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| oiaohm | Problem is longer the battle goes on the more distruption people will see. | Apr 10 09:54 |
|---|---|---|
| MinceR | i haven't noticed any of it. | Apr 10 09:55 |
| oiaohm | Most distruptions lass less than 2 mins. | Apr 10 09:55 |
| oiaohm | lass/last | Apr 10 09:55 |
| oiaohm | So yes is very simple to miss it happening MinceR | Apr 10 09:55 |
| MinceR | ic | Apr 10 09:56 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: or several hours | Apr 10 09:57 |
| oiaohm | Note the word most. | Apr 10 09:57 |
| oiaohm | Some people are in worse locations than others | Apr 10 09:57 |
| oiaohm | Problem is average distruption time is growning the longer this battle goes on. | Apr 10 09:58 |
| oiaohm | Also does not help that Conficker virus numbers are growing at the moment as well either. | Apr 10 09:59 |
| oiaohm | Contanment is failing. | Apr 10 09:59 |
| MinceR | well, the worse it gets the greater the chance that several people realize what sorts of problems putting themselves at risk by using windows leads to. | Apr 10 10:00 |
| MinceR | stupid people don't understand potential problems until those are realized and they suffer because of them. | Apr 10 10:01 |
| oiaohm | If it gets bad enough only option will be to ban windows machine from entering the network. | Apr 10 10:01 |
| oiaohm | What would really screw MS. | Apr 10 10:01 |
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| MinceR | indeed | Apr 10 10:03 |
| DaemonBSOD | I'm playing with Windows 7 | Apr 10 10:04 |
| DaemonBSOD | it's crashed 6 times so far | Apr 10 10:04 |
| MinceR | :) | Apr 10 10:04 |
| MinceR | in how much time? | Apr 10 10:04 |
| DaemonBSOD | oh, about 5 hours | Apr 10 10:04 |
| DaemonBSOD | I just got the leaked 7077 build | Apr 10 10:04 |
| DaemonBSOD | I'm scanning it for viruses | Apr 10 10:05 |
| DaemonBSOD | I'm on 7057 right now | Apr 10 10:05 |
| DaemonBSOD | I'm not really amused by it | Apr 10 10:05 |
| DaemonBSOD | they could have probably called it Vista SE and nobody would have argued | Apr 10 10:05 |
| MinceR | or Vista SP3 | Apr 10 10:06 |
| DaemonBSOD | I'm not really seeing any terribly important changes vs. Vista | Apr 10 10:06 |
| DaemonBSOD | and a hell of a lot more bugs | Apr 10 10:06 |
| DaemonBSOD | they made the task bar work more like the OS X dock | Apr 10 10:07 |
| DaemonBSOD | that's about it | Apr 10 10:07 |
| DaemonBSOD | it still feels like counterfeit Leopard meets Windows XP | Apr 10 10:07 |
| DaemonBSOD | on the plus side it did detect a few pieces of hardware that Vista didn't | Apr 10 10:08 |
| DaemonBSOD | I didn't need to go hunt down any drivers at all | Apr 10 10:08 |
| MinceR | i've heard they copied kde this time | Apr 10 10:08 |
| DaemonBSOD | no, it works better than KDE | Apr 10 10:09 |
| DaemonBSOD | but not as well as GNOME or the OS X GUI | Apr 10 10:09 |
| MinceR | oh, i forgot you religiously hated kde | Apr 10 10:09 |
| DaemonBSOD | mmhm | Apr 10 10:09 |
| DaemonBSOD | I would say that Windows 7 is preferable to KDE | Apr 10 10:09 |
| DaemonBSOD | if KDE was my only choice on Linux I probably would just pay for Windows and get it over with, lol | Apr 10 10:10 |
| DaemonBSOD | actually the GUI on 7 is not bad, it's just not the best I've seen | Apr 10 10:10 |
| oiaohm | Tested the secuirty yet. | Apr 10 10:11 |
| oiaohm | Its still swiss cheese. | Apr 10 10:11 |
| DaemonBSOD | meh, Windows security problems sit between the keyboard and the chair | Apr 10 10:11 |
| DaemonBSOD | usually it comes from running keygens and fake porn codecs | Apr 10 10:11 |
| MinceR | the user who decided to install windows? | Apr 10 10:11 |
| MinceR | (or to buy a machine with it preinstalled and not to wipe it) | Apr 10 10:12 |
| DaemonBSOD | no, but you can't just run software from wherever and expect not to get a malicious program | Apr 10 10:12 |
| DaemonBSOD | the Windows virus problem has less to do with Windows and more to do with idiot users that run anything and everything they find on the internet | Apr 10 10:12 |
| MinceR | i could expect not to have a gazillion unnecessary open ports by default | Apr 10 10:12 |
| MinceR | or at least to have a relatively bugfree firewall covering them | Apr 10 10:13 |
| oiaohm | Under windows is fairly simple to get from normal user to admin. | Apr 10 10:13 |
| MinceR | i could also expect to be able to use the system as a non-admin user normally, and to have system files protected from writing then | Apr 10 10:13 |
| oiaohm | Even without passwords. | Apr 10 10:13 |
| DaemonBSOD | not really | Apr 10 10:13 |
| trmanco | loo | Apr 10 10:13 |
| trmanco | nice name | Apr 10 10:13 |
| MinceR | (this would need UAC to not be so full of holes.) | Apr 10 10:14 |
| DaemonBSOD | if you disable or password protect the Administrator account | Apr 10 10:14 |
| DaemonBSOD | and make everyone else a user | Apr 10 10:14 |
| DaemonBSOD | then you're fine | Apr 10 10:14 |
| oiaohm | Nop | Apr 10 10:14 |
| MinceR | except most windows apps won't run | Apr 10 10:14 |
| DaemonBSOD | yeah they do | Apr 10 10:14 |
| DaemonBSOD | UAC can run them as an administrator just like sudo | Apr 10 10:14 |
| oiaohm | There is a way into a user that can set the administrators password even create new admin users. | Apr 10 10:14 |
| MinceR | (but if you don't expect compatibility with shit like photoshop, why run windows at all?) | Apr 10 10:14 |
| oiaohm | Without UAC even seeing it. | Apr 10 10:14 |
| MinceR | except UAC isn't "just like sudo" | Apr 10 10:14 |
| oiaohm | UAC does not protect services. | Apr 10 10:15 |
| DaemonBSOD | you know, I haven't really seen UAC that much | Apr 10 10:15 |
| oiaohm | Yes UAC control users. | Apr 10 10:15 |
| DaemonBSOD | maybe once or twice since I set this up | Apr 10 10:15 |
| oiaohm | Then basically allow everything because not upsets users. | Apr 10 10:15 |
| DaemonBSOD | they've done a decent job of reducing the number of asinine UAC prompts | Apr 10 10:15 |
