Bonum Certa Men Certa

Debunking the Usual Omission of GNU

Pack of gnu in the wild



Summary: Debunking the Usual Omission of GNU -- a reader's debunking of a new article from Linux Journal

THIS guest post from "figosdev" is case insensitive -- a choice of style. But it's the arguments that count.






I know, it's never going to change.
And it doesn't really have to.
A tired rebuttal to a tired old farce.
Because why not?
If this gets more time, might as well respond...

Debunking yet another tired "let's just call it Linux" article that makes a lot out of agreeing with itself



 

Some may remember that the Linux naming convention was a controversy that raged from the late 1990s until about the end of the first decade of the 21st century. Back then, if you called it "Linux", the GNU/Linux crowd was sure to start a flame war with accusations that the GNU Project wasn't being given due credit for its contribution to the OS. And if you called it "GNU/Linux", accusations were made about political correctness, although operating systems are pretty much apolitical by nature as far as I can tell.

a controversy that raged from the late 1990s until about the end of the first decade of the 21st century.

the controversy was probably mostly people saying "you should call it gnu/linux, because we have called it gnu for years and you added a kernel and called the whole thing 'linux'"

the GNU/Linux crowd was sure to start a flame war with accusations that the GNU Project wasn't being given due credit

if it was a company with a monopoly, they probably just would have filed a lawsuit. but instead they had an ongoing debate. lets make this debate sound as unreasonable as possible, because then we win by ad hom.

The brouhaha got started in the mid-1990s when Richard Stallman, among other things the founder of the Free Software Movement who penned the General Public License, began insisting on using the term "GNU/Linux" in recognition of the importance of the GNU Project to the OS. GNU was started by Stallman as an effort to build a free-in-every-way operating system based on the still-not-ready-for-prime-time Hurd microkernel.

GNU was started by Stallman as an effort to build a free-in-every-way operating system based on the still-not-ready-for-prime-time Hurd microkernel.



 

the emphasis on the hurd kernel is entirely on the part of the linux crowd. the purpose of the gnu project is and was to make users free. linux doesnt care about that, but its a very good kernel, so stallman suggested sharing credit. and he kept suggesting it-- for years, as linux grew and continued to accept all the credit.

According to this take, Linux was merely the kernel, and GNU software was the sauce that made Linux work.

to the gnu project, hurd is just a kernel. and linux is just a kernel. it makes no sense to gnu developers to use the entire project and name it after the kernel--

the cpu is a very core part of the computer, but if you took a laptop designed to make the user free and changed the intel processor to an amd one, you wouldnt call the laptop "an amd" would you? that would be silly. if you said you got an amd people would say "what did you put it in?" "oh, its a dell." because an amd just does nothing without the rest of the laptop.

Noting that the issue seems to have died down in recent years, and mindful of Shakespeare's observation on roses, names and smells, I wondered if anyone really cares anymore what Linux is called. So, I put the issue to a number of movers and shakers in Linux and open-source circles by asking the simple question, "Is it GNU/Linux or just plain Linux?"

oh come on, you did not... this article is a rehash of so many like that open source fanboys do from year to year to year. you didnt really wonder at all.

So, I put the issue to a number of movers and shakers in Linux and open-source circles



 

ha! you asked "linux circles" if you call it linux? we already know what "open-source" calls it. your bias is built right into your sources. this is a farce.

"This has been one of the more ridiculous debates in the FOSS realm, far outdistancing the Emacs-vi rift", said Larry Cafiero, a longtime Linux advocate and FOSS writer who pulls publicity duties at the Southern California Linux Expo. "It's akin to the Chevrolet-Chevy moniker. Technically the car produced by GM is a Chevrolet, but rarely does anyone trot out all three syllables. It's a Chevy. Same with the shorthand for GNU/Linux being Linux. The shorthand version—the Chevy version—is Linux. If you insist in calling it a Chevrolet, it's GNU/Linux."

This has been one of the more ridiculous debates in the FOSS realm



 

yes, its ridiculous because not only does open source insist on eclipsing free software, it wants to do it in every possible way-- from co-opting a social movement to changing the name of everything, to denying credit for anything accomplished over the past 15 years ("well that was then, but...") even to pretending that the debate is over "and we won!" (but thats how the article leaves it. we arent there yet.)

