we speak. Before you know it, t he ECJ will be filled with Microsoft lackeys."	Sep 24 16:18
schestowitz	Remember (quite important) that Microsoft tried to embargo 2 products recently.	Sep 24 16:18
schestowitz	It's almost unprecedented, but Microsoft attacked products with patents.	Sep 24 16:19
zoobab	the minister here wants to get rid of the consumer law for tied selling	Sep 24 16:19
zoobab	they attacked Samba in court	Sep 24 16:19
zoobab	and they are continuing to do so	Sep 24 16:19
schestowitz	Who's involved?	Sep 24 16:20
schestowitz	It's all about people and who they are connected to (interests)	Sep 24 16:20
zoobab	except that people and journalists are stupid enough to follow what MS puts out as PR	Sep 24 16:20
zoobab	ait	Sep 24 16:20
zoobab	waitr	Sep 24 16:20
schestowitz	zoobab: seen the above conv. yet?	Sep 24 16:21
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schestowitz	I've just gone through 3000 articles and gave some examples of this.	Sep 24 16:21
zoobab	groklaw had an article about the appeal for the "fine", linking to some curia.eu website	Sep 24 16:21
zoobab	but groklaw does not seem to have a search engine	Sep 24 16:21
schestowitz	It's enough for one journo to /ECHO/ a PR and then have his 'article' be trested like an articdle, not a press release.	Sep 24 16:22
schestowitz	Remember how Maureen O'Gara planed an article for Microsoft. people can then cite her as 'relible source'	Sep 24 16:22
zoobab	ECIS lawyer told me they were also appealing the patent licencing to Samba	Sep 24 16:22
schestowitz	Don't ever forget Durusau, with links to his letter lining up like cannon balls from MSDN	Sep 24 16:22
schestowitz	It does (GL)	Sep 24 16:23
schestowitz	Wait.	Sep 24 16:23
schestowitz	You can also do a Google search (or yahoo) with "site:"	Sep 24 16:24
schestowitz	Comments are not indexed though (it's deliberate, but you can get them using GL search: http://www.groklaw.net/search.php	Sep 24 16:25
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schestowitz	Microsoft just been dumped: http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer...	Sep 24 16:31
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schestowitz	http://www.fanaticattack.com/2008/buffetpaulsong... "Hank Paulson, a former co-CEO of Goldman Sachs, wants $700 billion from the American public to bail out some financial institutions - who, what, when, where and how are unknown. Why? Because. [...] Something smells fishy, right? Well, we haven’t got half the story, which is why the stench will get bigger."	Sep 24 16:51
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twitter	gotta go for a while.	Sep 24 17:07
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pombat42	wrt to the Wall Street problem, CNN is reporting that the FBI will be investigating the 3 firms that are in trouble. It was encouraging until they mentioned that the FBI is currently investigating 15+ other firms as well which leads me to believe it's smoke	Sep 24 17:59
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schestowitz	pombat42: scalating this to FBI level is weird. What happened to the SEC and other watcher. The FBI is now a transparent establishment, so it reeks "secrecy"	Sep 24 18:06
schestowitz	zoobab: "You posted the position of Oracle Corporation. Not Adobe" http://stopsoftwarepatents.org/forum/t-91677/ado...	Sep 24 18:09
AVRS2	http://stopsoftwarepatents.org/animation – in a non-free format?	Sep 24 18:12
pombat42	I think if criminal activity is suspected the FBI gets involved. In other words it goes well beyond trading scams and into the realm of running the company into the ground for their own self gain	Sep 24 18:12
pombat42	Also AIG is an insurance company so the SEC does not pertain, me thinks?	Sep 24 18:13
zoobab	I corrected it	Sep 24 18:14
pombat42	I hope they round all those bums up and put them in jail, real jail, for a long time to pay for the lives they have and are still ruining	Sep 24 18:14
zoobab	I will put an OGG file	Sep 24 18:14
AVRS2	.ogv	Sep 24 18:14
zoobab	Roy, can you convert it for me?	Sep 24 18:14
zoobab	.ogv yes	Sep 24 18:14
AVRS2	Ogg is spelt this way	Sep 24 18:14
AVRS2	thx	Sep 24 18:14
zoobab	http://stopsoftwarepatents.org/forum/t-91720/...	Sep 24 18:14
schestowitz	http://www.reuters.com/article/marketsNew...	Sep 24 18:15