| oiaohm | They basically turned it off. | Apr 10 10:16 |
| DaemonBSOD | not really | Apr 10 10:16 |
| MinceR | that's what everyone did with vista ;) | Apr 10 10:16 |
| DaemonBSOD | it still comes up to install programs | Apr 10 10:16 |
| oiaohm | rundll3d | Apr 10 10:16 |
| DaemonBSOD | just not to mess around with your wifi connection | Apr 10 10:16 |
| oiaohm | rundll32 | Apr 10 10:16 |
| DaemonBSOD | as an example | Apr 10 10:16 |
| oiaohm | No warning. | Apr 10 10:16 |
| MinceR | probably the windows fanboys who keep saying "DURRR HURRR VISTA UAC OMGSECURE" did too | Apr 10 10:16 |
| oiaohm | straight to system user. | Apr 10 10:16 |
| DaemonBSOD | brb | Apr 10 10:16 |
| DaemonBSOD | installing 7077 | Apr 10 10:17 |
| oiaohm | where you can change eveyrthing. | Apr 10 10:17 |
| oiaohm | Installer programs could get smart really. | Apr 10 10:17 |
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| MinceR | users could get smart | Apr 10 10:17 |
| MinceR | and avoid windows | Apr 10 10:17 |
| trmanco | hahah reboot | Apr 10 10:17 |
| oiaohm | services are key to protect. | Apr 10 10:17 |
| oiaohm | Basically anything running with powers of root or equal is key to protect. | Apr 10 10:18 |
| oiaohm | Windows 7 still manages to completely miss that point. | Apr 10 10:18 |
| oiaohm | http://www.jboss.org/teiid0/basics/... << Ok we have database glue. | Apr 10 10:31 |
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| _Hicham_ | Hi Roy! | Apr 10 10:35 |
| schestowitz | Hey | Apr 10 10:38 |
| schestowitz | Yes, Vista7 is less secure than Vista | Apr 10 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Underneath the model remains the same, but with less UAC nags | Apr 10 10:41 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft never touted Vista7 for security, despite the fact that Vista too was a security disaster | Apr 10 10:41 |
| schestowitz | It's all marketing (perceptions) | Apr 10 10:41 |
| _Hicham_ | Microsoft will never release a secure platform | Apr 10 10:51 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft Linux? (SUSE) | Apr 10 10:51 |
| MinceR | that's what i was going to say. | Apr 10 10:51 |
| trmanco | it's not microsoft's | Apr 10 10:52 |
| trmanco | they can't "own" it | Apr 10 10:52 |
| trmanco | at least parts of it (SUSE) | Apr 10 10:53 |
| _Hicham_ | SuSe will be owned by schestowitz afterwards | Apr 10 11:05 |
| trmanco | Susy? | Apr 10 11:06 |
| trmanco | :-p | Apr 10 11:06 |
| _Hicham_ | oiaohm : why r u silent? | Apr 10 11:08 |
| oiaohm | Away for keyboard of course _Hicham_ | Apr 10 11:13 |
| _Hicham_ | oiaohm : do u think that OpenGL should go OO ? | Apr 10 11:16 |
| _Hicham_ | just like DirectX? | Apr 10 11:16 |
| _Hicham_ | and leave the C interface? | Apr 10 11:16 |
| oiaohm | Gallium3d wins | Apr 10 11:16 |
| oiaohm | Stuff building backend dependant on Opengl or directx built a netural backend. | Apr 10 11:17 |
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| oiaohm | Really in time you will be able to have as many 3d framework assistance engines as you like. | Apr 10 11:18 |
| oiaohm | Object Orrented programming suits some developments and not others. | Apr 10 11:18 |
| oiaohm | Gallium3d really if someone wants to they could port Direct X interfaces to Linux. | Apr 10 11:20 |
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| MinceR | trmanco: not owning something never stopped m$ from selling it. | Apr 10 11:57 |
| trmanco | MinceR, then they get sued | Apr 10 11:57 |
| trmanco | ... | Apr 10 11:57 |
| MinceR | they have an army of lawyers | Apr 10 11:58 |
| MinceR | also, sometimes they bribed the one who discovered it (at least once) | Apr 10 11:59 |
| trmanco | yes, but that can't go on forever | Apr 10 12:00 |
| MinceR | well, they're dying already | Apr 10 12:03 |
| trmanco | yeah, soon they will start bribing with $1 | Apr 10 12:04 |
| oiaohm | Patent losses increase the min price of windows. | Apr 10 12:04 |
| _Hicham_ | oiaohm : port DirectX interfaces to Linux? | Apr 10 12:05 |
| trmanco | wine does that | Apr 10 12:05 |
| oiaohm | Gallium3d is netural interface. | Apr 10 12:05 |
| oiaohm | That can be just as simply used for opengl 2.0 opengl 3.0 as it can for Direct X | Apr 10 12:06 |
| oiaohm | Wine depends on wrapping to opengl. | Apr 10 12:06 |
| oiaohm | That has its limitations because some interall structs of cards are off limits. | Apr 10 12:06 |
| _Hicham_ | so it will use Wine emulation layer? | Apr 10 12:08 |
| _Hicham_ | which is not native... | Apr 10 12:09 |
| oiaohm | Gallium3d is basically native interface to video card. | Apr 10 12:36 |
| oiaohm | Gallium3d provided emulation to features missing from cards as well. | Apr 10 12:36 |
| oiaohm | So wine and others like it wanting to emulatate Direct X can have just has much direct hardware access using Gallium3d as on windows. | Apr 10 12:37 |
| oiaohm | Thinking that Gallium3d is designed to be the layer between Direct X and Video card on Windows as well. | Apr 10 12:37 |
| oiaohm | The world of Linux is changing. | Apr 10 12:39 |
| _Hicham_ | the packaging thing isn't really a problem by the way | Apr 10 12:47 |
| _Hicham_ | checkinstall solve it completely | Apr 10 12:47 |
| oiaohm | Not on all distributions. | Apr 10 12:50 |
| oiaohm | ISV's want a single installer for all. | Apr 10 12:50 |
| _Hicham_ | at least on Fedora and Debian | Apr 10 12:51 |
| oiaohm | Gentoo and edges missed. | Apr 10 12:51 |
| _Hicham_ | they are the major distros | Apr 10 12:52 |
| _Hicham_ | Gentoo can do it | Apr 10 12:53 |
| oiaohm | ISV are not interested in just Major. | Apr 10 12:53 |
| oiaohm | They want the lot. | Apr 10 12:53 |
| oiaohm | 1 package if its Linux it works basically. | Apr 10 12:54 |
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| amarsh04 | back soon, rebooting for new X server and kernel | Apr 10 13:34 |