Next up was Steven J. Vaughan Nichols, who's "been covering Unix since before Linux was a grad student". He didn't mince any words.

yes, hes a complete shill for zdnet.

"Enough already", he said. "RMS tried, and failed, to create an operating system: Hurd. He and the Free Software Foundation's endless attempts to plaster his GNU name to the work of Linus Torvalds and the other Linux kernel developers is disingenuous and an insult to their work. RMS gets credit for EMACS, GPL, and GCC. Linux? No."

Enough already", he said. "RMS tried, and failed, to create an operating system:



 

wow. i used to think he was sort of in-the-middle as shills went.

steve: take windows-- an entire "operating system," and replace ntkernel, and call it yours. let me know what you still own when theyre done.



 

RMS gets credit for EMACS, GPL, and GCC. Linux? No."

steve, what the heck does this even mean???

youre the ones suggesting it be called linux/linux. youre talking like stallman wants to call it gnu/gnu.



 

He and the Free Software Foundation's endless attempts to plaster his GNU name to the work of Linus Torvalds and the other Linux kernel

uh, no? torvalds plastered the linux name onto the gnu operating system. heres how you know-- the gnu operating system already existed.

and from what you said, youd think that the gnu team took linux and added it to the gnu os and called the linux kernel "gnu." but again, they call what other people took and added linux to-- and call it gnu/linux.

someone is plastering a name onto everything, but the name theyre plastering is onto it is linux.

if we can call everything linux, theres no reason that calling it "gnu/linux" is specious.

To be fair, the use of GNU-related monikers didn't start with Stallman. An early distribution, Yggdrasil, used the term "Linux/GNU/X" in 1992, and shortly thereafter the terms "GNU/Linux" and "GNU+Linux" began showing up in Usenet and mailing-list discussions. Debian, which early on was sponsored by the Free Software Foundation, starting using the term "GNU/Linux" in 1994, which it continues to use to this day. Stallman began publicly advocating its use in 1996.

yes, to be fair.

id like gnu/steve (his argument was we are trying to plaster gnu onto everything, so this isnt any different) or as steve is known in the linux world: "linux" (the l-man, steve the kernel, linsteve 2.0) to go tell debian developers "plastering the GNU name to the work of Linus Torvalds and the other Linux kernel developers is disingenuous and an insult to their work!" and find out how that goes. go ahead, l-man, do it...

But Stallman's advocacy always put a bad taste in some people's mouths.

yes, but to be fair, there are people who react negatively to just about any idea.

"For me it's always, always, always, always Linux," said Alan Zeichick, an analyst at Camden Associates who frequently speaks, consults and writes about open-source projects for the enterprise. "One hundred percent. Never GNU/Linux. I follow industry norms."

Well, somebody has to defend orthodoxy.

For me it's always, always, always, always Linux," said Alan Zeichick, an analyst at Camden Associates



 

ive heard about gnu and linux about a million times in over a decade. as of today ive heard of alan zeichick once, and camden associates (what do they even do?) once. im just going to call them linux, its the more popular term.



 

"I follow industry norms."

so you use windows and apple mostly-- ok.

Gaël Duval, founder of the once uber-popular Mandrake/Mandriva distro who's now developing eelo, a privacy-respecting Android clone, pointed out that insisting on GNU/Linux might open the door wider than originally intended. "I understand people who support the idea to call it GNU/Linux", he said. "On the other hand, I do not see why in this case we wouldn't use "GNU/X11/KDE/Gnome/Whatever/Linux" for desktop systems, because graphical environments and apps are very significant in such systems.

insisting on GNU/Linux might open the door wider than originally intended. "I understand people who support the idea to call it GNU/Linux", he said.



 

-- yes, to keep the original project from being eclipsed. technically gnu eclipses unix, but a. it cant legally be called unix and b. thats what the u cleverly stands for: "gnus not unix."

i would be perfectly happy with the name linug instead of gnu/linux, and it could stand for "linug is never undermining gnu." i truly believe stallman would accept this.