schestowitz	FBI said to probe Fannie, Freddie, Lehman, AIG ..... http://www.mlive.com/newsflash/business/index.ss... AIG takes $85B deal from Fed	Sep 24 18:15
pombat42	thanks Roy	Sep 24 18:15
schestowitz	Yes.	Sep 24 18:15
schestowitz	zoobab: yes, hold on.	Sep 24 18:16
schestowitz	I'll upload it to BN	Sep 24 18:18
schestowitz	zoobab: Oracle also changed its stance on patents, didn't it?	Sep 24 18:18
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schestowitz	It's in OIN, so it has patents. It's just less vocal about it.	Sep 24 18:19
schestowitz	zoobab: done. Here's the video as Ogg. http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/uploads/2...	Sep 24 18:22
zoobab	roy, your CSS could be better	Sep 24 18:25
schestowitz	New Microsoft FUD:	Sep 24 18:25
schestowitz	http://blogs.zdnet.com/microsoft/?p=1606 "That’s the conclusion of a recent Microsoft-sponsored study from Vital Wave Consulting, which Microsoft is touting..."	Sep 24 18:25
schestowitz	MD fonts?	Sep 24 18:27
schestowitz	zoobab: MS fonts?	Sep 24 18:27
zoobab	just the design could be better	Sep 24 18:31
zoobab	going for a beer with LQ activists	Sep 24 18:31
zoobab	to drink for the victory:	Sep 24 18:31
schestowitz	Slashdot	Sep 24 18:31
schestowitz	zoobab: I'll redesign some day. but it's visual identity.	Sep 24 18:32
zoobab	http://www.laquadrature.net/wiki/Main_Page	Sep 24 18:32
zoobab	going to give some SSP tshirts out there	Sep 24 18:32
schestowitz	Ah...	Sep 24 18:33
zoobab	bye	Sep 24 18:33
schestowitz	http://www.laquadrature.net/wiki/Main_Page says nothing definite.	Sep 24 18:34
schestowitz	Just "A detailed analyse of the voting results will be available in a few days, but the global result is good :)"	Sep 24 18:34
schestowitz	"Thank you, India. We received your appeal against ISO" [...] 2 months go by [...] "It's going to the wastebasket"	Sep 24 18:35
PetoKraus	:D	Sep 24 18:50
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schestowitz	<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/U_vzmURTh5s&hl=en&am p;fs=1"></param&g t;<param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></p aram><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/U_vzmURTh5s&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>	Sep 24 19:01
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schestowitz	Oops.	Sep 24 19:01
schestowitz	http://www.novell.com/company/blogs/cmo/?p=108	Sep 24 19:01
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PetoKraus	:)	Sep 24 19:42
PetoKraus	brb	Sep 24 19:43
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schestowitz	MinceR: I've just mailed [H]omer about it.	Sep 24 19:50
MinceR	thx	Sep 24 19:55
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schestowitz	ping zoobab: watch image -> http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=2927	Sep 24 20:06
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schestowitz	More FUD. Article #1009 "be careful of open source": http://www.computerweekly.com/Articles/2008/09/24/232... (Be aware of legal risks with open source, says Eversheds)	Sep 24 20:08
pombat42	I don't see anything wrong with that article other than the alarmist title. He is simply saying to have someone document open source as well as closed source software within a company	Sep 24 20:16
schestowitz	Yes, I thought so too.	Sep 24 20:16
schestowitz	I looked quickly through the text.	Sep 24 20:16
schestowitz	There's some alarmist style in the article too (Cisco for example).	Sep 24 20:16
pombat42	I'm not sure if the Cisco blurb is accurate or not though.	Sep 24 20:17
AVRS2	I think I've seen that article a while ago.	Sep 24 20:17
schestowitz	I can't help wondering when those repetitive article will stop.	Sep 24 20:17
AVRS2	Or some article quoting exactly the same speech.	Sep 24 20:17
pombat42	How much code could possibly be in a Linksys level router?	Sep 24 20:17
schestowitz	It's like publishing 3 articles a week to say that lock-in is bad.	Sep 24 20:17
schestowitz	pombat42: about 2 weeks ago I saw 4 or 5 such articles in a SINGLE DAY.	Sep 24 20:18
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schestowitz	Arguably, each such article discourages adoption or puts sourceforge et al on another blacklist in another company.	Sep 24 20:19