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| schestowitz | Novell in trouble: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04... | Apr 10 13:48 |
| schestowitz | Novell influences the LF for MS tax: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/10/h... | Apr 10 13:49 |
| schestowitz | And looking deeper at xenocode: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/10/... | Apr 10 13:50 |
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| oiaohm | The opensuse built framework is not .net. Its one of the rare frameworks that works for building multiable distribution packages. | Apr 10 13:54 |
| PetoKraus | what happened to the IBM-Sun thing? | Apr 10 13:54 |
| PetoKraus | did it fail? or is it still under negotiations? | Apr 10 13:54 |
| oiaohm | IBM-Sun thing is still up in the air. | Apr 10 13:54 |
| PetoKraus | ok | Apr 10 13:54 |
| oiaohm | Failed then IBM reoffered. | Apr 10 13:54 |
| PetoKraus | Given how close Sun came to being acquired by IBM | Apr 10 13:54 |
| oiaohm | So far Sun has not answered. | Apr 10 13:54 |
| oiaohm | Ie IBM reoffered at lower price. | Apr 10 13:55 |
| PetoKraus | the past tense seems confusing | Apr 10 13:55 |
| PetoKraus | right | Apr 10 13:55 |
| PetoKraus | so IBM offered, Sun declined, and IBM reoffered at lower price? | Apr 10 13:55 |
| PetoKraus | or sun didn't reply at all | Apr 10 13:55 |
| PetoKraus | and IBM just changed the offer? | Apr 10 13:55 |
| oiaohm | Sun offered them selfs to IBM at a price. IBM deciliend now IBM has put back a offer. | Apr 10 13:55 |
| PetoKraus | aha | Apr 10 13:56 |
| PetoKraus | i thought it was IBM approaching sun | Apr 10 13:56 |
| PetoKraus | ... | Apr 10 13:56 |
| oiaohm | No | Apr 10 13:56 |
| oiaohm | Sun approiced Intel and Cisco systems first. | Apr 10 13:56 |
| oiaohm | Sun is basically selling themselves off. | Apr 10 13:56 |
| PetoKraus | yeah | Apr 10 13:56 |
| oiaohm | Do you want to know something funny about opensuse build service. There is no Visual studio or monodevelopment plugin for it. Its main coding language is bash. | Apr 10 14:04 |
| MinceR | i don't see anything wrong with that | Apr 10 14:05 |
| MinceR | except that it's *suse, of course :> | Apr 10 14:05 |
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| oiaohm | Plat membership in the Linux foundation costs a good block of cash. | Apr 10 14:07 |
| oiaohm | Its going be good to see if Novell is still there after middle of year. | Apr 10 14:08 |
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| schestowitz | oiaohm, PetoKraus yes, Sun still wants to be sold | Apr 10 14:18 |
| schestowitz | I reckon NOVL might have to do something similar | Apr 10 14:18 |
| schestowitz | Parallels won't matter much if Sun's example is anything to go by | Apr 10 14:18 |
| schestowitz | Novell has aligned itself as a good takeover target for Microsoft | Apr 10 14:18 |
| oiaohm | Let NOVL talk at the Linux foundation confrences is really good at getting themselves more hated | Apr 10 14:19 |
| MinceR | will buying Novell be a trigger for antitrust reexamination of MICROS~1? | Apr 10 14:19 |
| schestowitz | Yes | Apr 10 14:19 |
| schestowitz | But Microsoft controls em | Apr 10 14:19 |
| schestowitz | Remember what PearlyG said about the government | Apr 10 14:19 |
| schestowitz | He joked about controlling it | Apr 10 14:19 |
| MinceR | perhaps they'll be out of money to bribe the government by then | Apr 10 14:19 |
| schestowitz | Watch how they intercepted Google-Yahoo... | Apr 10 14:19 |
| schestowitz | While having no problem for themselves with yahoo! | Apr 10 14:20 |
| MinceR | then again, Corporate Puppet Obama has some men from m$ | Apr 10 14:20 |
| oiaohm | Platinum Membership (500,000USD) << That is what Linux foundation plat cost per year. | Apr 10 14:20 |
| schestowitz | The US/antitrust regulators are still practically owned by the commerce | Apr 10 14:20 |
| schestowitz | The question is, which company put which cronies in chanrge | Apr 10 14:20 |
| Eruaran | hello | Apr 10 14:20 |
| schestowitz | And then there's lobbying | Apr 10 14:20 |
| schestowitz | It's legalised bribery | Apr 10 14:20 |
| schestowitz | So you can turn people to your cronies | Apr 10 14:20 |
| schestowitz | Ziff Davis sold out to Microsoft Corporation, again: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/10/... | Apr 10 14:22 |
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| schestowitz | Is Microsoft AstroTurfing in Twitter (again)? http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04... | Apr 10 15:05 |
| schestowitz | Yuck. What are these people doing? A Twitter PR agency: Just what the world needs now < http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/0... > | Apr 10 15:08 |
| schestowitz | http://techdirt.com/artic... (The Pirate Bay's New Business Model Apparently Working Wonders) | Apr 10 15:13 |
| schestowitz | The new laws in Sweden appear to only be helping these chaps. "113,000 customers have already signed up for The Pirate Bay's new anonymous VPN service, which costs around $6/month. " | Apr 10 15:14 |
| schestowitz | So thanks to Swidish law they could have another revenue of almost a million dollars/per month | Apr 10 15:14 |
| oiaohm | Yep there is 113,000 people who need there computer raided. | Apr 10 15:14 |
| schestowitz | *Sweden *no slash in "per" | Apr 10 15:14 |
| oiaohm | Why do you need the vpn if you are downloading legal stuff. | Apr 10 15:15 |
| schestowitz | Slated: uses VPN | Apr 10 15:15 |
| schestowitz | He deserves his privacy | Apr 10 15:15 |
| schestowitz | If we don't defend our libarties, we lose them | Apr 10 15:15 |
| schestowitz | *liberties | Apr 10 15:15 |
| oiaohm | I mean to the bittorrent network. | Apr 10 15:15 |
| schestowitz | Don't let them use child pr0n/terror/"piracy" as reason to eavesdrop on EVERYTHING EVERYONE does | Apr 10 15:16 |
| schestowitz | That would be their wet dream -- pretending that checking every bit that goes through the wire is for 'security' | Apr 10 15:16 |