"Personally, I'm comfortable with both Linux and GNU/Linux", he added, "but I use simply Linux, because adding complexity in communication and marketing is generally not efficient."

adding complexity in communication and marketing is generally not efficient."

the message that you really want to convey after all, is that linus torvalds wrote an entire operating system.

Richi Jennings, an independent industry analyst who pens a weekly security column on TechBeacon, expressed a similar sentiment. "Look, it's totally fair to give the GNU project its due", he said. "On the other hand, if that fairness needs to be expressed in a naming convention, why stop at GNU? Why not also recognize BSD, XINU, PBM, OpenSSL, Samba and countless other FLOSS projects that need to be included to form a workable distro?

Why not also recognize BSD, XINU, PBM, OpenSSL, Samba and countless other FLOSS projects that need to be included to form a workable distro?

because this is a completely specious argument by their own percentage standards. even with the bsd part... though that was the best example.

note the percentage argument is entirely a thing that the linux crowd made up, and it misses the point a bit like everything else theyve said to justify co-opting free software.

"The bottom line is that 'Linux' is what the vast majority of people call it. So that's what it should be called, because that's how language works."

The bottom line is that 'Linux' is what the vast majority of people call it. So that's what it should be called,



 

by this ridiculous argument, internet explorer should be called "windows" and firefox should be called "facebook."

Self-professed "ace Linux guru" and Linux writer Carla Schroder said, "I've never called it GNU/Linux. GNU coreutils, tar, make, gcc, wget, bash and so on are still fundamental tools for a lot of Linux users. Certain people can't let any Linux discussion pass without insisting that 'Linux' is only the kernel. Linux distros include a majority of non-GNU software, and I'm fine with 'Linux' as an umbrella term for the whole works. It's simple and it's widely recognized."

"Certain people can't let any Linux discussion pass without insisting that 'Linux' is only the kernel."

guess why? because linux is the kernel.

"I'm fine with 'Linux' as an umbrella term for the whole works. "

and the whole rewriting history part is fine too.

Tallying the votes, it looks as if the "ayes" have it, and you can call Linux what you want. If anybody gives you any grief, tell them what Schroder told me: "Arguing is fun, but I suggest that contributing financially or in other ways to GNU/Linux/FOSS projects is more helpful."

Tallying the votes

if polling people and counting the ones who agree with your stance is what you call voting, theres got to be a place near central america you can run for office.

Arguing is fun, but I suggest that contributing financially or in other ways to GNU/Linux/FOSS projects is more helpful."

i would say that when youre not doing that, a few arguments against rewriting history are possibly worth your time.

also, i think it helps if people call it gnu/linux.

Or, we could argue about whether it's FOSS or FLOSS.

Or, we could argue about whether it's FOSS or FLOSS.

its both. have a cookie.



 

there are a few stupid things about this article worth mentioning:

gnu/linux is about precedence, not percentage. that whole percentage red herring is bunk city.

creating an operating system to make users free is a loftier goal than writing a kernel to avoid a hike through the snow, and suggesting "gnu/linux" as a compromise is both generous and smart-- since linux insists on taking all the credit.

gnu and also the free software movement were co-opted by linux and open source. even open source initiative co-founder bruce perens admits this, though it wasnt intentional on his part. gnu/linux was proposed as a way to give back some of the credit, after too much was taken away. it was a gracious move, and no matter how many times this "lets just agree on linux" argument is made (year after year after year) the fact is-- the gnu/linux name serves a purpose regardless.

if people call it "linux" they are letting you know that they are willing to co-opt a very important work and possibly rewrite history.

if people call it "gnu/linux" they are letting you know that marketing isnt more important to them than due credit-- and that they care about your freedom and what the gnu name stands for.

you dont have to care what the gnu name stands for, but it does stand for a bit more than the name "linux" does. the gnu name (while it really is just a name) indicates things to users that "linux" barely implies at times (or in practice.)

whats funny is that by poking at the name "linux," the project to make users free continues to promote a worthier goal than just a practical piece of software-- so what if it does it the way ricky gervais in extras tries to inch his way into the scene. the somewhat disingenuously-eclipsed project to make people free doesnt have to seem like its cool, it only has to do whats right.

while the industry doesnt have to do whats right, it only has to seem like its cool.

and if this kind of bs is what passes for "cool" these days, maybe these people need to get out more.



the one thing i meant to add is, 'no matter how many times these arguments are trotted out, using the gnu name is still a reliable way to convey that you care about freedom-- while calling it linux is an increasingly UNreliable way to do do that.



you have the choice, and it says where your priorities are. theres something about 'gnu/linux' thats hard to co-opt-- those who would misuse it, would probably never use it. perhaps this is stallmans unintended genius, but i wish id thought of it.