pombat42	o i c now. What you are saying is that while the article(s) may have some reasonable points the posting and reposting of them with alarmist headlines is amounting to FUD.	Sep 24 20:19
schestowitz	pombat42: yes, something like that. We don't see articles about OOXML abuses anymore, do we? They could go on with these alarms forever.	Sep 24 20:20
pombat42	Schestowitz: I agree.	Sep 24 20:20
schestowitz	It's like the 5-year old in the back seat: "are we THERE yet?"	Sep 24 20:20
schestowitz	"Open source has a licence... and it's good to read the licence." No baloney, Sherlock.	Sep 24 20:21
pombat42	gotta run..bye	Sep 24 20:22
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schestowitz	InfoWeek gives exposure to that 'study' now: http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/... (A Roadmap To Destroy Open Source?), http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main... (I couldn't let the "divide and conquer road map" for keeping open source at bay, as described by my colleague Randy George, pass without comment.) Sponsored by an Apple/Microsoft VC.	Sep 24 20:24
schestowitz	Microsoft Endele goes on the attack again against Linux (his obsession): http://www.itbusinessedge.com/blogs/rob/?p=267	Sep 24 20:29
schestowitz	He's ruining the reputation (if any) of ITBusinessEdge	Sep 24 20:30
AVRS2	I guess I skim those articles too fast, but what is that study about? Is it an advice to proprietary software companies, or is it only the news sites that make it look so?	Sep 24 20:31
schestowitz	It's a 'study' funded by Usual Suspects^TM < http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/24... >, which I haven't read, but others have. Think of it as a Halloween Documents-esque think-tank.	Sep 24 20:33
AVRS2	ok…	Sep 24 20:38
AVRS2	Were that article by Endele written by someone else and at a good site, it would be not far from a good article.?	Sep 24 20:48
schestowitz	He used press releases in the past to push his agenda.	Sep 24 20:49
schestowitz	I imagine that he /pays/ to publish stuff when it's rejected. I'm not sure though. There was the anti-Dellbuntu article I can recall. And don't forget Microsoft got caught using journalists to "plant" stories.	Sep 24 20:50
AVRS2	I didn't read the article closely enough. Nor the comment or the Wikipedia articles (believing the people were portait as "perfect" in English Wikipedia was pretty stupid)…	Sep 24 20:57
AVRS2	Is the IBM QA part in it true?	Sep 24 20:57
AVRS2	*portrayed	Sep 24 20:58
schestowitz	I haven't read it properly. Just gazed at some words.	Sep 24 20:58
schestowitz	He's using smart type of propaganda, trying to be seen as neutral by taking cheat shots. It has gone on for ages.	Sep 24 20:59
AVRS2	The good thing in the article [is only readable for those who want to find it, and] is the same as other articles which say "“Open it and they will come” only works for things that are good enough" or something.	Sep 24 21:00
schestowitz	Along the way, they (Enderle and chums) will try to compare failures in Wkipedia (anyone can edit) to Linux (one patchmaster) or compare Cuba (communism) to Linux	Sep 24 21:00
AVRS2	Yeah, wtf, "even more easily done"	Sep 24 21:01
AVRS2	"I maintain that if something that is this public and can be read by anyone can be so easily subverted, then for code it is even more easily done." -- as if code can be _written_ by anyone too	Sep 24 21:02
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AVRS2	*, too	Sep 24 21:02
schestowitz	He steals FUD	Sep 24 21:02
schestowitz	He can't even make up his own, but he doesn't exactly plagiarise.	Sep 24 21:02
schestowitz	I think it was Carr who used that stupid Wikipedia analogy. It was debunked over a year ago.	Sep 24 21:03
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benJIman	MinceR: btw http://wikis.sun.com/display/HotSpotI...	Sep 24 22:56
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Comments

Yuri

2008-09-25 11:45:22

Stanford Engineering lectures and course notes are starting to appear in Silverlight format ;_;

http://see.stanford.edu/player/openslplayer.aspx?coll=824a47e1-135f-4508-a5aa-866adcae1111&co=4806d30b-e7f1-460a-b84f-e7c683262698
Roy Schestowitz

2008-09-25 12:25:44

Has someone protested yet, explaining the importance of standards, particularly in academia?

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