| schestowitz | And then have scum like Phorm sell it for profit | Apr 10 15:16 |
| oiaohm | vpn and encyption disadvantage blocks caching so making network more overloaded. | Apr 10 15:16 |
| oiaohm | So effecting everyone elses right to use the Internet. | Apr 10 15:17 |
| schestowitz | That would be an excude | Apr 10 15:17 |
| schestowitz | *excuse | Apr 10 15:17 |
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| schestowitz | Had they not sold our data, then--maybe then--would the Internet be assumed to bean honourable place | Apr 10 15:17 |
| oiaohm | Internet was never designed to be private. | Apr 10 15:18 |
| schestowitz | An Internet that makes profit from telling sharks all sorts of things about me (Phorm) is organised crime | Apr 10 15:18 |
| schestowitz | VPN can restore justice | Apr 10 15:18 |
| oiaohm | Cost vs gain. | Apr 10 15:18 |
| schestowitz | Phorm is the equivalent of a private company coming to visit your house every morning and going through your drawers, then telling anyone for a few pounds what it saw | Apr 10 15:19 |
| mib_a5l9wu | As for the question of whta happened between Michael Robertson and Kevin Carmony, this post on Carmony's blog explains why he quit: http://kevincarmony.blogspot.com/2008/12/... | Apr 10 15:19 |
| schestowitz | Hi, mib_a5l9wu | Apr 10 15:19 |
| schestowitz | Let me look... | Apr 10 15:19 |
| schestowitz | Is there coverage outside their blogs? | Apr 10 15:20 |
| schestowitz | Because someone asked me about it (unbiased sources as need) | Apr 10 15:20 |
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| mib_a5l9wu | Carmony references a court case, links to ruling | Apr 10 15:20 |
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| mib_a5l9wu | All the coverage at the time said Carmony was leaving to work on presidential campaign, I forget for whom (Paul maybe) | Apr 10 15:21 |
| mib_a5l9wu | But in his blog he explains the "real" reason, which I tend to believe, given that it ended up in court. | Apr 10 15:22 |
| mib_a5l9wu | In a nutshell, Robertson filed embezzlement charges against some employees who received severance payments. Employees were vindicated in court. | Apr 10 15:23 |
| schestowitz | mib_a5l9wu: wasn't there a dating busienss? | Apr 10 15:24 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: As a system admin I have a completely different idea of privacy. | Apr 10 15:24 |
| schestowitz | Some online thing which he said was *gasp* compatible with iPhone (Well, it's a damn Web page :-)) | Apr 10 15:24 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: please elaborate | Apr 10 15:25 |
| schestowitz | A Reader's Guide to Copyright < http://mbyerly.blogspot.com/2009/03... > | Apr 10 15:25 |
| schestowitz | Software Audits In India Block Companies From Backing Up Their Data, Claiming It's Infringement < http://www.techdirt.com/articles... > | Apr 10 15:26 |
| mib_a5l9wu | After Carmony left Linspire he started LifesDNA.com, which does have a dating piece. Dating DNA is part of Lifes DNA and yes, it is one of the most popular apps in Apple's app store. | Apr 10 15:29 |
| oiaohm | As a system admin you have to protect the rights of the all to get there work done. Privacy is not that high up there. Anything encrypted without need is a risk of losing data or costing network performance so effecting everyone. | Apr 10 15:31 |
| oiaohm | Is there really a true need for people to get access to pirated programs. From a business point of view no. From a virus prevention point of view no. | Apr 10 15:32 |
| oiaohm | By making the network encrypted you only give system admins 1 option. To block it all. | Apr 10 15:33 |
| oiaohm | So really what they are doing is reducing the general freedoms of all. | Apr 10 15:34 |
| schestowitz | mib_a5l9wu: I see. I thought it was Web based | Apr 10 15:37 |
| oiaohm | If there was no pirated people would be forced to turn to the genuine free stuff and possiable improve it. So express themselves freely not be restricted by corprate designs. | Apr 10 15:38 |
| schestowitz | I'm talking about excessive snooping | Apr 10 15:38 |
| schestowitz | Like Phorm | Apr 10 15:38 |
| oiaohm | So from a system admin point of view what pirate bay is doing is not protecting freedom. | Apr 10 15:38 |
| oiaohm | Instead restricting it. | Apr 10 15:38 |
| schestowitz | It serves no purpose other then to use people as tools of consumerism | Apr 10 15:38 |
| schestowitz | I.e. make them take more loans and buy stuff they don't need, among other things | Apr 10 15:39 |
| oiaohm | Using pirated software does that. | Apr 10 15:39 |
| schestowitz | It is unhealthy for any society to enter people's thoughts | Apr 10 15:39 |
| schestowitz | It's perverse because it demoralises people. | Apr 10 15:39 |
| oiaohm | When they work for a company boss will ask them what software does x job. | Apr 10 15:39 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: wrong point | Apr 10 15:39 |
| schestowitz | You are assuming things here | Apr 10 15:39 |
| oiaohm | Pirates will answer closed source. | Apr 10 15:39 |
| oiaohm | Not really. | Apr 10 15:39 |
| schestowitz | You assume that by snooping you'll stop illega sharing | Apr 10 15:40 |
| schestowitz | But this is baloney. | Apr 10 15:40 |
| schestowitz | People can swap stuff on tapes, USB disks, etc. | Apr 10 15:40 |
| schestowitz | You're just relocating the problem | Apr 10 15:40 |
| oiaohm | Now what is the main thing they need. | Apr 10 15:40 |
| schestowitz | Like fools who thought that kicking out prostitutes from Craigslist would end it | Apr 10 15:40 |
| oiaohm | Cracks. | Apr 10 15:41 |
| schestowitz | They just relocare | Apr 10 15:41 |
| oiaohm | Relocating it to media out side the network slows them down yes. | Apr 10 15:41 |
| oiaohm | Also removes them from being a cost on the network. | Apr 10 15:41 |
| oiaohm | So the mass gain. | Apr 10 15:41 |