Recent Techrights' Posts

IBM 'Dinobabies' Speak Out
"They want newbies out of school at a much cheaper rate"
Mass Layoffs at Microsoft, March 2026
When will the media properly investigate this?
An American War on GNU/Linux, Software Freedom, and British Investigative, Science-Based Reporting - Part IV - Escalating to Ministers, Explaining the Severity of These Matters
British Sovereignty at Stake
 
Quiet Layoffs or Silent Layoffs Alleged at Microsoft
Will some investigative journalists do their job now and ask Microsoft tough questions?
After a Long Lull LinuxTeck (linuxteck.com) Came Back Only as a Slopfarm
Unlike Linuxiac, LinuxTeck wasn't very active in recent years
Links 11/03/2026: EPO and USPTO Software Patents Thrown Out Again, Copyright Concerns Over Slop (Plagiarism Using Buzzwords)
Links for the day
Microsofters' SLAPP Censorship - Part 9 Out of 200: 5RB Barrister Does Not Even Know the Name of His Own Client (That He Was Paid Well Over $200,000 to 'Speak' or 'Cover' for)
If you assault women in the United States, there's a barrister available for you in the UK
IBM's Fedora is Now Led by GAFAM Slop
The official word of Fedora is partly slop
Links 11/03/2026: "Drill, Baby, Drill" and Social Control Media Recognised as Threat to Democracy
Links for the day
5 Years Since Freenode Conflict
IRC isn't going away
A Week Ahead of Next EPO Strike the Staff Representatives Show the Administrative Council That the Office Lost the Best Staff, It's No Longer Attractive
the message circulated regarding the open letter to the Administrative Council
Jeff Bezos as an Individual Said to Have Enough Capital to Buy IBM
Assuming a market capitalisation of 234.70 billion
Starting Soon: Another New Series About Richard Stallman
There are some inside stories we can tell
Gemini Links 11/03/2026: School, Code Slop, and "Fancy Weapons"
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, March 10, 2026
IRC logs for Tuesday, March 10, 2026
Geminispace Continues to Grow
Geminispace Will Soon Have 5,000 Capsules
Very Little Slop About "Linux"
We hope to see slop eradicated by year's end
BBC Lied for Its Longtime Sponsor (Bribes for 15+ Years) Bill Epsteingate, in Effect Covering Up Sex Trafficking of Underage Girls
The state of the media is truly awful
Microsoft GitHub is Not Free Hosting and It Won't Last
Not for much longer [...] Microsoft is afraid to say that it is pulling the plug, but it seems inevitable
"The Lost Generation" Came Back, This Time Literally
Based on my limited experience with young people ("alphas"), they're lost
IBM is Not Likely to Survive Another Decade
Despite having already survived over a century [...] Last week we saw claims that some company would likely acquire IBM for its remaining assets
IBM Has Just Been Sued Again by Its Own Staff (This Time a Manager, Stephen P. Gutierrez)
IBM's behaviour towards its staff can prove costly
When a Company Says Its Layoffs are "Due to AI" Check the Debt (Typically the Real Reason for Mass Layoffs)
The mass layoffs at Microsoft continue, but Microsoft hides those in some of the same ways IBM does
Doing More With Less
primacy of concepts rather than bells and whistles
Andy and Helen in Cybershow on Divesting From the United States' Technology and Politics
It is no longer considered a taboo to say this and it's not "anti-American" because many Americans can relate to and agree with such criticism
Links 10/03/2026: "GEMA v. Suno Copyright Case" and "Valve Faces PRS Lawsuit Over Allegedly Unlicensed Steam Music"
Links for the day
Gemini Links 10/03/2026: Woods in UK, Slop Laziness, and "Small Technology and Small Economic"
Links for the day
Garrett Announces LibreLocal Instance in Northampton, Massachusetts (USA)
his message was the only one last month
Microsofters' SLAPP Censorship - Part 8 Out of 200: Gross Misuse of UKGDPR to Protect the Agenda of American Back Doors (Mass Surveillance)
Responding to bunk claims regarding UKGDPR and claims of 'analytics' in our sites
