Tha*k You Too, Joseph
- Dr. Roy Schestowitz
- 2008-12-28 15:28:04 UTC
- Modified: 2008-12-28 15:28:04 UTC
"Know what? Fuck it, and fuck you. I’m done."
--jo Shields
Recent Techrights' Posts
- This War Crime Footage, Nothing Political Per Se, Is What They Made Julian Assange Plead Guilty To (War Criminals Not Convicted, Only Those Who Expose Them)
- Wikileaks' Julian Assange: Exposing the US Military Crimes
- 20 Years Passed, Let's Go Even Faster Now
- We are hoping to bring more original stories
- Windows Lost Almost 92% Market Share in Egypt
- From over 99% to just over 7%
- Android at 90% or More in Chad
- Windows below 2%
- Julian Assange Might Continue Wikileaks, But Certainly Not Yet (Recovery Time Needed)
- And probably at a symbolic capacity only
-
- [Meme] Walking Outside the Guardrails of the Walled Gardens Built by Monopolies
- So-called "advertiser-unfriendly" material was never a problem for Wikileaks
- GNU/Linux Climbed 0.25% This Month (in statCounter)
- Around midday on Tuesday we'll start seeing preliminary data for July
- Ilya Gulko Introduces Pollyanna
- "Pollyanna is a web framework that makes it easy to create your own libre social space, such as a social network or blog."
- 'FSFE': Underage Labour, GAFAM Fronting, and Identity Theft to Undermine the FSF's Current Fundraiser
- looking to raise funds at the same time as the FSF
- Over at Tux Machines...
- GNU/Linux news for the past day
- IRC Proceedings: Saturday, June 29, 2024
- IRC logs for Saturday, June 29, 2024
- Links 29/06/2024: Astronauts at Risk, Ukraine Updates
- Links for the day
- Fedora and Red Hat Leftovers
- mostly redhat.com
- Microsoft is Now Googlebombing or Spamming 'Open Source' and 'Linux' to Promote Proprietary Surveillance, Azure
- Notice the title and the image, what's being promoted etc.
- Seychelles: GNU/Linux Doing OK
- Seychelles cannot be considered poor
- Gemini Protocol Isn't Even Remotely "Dead"
- "Lupa knows of 505,000 (half a million!) working Gemini URLs at present, up from about 425,000 this time last year"
- About 10 New Free Software Foundation (FSF) Members Per Day
- The total changed from 46 to 47 while typing the article
- Vista 11 Adoption Unusually Low in Germany and It's Going Down, Not Up
- This is not happening only in Germany
- Kevin Korte on Computers Being Allowed to Make Decisions Based on Cryptic Algorithms and Proprietary/Secret Data
- It uses buzzwords where none are needed
- [Meme] Garbage In, Garbage Out (linuxsecurity.com)
- It is neither Linux nor security, just chatbot-generated slop
- Microsoft-Invaded CISA Spreads Anti-Free Software FUD (as If Proprietary Software Has No Memory Safety Issues), Brittany Day Uses Chatbots to Amplify and Permutate the Microsoft FUD
- linuxsecurity.com became an anti-Linux spam site
- Microsoft Laying Off Staff in an Act of Retaliation and Union-Busting
- retaliatory layoffs at Microsoft
- Gemini Links 29/06/2024: Content Drowning in 'Goo' and LLM Slop
- Links for the day
- In Ecuador, GNU/Linux Adoption Surged From Under 1% to Over 4% in About 3 Years
- Not even counting Chromebooks
- LibrePlanet: Cultivating Backups (of Recordings)
- an appeal to recover some of these talks
- Microsoft/Windows Machines Are Turned Off (or Windows Deleted/Decommissioned) in Web Servers, as the "Market Share" Collapse Continues
- Taking full history into account, this is a decrease of over 90% in some cases
- Corwin Brust Hosting Freedom: A Behind-the-scenes Tour With the GNU Savannah Hackers
- "the "smiling faces" behind it."