| schestowitz | U2's manager wants the power to cut off your Internet connection < http://www.boingboing.net/2009/0... > | Apr 10 15:42 |
| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: Yes, it's web based (lifesdna.com) but they have apps for the Chumby, iPhone, etc. | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: people fear the unknown on the nwtwork | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | Like encrypted traffuc | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | But it's silly | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | Why/ | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | Well, because they don't hear what people say | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | They have no record of who people meet | Apr 10 15:42 |
| oiaohm | Not all encrypted traffic. | Apr 10 15:42 |
| schestowitz | So it's the illusion that people live in one single channel | Apr 10 15:42 |
| oiaohm | Encrypted traffic containing one of the biggest sources in computer virus trade around the world. | Apr 10 15:43 |
| oiaohm | Lot of pirated applications are infected. | Apr 10 15:43 |
| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: you an email carmony from his home page kevincarmony.com I've written to him before and he replied. | Apr 10 15:44 |
| oiaohm | Download pirated applications incresses you infection rates massively | Apr 10 15:44 |
| schestowitz | mib_a5l9wu: can you say how you related to it? | Apr 10 15:44 |
| schestowitz | tessier used to work for Robertson | Apr 10 15:44 |
| oiaohm | Mostly because people using pirated applications don't update them so they will not stop working. | Apr 10 15:44 |
| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: Lifes DNA is web based (lifesdna.com) but they have apps for chumby, iphone, etc. | Apr 10 15:45 |
| oiaohm | Its unknown that system admins know contain problems that users are blocking us from scanning. | Apr 10 15:45 |
| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: I worked at mp3.com | Apr 10 15:45 |
| schestowitz | mib_a5l9wu: did he leave the company? | Apr 10 15:45 |
| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: Yes, Carmony left a couple of years ago. That's what he explained in the link I sent: http://kevincarmony.blogspot.com/2... It's a pretty complete detail as to the events of his leaving. | Apr 10 15:46 |
| oiaohm | Last 3 infections in the network I run come from pirates. | Apr 10 15:47 |
| schestowitz | Lloyd-Webber hits out over downloads < http://www.ft.com/cms/s/ba9... > Fighting fans. | Apr 10 15:47 |
| schestowitz | schestowitz: I mean, the newer company | Apr 10 15:47 |
| schestowitz | Not Linspire | Apr 10 15:47 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: in boats? | Apr 10 15:47 |
| oiaohm | Software thiefs. We call them pirates for a reason. | Apr 10 15:48 |
| oiaohm | The normally enter our networks carring weapons in the forms of viruses being too dumb to know it. | Apr 10 15:48 |
| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: I just looked at www.kevincarmony.com and it looks like he's still doing DNA and some other projects. I know he does lots with indie music. He also worked at MP3.com. That's how he met Robertson. | Apr 10 15:48 |
| oiaohm | Come on some of these software thiefs are dumb enough to steal anti-virus software. So when that breaks they are left defenceless. There is more than enough free anti-virus software out there. | Apr 10 15:49 |
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| mib_a5l9wu | schestowitz: Looks like he authors DNA's blog http://blog.datingdna.com/ | Apr 10 15:51 |
| oiaohm | Anyone taking part in the illegal software trade should be shutdown simply to protect the stupid. | Apr 10 15:51 |
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| schestowitz | oiaohm: I was not talking about executables | Apr 10 15:54 |
| schestowitz | About copyrights applied to multimedia or text rather | Apr 10 15:54 |
| oiaohm | And they end up on torrent sites as compressed virus infected .exe for the stupid. | Apr 10 15:55 |
| schestowitz | Actually, it's interesting that copyright law applies to binaries now. | Apr 10 15:55 |
| oiaohm | Not like pirate bay includes filtering to prevent that. | Apr 10 15:55 |
| schestowitz | Stay out of my 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 0110 0100 1100 | Apr 10 15:55 |
| oiaohm | copyright law always had. | Apr 10 15:56 |
| oiaohm | Piratebay and the like don't deserve to stay alive. | Apr 10 15:57 |
| oiaohm | Reason why I would love to see those bank transfers used for raids so scaring the stupid away from them. | Apr 10 15:57 |
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| oiaohm | Do you not remember punch cards schestowitz | Apr 10 15:59 |
| schestowitz | Cringely rightly reckons Sun will sell itself cheap/ly: http://www.cringely.com/2009/04/... | Apr 10 15:59 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: nope | Apr 10 15:59 |
| schestowitz | I'm not old enough | Apr 10 15:59 |
| schestowitz | My cousin in Florida tells me she used em | Apr 10 15:59 |
| schestowitz | Some friends of mine have cards as memorabilia | Apr 10 16:00 |
| schestowitz | When will the Linux Foundation learn to stop feeding shills for hire? http://ostatic.com/blog/the-opportunit... | Apr 10 16:01 |
| oiaohm | Never schestowitz | Apr 10 16:02 |
| schestowitz | I know | Apr 10 16:04 |
| schestowitz | They act like Microsoft but against it | Apr 10 16:04 |
| schestowitz | GNU/FSF follows a more ethical guidelines that isn't like cutting-throat business. | Apr 10 16:05 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly. | Apr 10 16:05 |
| schestowitz | I'm not going to stand up (and voluntarily) for some company like IBM | Apr 10 16:05 |
| schestowitz | aka LF aka OIN... whatever | Apr 10 16:05 |
| oiaohm | They hope IDC screws up and releases two document counter to each other. | Apr 10 16:05 |
| oiaohm | So legally screwing themselves. | Apr 10 16:05 |