Links 10/03/2026: Oil Prices Rising, South Korean/US Military Assets Redirected
Links for the day
Links 10/03/2026: Rust Rewrites by Slop "20,171 Times Slower", "You MUST Review LLM-generated Code"
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Monday, March 09, 2026
IRC logs for Monday, March 09, 2026
Attacks on Techrights Make Techrights Stronger and Attract More Whistleblowers to Techrights
The harder they attack us, the more productive we become
The Register MS Has Just Taken Money From Google (Where the Former Chief Editor Now Works) for Femmewashing and Ponzi Scheme Promotion
now The Register MS not only promotes a Ponzi scheme but also bags money to pretend Google respects women
People at IBM Are Still Smart Enough to Understand What's Really Going on
"I would never refer someone to work at IBM that I liked! I hope all of you have reviewed IBM on Glassdoor."
European Patent Office (EPO) to "Eventually Eliminate the Tasks Performed by Formalities Officers"; EPO Run by People Without Experience in Patents
full paper
RMS is 73 Next Week
Richard Matthew Stallman (RMS) turns 73 exactly 7 days from now
Iran & FSFE: blackmailing women, from football to the French Government (CNIL)
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
An American War on GNU/Linux, Software Freedom, and British Investigative, Science-Based Reporting - Part III - Very Strong Legal Basis for an Appeal
The case is now being escalated to a Foreign Secretary and former Deputy Prime Minister
Police investigations, lawsuits & Debian leader election candidate shortage
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Richard Stallman (RMS) Has Defeated Cancel Culture, a Mostly American Phenomenon
RMS is talking now
No Slop Found in RSS Feeds, Only in Google News
No slopfarm will survive for very long, certainly it'll go bust as soon as readers (if it had any) know what it is
Links 09/03/2026: Many Security Breaches and a Pandemic of Censorship
Links for the day
People Who Work or Worked at IBM Hate It
bluewashing is only the first step
Richard Stallman (RMS) Talks in 30 Minutes, Next Stop Bern (Last Stop)
We assume he'll travel back to Boston after that
IBM's Fedora as a Booster of Slop Disguised as Code or Computer Programs
Maybe we should also stop seeing a doctor and instead ask chatbots about symptoms?
Richard Stallman (RMS) Talk Five Hours From Now
there is growing recognition for what he really did for everybody
What the Solicitors Regulation Authority (SRA) and Action Fraud UK Have in Common
Don't let London become the world's "crime capital"
EPO Strike 10 Days From Now, Planning Assembly Tomorrow, Last Couple of Strikes Had High Participation Rates (1,500-1,600 Staff Went on Strike)
The next strike is in 10 days' time and then there will be another strike
Dr. Andy Farnell on How GAFAM, NVIDIA and Others Lie to People Via the Sponsored Media to Prop Up Lies Under the Guise of "AI"
Lots of key aspects are covered
Links 09/03/2026: GAFAM Outsourcing, "MAGA Political Meddling" in EU, Indonesia Bans Social Control Media for Children Under 16
Links for the day
Using Slop (and Slop in Articles) to Attack Copyleft 'on Budget'
This article is pure BS from an anti-GPL and anti-RMS 'activist'
Why The Register MS Sold Out to Microsoft: They're Losing Lots of Money, The Register MS is Bleeding to Death, Based on Its Own Financial Records
With over 6 million pounds in debt (nearly 10 million US dollars) we guess it's likely some other company will take over the site (if it deems it worthwhile)
Microsofters' SLAPP Censorship - Part 7 Out of 200: Like With the Serial Strangler From Microsoft, Misuse of UK-GDPR to Try to Hide Embarrassing Facts
They do and say really bad things, then allege it's a "privacy violation" to mention those things
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, March 08, 2026
IRC logs for Sunday, March 08, 2026
Gemini Links 09/03/2026: Exponentials and Tailscale
Links for the day
Sloppyleft
Article by Alexandre Oliva