- David Wilson: Cultivating a Welcoming Free Software Community That Lasts
- "a feeling of shared ownership for all users."
- Bringing in 12 Santas and Taking 13 Out (Old Interview With Julian Assange)
- Julian Assange's life inside the Ecuadorian embassy
- Neil Plotnick on GNU/Linux in the High School Classroom
- uploaded to the LibrePlanet instance of MediaGoblin
- Asia Appears to be Fastest to Adopt GNU/Linux
- the home of a considerable majority of the world's population
- Alexandre Oliva's LibrePlanet 2024 Talk About "Software Enshittification"
- in spite of technical difficulties encountered while recording
- What They Used to Do With Mono They Now Do With Systemd (Lower and Deeper Down Than Userspace)
- Now we have a project started primarily by Red Hat (and managed by Microsoft GitHub, which is proprietary) being managed by Microsoft and primarily serving Microsoft and IBM
- Over at Tux Machines...
- GNU/Linux news for the past day
- IRC Proceedings: Friday, June 28, 2024
- IRC logs for Friday, June 28, 2024
- Links 28/06/2024: Kangaroo Courts and Patents Spam, EFF Still Fighting for CPC's TikTok (a Digital Weapon)
- Links for the day
- Links 28/06/2024: Overton window and Polarization
- Links for the day
- [Meme] In 50 Years...
- Microsoft's Vista 11 will take 50 years to be fully adopted
- Only About 1 in 8 Russian Windows Users is Using Vista 11
- it looks like over the past 12 months Vista 11 hardly grew and it remains very low at around 12% of Windows usage in Russia
- Links 28/06/2024: More Attacks on the Press, More Censorship in Russia
- Links for the day
- Gemini Links 28/06/2024: Christmas Prematurely, Self-hosting
- Links for the day
- IBM: So Long, Suckers. Your Free OS is Now Proprietary. Pay IBM or Else.
- almost exactly a year after turning RHEL into proprietary software
- Vista 11 is Doomed and Despite Lack of Adoption Microsoft Already Speaks of Vapourware ("12")
- "Microsoft has pulled a Windows 11 update after users reported boot loops and startup failures."
- ChromeOS Reaches Highest Share in Years at the World's Most Populous Nation, Windows Now at All-Time Low of 13%
- We're talking about India today
- [Video] "It Is Incredible That Julian Assange Survives"
- There was a positive and mutual relationship between Wikileaks and Dr Jill Stein
- Never Assume That Because the Law Exists the Powerful Will Follow the Law
- Who's going to hold them accountable now?
- Nearly a Month Has Passed and Nobody at the Debian Project Even Attempted to Explain What Seems Like Back-dooring of Debian (and Hundreds of Distros That Are Debian-Derived)
- I can cynically guess that only matters when a user with a Chinese name does it
- [Video] Julian Assange Explains Wikileaks' Logistics
- predating indefinite detention
- IBM Was Never the "Good Guy", Just a Self-Serving and Opportunistic Money- and Power-Hungry Monopolist, Living Off of Taxpayers' Money (Government Contracts)
- The Nazi Party of Germany was its second-biggest client at one point and now it's looking to profit from the work of slaves
- "I Hated Working at IBM. They Were the Most Unfriendly People."
- Don't forget what Watson the son did to a poor woman on a plane
- State of the News (and Depletion of Journalism Online, Not Just Offline)
- Newspapers are not coming back and the Web is not coming back either
- GNU/Linux Consolidates in North America
- Android rising a lot this year, too
- [Meme] More Monopolies Granted While Patent Examiners Die (Overworking for Less Compensation)
- Work more; Get less
- Staff Union of the EPO (SUEPO) is Taking the New Pension Scheme (NPS) to an International Tribunal (ILOAT)
- SUEPO wants more EPO staff to participate in collective action
- Stella Assange and the Legal Team Speak to the Media a Day After WikiLeaks Founder Julian Assange Arrives in Australia
- Published yesterday by a number of mainstream publishers
- Over at Tux Machines...