| schestowitz | To me, Linux promotes a goal broader than just 'replacing Windows | Apr 10 16:05 |
| oiaohm | Ie 1 document has to be fraud. | Apr 10 16:05 |
| schestowitz | If all we were trying to achieve is replace one OS with another, then might as well swap MS with Apple | Apr 10 16:06 |
| schestowitz | Two evil companies | Apr 10 16:06 |
| schestowitz | What was truly achieved then? | Apr 10 16:06 |
| schestowitz | Free agents for companies that make billions from DRM, WGA, DMCA takedowns, patent lawsuits... | Apr 10 16:06 |
| oiaohm | Problem you have to be aware of business don't care about freedom. | Apr 10 16:07 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: they do this all the time, IMHO | Apr 10 16:07 |
| schestowitz | Not negating in the scientific sense | Apr 10 16:07 |
| schestowitz | But contradicting depending on the client | Apr 10 16:07 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: some business /can/ | Apr 10 16:07 |
| oiaohm | Most don't. | Apr 10 16:07 |
| schestowitz | But that's what the movement can be about | Apr 10 16:07 |
| oiaohm | They care about getting the job done. | Apr 10 16:08 |
| schestowitz | yes, but let's not miss the point | Apr 10 16:08 |
| schestowitz | if the goal is ethics-related, then the goal is to change | Apr 10 16:08 |
| oiaohm | Linux foundation is not targeting home users. | Apr 10 16:08 |
| schestowitz | Like changing foreign affairs from being profit driven | Apr 10 16:08 |
| oiaohm | They are targeting business. | Apr 10 16:08 |
| oiaohm | Where the money is. | Apr 10 16:08 |
| schestowitz | As in, a country going to war to generate wealth for some companies that make arms | Apr 10 16:08 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: I know. | Apr 10 16:08 |
| oiaohm | Problem we have is a lot of business beleive IDC reports. | Apr 10 16:09 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: they can make money | Apr 10 16:09 |
| oiaohm | You might know they are crap. | Apr 10 16:09 |
| schestowitz | Making money does not encessarily mean comproising morality | Apr 10 16:09 |
| oiaohm | But I am sorry lot of dumb CEO's don't. | Apr 10 16:09 |
| schestowitz | That's just the key point | Apr 10 16:09 |
| schestowitz | And you can regulate to enfiorce this | Apr 10 16:09 |
| schestowitz | Like the Germans fines MS for collusion the other day | Apr 10 16:09 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: so these CEOs should be left to rot | Apr 10 16:10 |
| schestowitz | No bailout | Apr 10 16:10 |
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| schestowitz | No 'stimulus' | Apr 10 16:10 |
| schestowitz | The problem is that people who harm society are rewarded | Apr 10 16:10 |
| oiaohm | Do you know what happens inside companies as there operations turn open source. | Apr 10 16:10 |
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| schestowitz | They control the core of some systems | Apr 10 16:10 |
| schestowitz | Like those which reward franchises | Apr 10 16:10 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: user of developer? | Apr 10 16:11 |
| oiaohm | Lot of different companies start supporting projects. | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | So user *and* dev? | Apr 10 16:11 |
| oiaohm | So to add the features they need. | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | Yes, like in Apache | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | That's fine | Apr 10 16:11 |
| oiaohm | Yep in time. | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | It's sharinfg value | Apr 10 16:11 |
| oiaohm | But you have to get them in first. | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | Also reduction of waste | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | For sure, they need to be pulled into it | Apr 10 16:11 |
| oiaohm | When they start sharing they start learning the open soruce moralls. | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | That's why MS tried to hijack OSS | Apr 10 16:11 |
| schestowitz | To make more companies servants of MS code | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | with MS licences | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | So that Microsoft reaps their labours | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | *labour | Apr 10 16:12 |
| oiaohm | Ie Linux foundation is about getting them started. | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | It's not just code BTW | Apr 10 16:12 |
| oiaohm | So to you and me some of the things they do looks stupid. | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | Chemistry, medicine, biology, poetry, cuisine | Apr 10 16:12 |
| oiaohm | When they work so be it. | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | But sharing is daemonised by some | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | Like Microsoft... | Apr 10 16:12 |
| schestowitz | Like the MPAA.. | Apr 10 16:13 |
| oiaohm | IDC report worked well last year. | Apr 10 16:13 |
| schestowitz | Like UKIPO.. | Apr 10 16:13 |
| schestowitz | Their education goes like, if you have something valuable, keep it to yourself | Apr 10 16:13 |
| schestowitz | Contrariwise, some say you must share it ASAP | Apr 10 16:13 |
| schestowitz | Then you get credit | Apr 10 16:13 |
| schestowitz | Scientists for example | Apr 10 16:13 |
| schestowitz | Some abstain from sharing their ideas, so they get just ignored | Apr 10 16:13 |
| oiaohm | Open Source is based on science. | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: well, I won't shut up about the ISC report | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | *IDC | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | Nor did I last year | Apr 10 16:14 |