- GNU/Linux news for the past day
- IRC Proceedings: Thursday, June 27, 2024
- IRC logs for Thursday, June 27, 2024
- RIP Daniel Bristot de Oliveira, Red Hat death
- Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Comments
Diamond Wakizashi
2008-12-28 16:13:05
Shane Coyle
2008-12-28 16:13:51
This all way-too-closely resembles "Fight Club" for me - when we had folks in India being arrested over Novell protests, or whatever that was, I really had to rethink where this was all headed.
I was recently invited to take a look through the archives, and frankly - more often than not - the "peanut gallery" was/is right. I haven't spent nearly enough time here to properly guide the site in the direction I wanted.
Lately, it seems the program is to eradicate all contrary opinion, even those who are armed with facts, and to cajole and antagonize them - accusing them of astroturfing or worse, all the while ignoring their facts until they finally give up and leave, muttering to themselves.
I wanted to take part in intelligent discussions on the Microsoft-Novell deal and it's subtle (yet severe) implications. Guess I'll have to go to slashdot for that... So, just pull my pic from the front page - leave my articles for the archives, although I suppose this comment will not make it through the new censorship policy.
Have a happy New Year to all, I'm going away until after the 5th. After that, perhaps I will stop in to see what y'all have done with the place.
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-28 16:35:09
The Novell deal has always been a controversial one and to expect no backlash here is to also expect no backlash from a site like Groklaw. Because Novell was 'closer' to the community than SCO was prior to the act means that there are some folks who are not sure what to think.
If we were not on target, then we would not have one of the better-known pro-GNU/Linux sites list us among top blogs of 2008.
Josh Bell
2008-12-28 16:37:20
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-28 16:40:01
You've always just heckled this Web site. it's not as though you changed your mind.
Ian
2008-12-28 16:50:27
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-28 17:00:19
They are not pro Microsoft, but by failing to recognise how Microsoft tries to weaken Free software (e.g. by changing the meaning of "open source", demanding payments for patents, etc.) they allow themselves to be led to the point where they actually help Microsoft cause damage. They just don't realise it yet. Remember that EEE comes in 3 phases. The first one is romanticism.
True, and we don't censor comments, despite some readers' suggestions that we do. Groklaw, on the other hand, does censor comments and PJ advised me to do the same here (but I don't, because I'm no Beranger and I'm open to discussion).
There are some characters here who come only to attack readers and messengers. Their intention is to have others agonise and to make things unpleasant for everyone.
AlexH
2008-12-28 17:03:49
But there is so much dross and so many attacks on minorities in the free software community, I do wish that would stop. You can believe that Mono isn't going to eat people's babies without being a Microsoft "shill".
I'm sad to see Shane go. I remember a number of recent converations we've had and I would have liked to see more articles from someone other than Roy. With just Roy reposting stuff, it is a blog which just tries to achieve quantity by reposting anything matching a few keywords. People can use Google Alerts and get the exact same stuff.
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-28 17:18:46
AlexH
2008-12-28 17:35:54
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-28 17:38:14
Well, it's not an article.
AlexH
2008-12-28 18:11:31
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-28 20:18:35
By the way, we've received so much comment spam recently (over 500 a day) and it took too long to check, so I disabled new comments for posts before Xmas. I hope Shane won't mind.
G. Michaels
2008-12-28 23:19:58
Judging from what he just said, I don't think he will. At all.
Is this the point where you start insinuating he might work for Microsoft, invoke glitzy-sounding quotes, call him a shill and a heckler and unleash your attack poodles on him, or does that come later? Funny red text cannot be far behind :)
Note: writer of this comment adds absolutely nothing but stalking and personal attacks against readers, as documented here.