| oiaohm | I don't expect you to. | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | They ptomote hypocrisy | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | Fighting nukes with nukes. | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | Then come the likes of NPD | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | Lying about Linux market share | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | And the LF can't take higher moral ground | Apr 10 16:14 |
| schestowitz | Because that would be hypocritical. | Apr 10 16:15 |
| oiaohm | Linux Foundation does not ask for the numbers to be altered. | Apr 10 16:15 |
| oiaohm | Ok made look good but truthful. | Apr 10 16:15 |
| oiaohm | Yes truth lies and statistics. | Apr 10 16:15 |
| oiaohm | There are many ways to present statistics that are miss leading. | Apr 10 16:16 |
| oiaohm | Yet not have 1 single lie in there. | Apr 10 16:16 |
| oiaohm | It is something IDC is exceptionally good at. | Apr 10 16:16 |
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| Omar87 | Hi | Apr 10 16:17 |
| oiaohm | Linux Foundation only has a reason to use IDC as long as businesses trust IDC. | Apr 10 16:17 |
| schestowitz | Well, people should NOT trust them | Apr 10 16:18 |
| schestowitz | There is PROOF against it | Apr 10 16:18 |
| schestowitz | Showing bribes | Apr 10 16:18 |
| schestowitz | Showing pressure to change reports | Apr 10 16:18 |
| schestowitz | Showing Microsoft telling them what to do | Apr 10 16:18 |
| schestowitz | So it's basically Microsoft lies dressed up with someone else's name | Apr 10 16:19 |
| oiaohm | Really think of it this way. IDC is like advertising in a newspaper for business usage. | Apr 10 16:19 |
| schestowitz | And then they use IDC (their media offshoot) to pretend that IDC is the elite informationmaster | Apr 10 16:19 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: it is. An advert that's MISLEADING | Apr 10 16:19 |
| schestowitz | I wish to end this BS. | Apr 10 16:20 |
| oiaohm | And IDC has done a great job set them selfs up as the elite information master. | Apr 10 16:20 |
| schestowitz | Either by having them ignored (the better option) or shut down | Apr 10 16:20 |
| schestowitz | If they get ignored, they'll cease getting business | Apr 10 16:20 |
| oiaohm | Not using them blocks path into market. | Apr 10 16:20 |
| schestowitz | IOW small business can't bribe IDC and can't compete | Apr 10 16:20 |
| oiaohm | Breaking the crediblity that no one trusts IDC not even MS would use them. | Apr 10 16:20 |
| schestowitz | This makes IDC a door keeper that virtually accepts bribes | Apr 10 16:21 |
| schestowitz | To allow or deny entrants | Apr 10 16:21 |
| schestowitz | Nice, ain't it? :-)) | Apr 10 16:21 |
| oiaohm | IDC is a bad company that has got themselves into a key location. | Apr 10 16:21 |
| schestowitz | And as I said, there is lots in BN that shows IDC|MS bribery | Apr 10 16:21 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: it's unethical | Apr 10 16:21 |
| schestowitz | What you say is absurb in a way | Apr 10 16:22 |
| oiaohm | So is lots of business | Apr 10 16:22 |
| schestowitz | It's like saying the US is OK for being in Iraq where it has a key location for oil distribution | Apr 10 16:22 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: well, fine | Apr 10 16:22 |
| schestowitz | That does not contradict what I argued | Apr 10 16:23 |
| schestowitz | It's a strawman | Apr 10 16:23 |
| oiaohm | Problem here is doing business. | Apr 10 16:23 |
| oiaohm | A person who takes complete ethical path on who they will and will not deal with in business normally ends up out of business. | Apr 10 16:24 |
| schestowitz | Nope | Apr 10 16:24 |
| schestowitz | The problem here is deception for pay and presentation as unbiased source | Apr 10 16:24 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, but that's a bad thing | Apr 10 16:24 |
| schestowitz | This means that the corrupt survives | Apr 10 16:25 |
| schestowitz | Nice analysts who deliver turth don't | Apr 10 16:25 |
| schestowitz | So you end up with only sharks alive | Apr 10 16:25 |
| schestowitz | No small fish | Apr 10 16:25 |
| oiaohm | I know its a bad thing. | Apr 10 16:25 |
| oiaohm | Sharks like MS built the market this way. | Apr 10 16:25 |
| oiaohm | Lack of media regulation lets it happen. | Apr 10 16:26 |
| schestowitz | Police Powers and the UK Government in the 1980s < http://www.schneier.com/blog/archi... > | Apr 10 16:26 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: sharks and crime should be held accountable | Apr 10 16:26 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: so which team are you willing to put effort into? | Apr 10 16:27 |
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| oiaohm | groups like IDC need to be attacked. | Apr 10 16:27 |
| oiaohm | Stack of companies are forced basically to use them so they advertise as the best. | Apr 10 16:28 |
| oiaohm | Just to stay in business. | Apr 10 16:28 |
| trmanco | Windows Live Hotmail Suffers Temporary Outage: http://news.softpedia.com/news/Windows... | Apr 10 16:29 |
| oiaohm | Don't advertise with IDC have your produce made out as the worst on earth. | Apr 10 16:29 |
| schestowitz | http://www.sustainableindustries.com/g... "The idea of “open source” was once the domain of software geeks..." Errrrr. no. It /still/ is. | Apr 10 16:29 |
| schestowitz | So many people try to call anything on Earth "open source" | Apr 10 16:29 |
| schestowitz | The term loses meaning that way | Apr 10 16:29 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: remember it's not just IDC | Apr 10 16:29 |
| schestowitz | IDC owns IDG | Apr 10 16:30 |
| schestowitz | I.e. JavaWorld, NetworkWorld, InfroWorld, etc. | Apr 10 16:30 |
| trmanco | not just Gmail hun? | Apr 10 16:30 |
| schestowitz | Like 50 sites maybe... | Apr 10 16:30 |
| schestowitz | So they control the information about technology | Apr 10 16:30 |
| schestowitz | If you make them happy, they'll appoint your lackeys as 'journalists' | Apr 10 16:30 |
| schestowitz | By them I mean IDC | Apr 10 16:30 |
| schestowitz | That's where most money is made, other than adverts | Apr 10 16:31 |