Dan O'Brian
2008-12-29 01:01:27
Dan O'Brian
2008-12-29 01:02:37
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 01:17:25
As for Shane, he too was attacked by readers who cursed back in the early days. There is no way to run such a site with such a statement and name without a level of friction.
G. Michaels
2008-12-29 01:25:58
Yes well, that's certainly one way to spin it.
I am left wondering though, why he didn't do this through an email or some other sort of private communication instead of a very public statement?
I can almost picture you desperately pulling up the WP admin interface to check the IP address on that post and suddenly realizing your worst fear :)
Note: writer of this comment adds absolutely nothing but stalking and personal attacks against readers, as documented here.
twitter
2008-12-29 05:43:16
Novell had people in India arrested, not Boycott Novell, of course. If that really is you Shane, shame on yourself for not paying enough attention to Roy to be able to understand him before condeming him. Roy has made this place a real resource and deserves better than this.
Todd Razuri
2008-12-29 07:22:35
And I don't see how that comment was condemning anything. You and Roy really need to get over yourselves. The credibility of this site is going down the drain fast, along with the traffic I'm sure.
stevetheFLY
2008-12-29 12:26:48
Note: comment has been flagged for arriving from an incarnation of a known (eet), pseudonymous, forever-nymshifting, abusive Internet troll that posts from open proxies and relays around the world.
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 14:05:29
No, it's not a fake. Shane and I will discuss it by E-mail.
Just some minor clarifications/corrections:
* There is no moderation policy and we never deleted comments (a few were delayed because they were in the filter).
* The protest in India had nothing to do with us. I didn't even know about until after it had happened.
I understand that running this site comes with a degree of liability, so I can understand why Shane feels this way. If you look at Groklaw's members-only post (in the front page), then you'll see that PJ had similar concerns. She hasn't posted in almost one month.
Shane Coyle
2008-12-29 14:48:05
Liability concerns aside, of which there are many, this post in particular seemed to exemplify how this site has degenerated more into personal attacks and arguments in both directions than substantive discussions on the issues.
Maybe I just desperately need a vacation. See y'all on the 5th (and it is me ).
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 14:56:27
twitter
2008-12-29 15:48:49
Have a good time on vacation Shane, I hope it gives you the reset you need to recognize the Slog against BN. When you come back, try hanging out in IRC where the real discussion and back and forth takes place. Hecklers get the boot there and the discusions are sane and friendly without them. You can look at the heckler histories to see that the abuse and nit pick to fact ratio is close to unity and from that you might understand Roy's attitude. The more you read of Roy's material, the better you think of his credibility. A casual observer is easily misled.
The solution to M$ heckling is not to shut down, it's to publish more. The more sites there are, the more costly it is for M$ to spam them all. The defeat of Groklaw and Technocrat free those resources for attacks against Slashdot, Boycott Novell and other sites.
I can respect you not wanting to be involved in this Shane but I don't think Fight Club jokes are funny. That is exactly the image M$ would like to project on Boycott Novell and free software advocates in general. Coverage of free software, the fight against software patents, OOXML and other corruption all point to the main thrust of Roy's work and show that the site is positive reinforcement for the free software community. There's no other site out there collecting as much useful information as Roy does. Why would you want to compare that to Fight Club - a hapless handfull of people beating the crap out of each other on the directions of an insane person? Because one or two professional hecklers say so?
twitter
2008-12-29 15:50:54
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 17:18:34
1. I've just been told that PJ might permanently step out of Groklaw.
2. We don't kick hecklers out of IRC. twitter was incorrect where he was suggesting this, but hecklers just don't choose IRC as the medium for heckling.
3. I receive E-mails from very important people whom I can't name. Although they never comment, they agree with what I publish here and commend it.
Here is is message I received half an hour ago. I don't know how you'll interpret it, but take it as it is.
"I read, first with alarm and then with relief, Shane's recent posts on BN. His first post gave the impression that he no longer supports you and that he blames you for the seemingly endless threads which degenerate to insults. In that case, I would consider that an overreaction. It seems to me that someone probably wrote to him to complain, he scanned the archives and made an initial quick assessment that he thought your detractors were factually right on a frequent basis. His quick assessment may even be correct, but I personally haven't kept track of that because it's not important to me to keep any kind of score."
"Overall, I consider that the hecklers sometimes make valid points but those points often do not invalid your overall argument. In those cases, it doesn't hurt to concede their point. More often, they are only trying to convey their opinion and, when you don't agree, they get frustrated and start repeated ad hominem attacks in hopes that some may be impressed by their sheer repetition and that you would lose credibility. They likely justify themselves by thinking that "the opposition is no better." The trouble is that they cheapen their own arguments and they lose credibility themselves. You haven't lowered yourself to their level, but their behaviour does cause a problem because it lowers the level of discourse on the forum.
"I wish I knew the proper responce. I was a bit heartened by Shane's most recent post where he clarifies himself. I hope that, once he meditates on things some more, that he can have some constructive ideas on how to raise the level of discussion in the forum. The answer is not easy because there are some who only want to disrupt the forum and there are some others who have some vested interests and are not receptive to the ideas that Novell and Microsoft are behaving improperly, that contributing to Mono/go-oo is harmful, etc. Perhaps the answer is to continue to take the high road and leave the insults to others. Whatever you decide, I continue to support your effort."
homburg-hansen
2008-12-29 17:34:03
My guess is, they are so utterly unimportant that you'd rather not tell.
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 17:39:13
homburg-hansen
2008-12-29 17:43:45
'Very important people' and 'afraid' doesn't go together well, does it?
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 17:51:28
Discrediting by exaggeration. Well known troll tactic...
homburg-hansen
2008-12-29 18:15:32
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 18:15:59
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 18:19:39
Well, I hardly believe you ever read the Web site because you never commented here before.
I also find it curious that many of those who come here with negativity are geographical neighbours of S.u.S.E (Germany).
Ian
2008-12-29 18:39:31
The Eagles knocked the Cowboys out of playoff contention last night too. I don't see how either are relevant.
At any rate, I don't blame her. Groklaw had a focus and did a very good job at reporting on facts and deciphering much of the legal cruft for us layman. With SCO basically a smoldering heap and everything on that topic pretty much wrapped up or being tied off, I'd probably walk away too.
twitter
2008-12-29 20:39:21
Roy Schestowitz
2008-12-29 20:44:53
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sockpuppet_(Internet)
"The key difference between a sockpuppet and a regular pseudonym (sometimes termed an "alt" which is short for alternate, as in alternate identity) is the pretense that the puppet is a third party who is not affiliated with the puppeteer."
Chris
2008-12-31 19:49:48
But hey, you just annoyed one of "the regular hecklers" who dared to point out some incorrect claims and even tried to argue with you based on facts. No wonder he got totally fed up with that mission impossible. How the hell could he dare? Good job Boy!
Last but not least I had a good laugh when you pointed "twitter" to the sockpuppet definition. I mean, he is pretty much the inventor of sockpuppets. His trolling on slashdot is so notorious that every post about twitter (the service) has more replies talking about twitter (the troll)
See http://slashdot.org/~SockDisclosure/journal/214377 for details.
Will
2009-01-01 16:56:21
C.J.
2009-01-05 23:10:22
I think this site brings up some important points, but I think maybe there's a little "aluminum hat" syndrome going on as well.
I hope Shane's departure has a positive effect on the blog, but I have a feeling we're in for more of the same...
Roy Schestowitz
2009-01-05 23:16:43
Show me where I was rude to people who only come here to heckle endlessly. If I am doubtful about people who get their wage from Microsoft, who is to blame?
G. Michaels
2009-01-06 00:11:53
Have you noticed you have an unfortunate tendency to invariably respond to people with the wrong questions?
Note: writer of this comment adds absolutely nothing but stalking and personal attacks against readers, as documented here.