| schestowitz | Whitepapers is where it's at for them. The sellouts (=white papers) | Apr 10 16:31 |
| oiaohm | As I said IDC has set themselfs up well. | Apr 10 16:31 |
| oiaohm | Fighting them head on is a major problem. | Apr 10 16:31 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: don't expect IDG to cover the outage | Apr 10 16:31 |
| oiaohm | If you want to say in business. | Apr 10 16:31 |
| schestowitz | They onl;y cover Google problems of this kind :-) | Apr 10 16:31 |
| oiaohm | Goverments have left IDC be. | Apr 10 16:32 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: phopronix advertises with IDG | Apr 10 16:32 |
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| schestowitz | A lot of stupid sites support them this way | Apr 10 16:32 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: "Various users have started reporting not being able to sign in to their accounts, and the fact that they received messages informing them that their inbox was gone." | Apr 10 16:33 |
| schestowitz | :-) :-) | Apr 10 16:33 |
| schestowitz | Welcome to Gmail, people. | Apr 10 16:33 |
| schestowitz | It's like the Conficker of the cloud | Apr 10 16:33 |
| trmanco | lol | Apr 10 16:33 |
| trmanco | I never had those Gail outages... | Apr 10 16:34 |
| trmanco | Gmail* | Apr 10 16:34 |
| schestowitz | Pandora open-source console delayed, but still on track < http://www.t3.com/news/pandora-ope... > | Apr 10 16:34 |
| trmanco | IMAP was working... so no offline service for me | Apr 10 16:34 |
| schestowitz | AZune[sic] was down for 22 hours | Apr 10 16:34 |
| schestowitz | Bad update of WIndows | Apr 10 16:34 |
| schestowitz | Does Google use Windows? :-) | Apr 10 16:34 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft blamed Windows uipdate | Apr 10 16:34 |
| schestowitz | They could be lying | Apr 10 16:35 |
| trmanco | they probably do, not for servers though | Apr 10 16:35 |
| schestowitz | I'll do a post | Apr 10 16:38 |
| schestowitz | Gotta find a nice free picture | Apr 10 16:39 |
| Eruaran | Does anyone have an opinion on a python ide or shall I just use kate | Apr 10 16:39 |
| ushimitsudoki | Eruaran: For an open source project? Wing IDE | Apr 10 16:41 |
| ushimitsudoki | Eururan: If you prefer a pure open source IDE, Komodo Edit | Apr 10 16:41 |
| Eruaran | k | Apr 10 16:41 |
| trmanco | I use komodo edit for php | Apr 10 16:42 |
| trmanco | Yahoo Mail suffers 'brief' outage: http://news.cnet.com/8301-17939_109-1021... | Apr 10 16:47 |
| trmanco | wtf is going on? | Apr 10 16:47 |
| schestowitz | Internet problems | Apr 10 16:47 |
| schestowitz | Not new | Apr 10 16:47 |
| schestowitz | Reported widely | Apr 10 16:47 |
| schestowitz | Network fidelity seems down | Apr 10 16:47 |
| schestowitz | BN is sometimes unreachable to all,, my DNS is wonky.... | Apr 10 16:48 |
| schestowitz | And it's shown elsewhere that there are DDOS attacks | Apr 10 16:48 |
| schestowitz | It's not a very Good Friday for Yahoo! and Microsoft, is it? | Apr 10 16:49 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: pingfm isn't working for me today | Apr 10 16:50 |
| trmanco | New Yahoo chief, Microsoft talking deals: http://www.electronista.com/articles... | Apr 10 16:50 |
| schestowitz | The button has had no effect since the morning. | Apr 10 16:50 |
| trmanco | Google can't, but microsoft can... pathetic | Apr 10 16:50 |
| trmanco | schestowitz, they were having some problems | Apr 10 16:51 |
| trmanco | but they are fixed now, let me try | Apr 10 16:51 |
| schestowitz | But trmanco, Google runs the country... NOT. That would be MSFT | Apr 10 16:51 |
| schestowitz | And Bill the 'philanthropist' | Apr 10 16:51 |
| schestowitz | his dad and friends have connections | Apr 10 16:51 |
| trmanco | schestowitz, ping.fm works here | Apr 10 16:55 |
| schestowitz | http://boycottnovell.com/2009/0... thanks, trmanco | Apr 10 16:55 |
| trmanco | np | Apr 10 16:56 |
| trmanco | cracked macbooks are funny | Apr 10 16:56 |
| schestowitz | Yes, but probably true and exaggerated | Apr 10 17:00 |
| schestowitz | The site must be driving away Mac-using readers. i hope not... | Apr 10 17:00 |
| schestowitz | Not to be too confrontational | Apr 10 17:00 |
| schestowitz | AWStats says that 5.5 % of the visitors use Macs | Apr 10 17:01 |
| schestowitz | Sounds about right | Apr 10 17:01 |
| schestowitz | Linux--3 8.3 % this montn | Apr 10 17:01 |
| schestowitz | Sounds about right ;-) | Apr 10 17:01 |
| schestowitz | Windows @ 48.4 % | Apr 10 17:02 |
| schestowitz | So not yet a monopoly by some definitions | Apr 10 17:02 |
| schestowitz | When Windows crosses 50%, then it becomes a problem | Apr 10 17:02 |
| trmanco | is it idc or idg that's in bed with MS? | Apr 10 17:05 |
| trmanco | China denies cyberattacks on U.S. power grid: http://www.itworld.com/government/6623... | Apr 10 17:05 |
| schestowitz | Cliff Saran propagates the open source FUD by citing Forrester, which was paid (bribed) to slander Linux before. | Apr 10 17:06 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: both | Apr 10 17:06 |
| schestowitz | IDC owns IDG | Apr 10 17:07 |
| trmanco | ah ok | Apr 10 17:07 |
| schestowitz | IDC uses IDG to pretend thet IDG is God | Apr 10 17:07 |
| schestowitz | *that IDG is God | Apr 10 17:07 |
| schestowitz | And that Linux has 4% market share in netbooks | Apr 10 17:07 |
| schestowitz | That too is being spread by IDG and generated by NPD, probably to help Microsoft | Apr 10 17:08 |
| Omar87 | Hi | Apr 10 17:08 |
| trmanco | hi | Apr 10 17:09 |
| schestowitz | Omar87: what do you think about today's posts? | Apr 10 17:12 |
| schestowitz | I feel pleased with some of the material Microsoft gave us. | Apr 10 17:12 |
| *magentar (n=magentar@dslb-084-059-072-223.pools.arcor-ip.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Apr 10 17:17 | |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: I'm checking them out now. | Apr 10 17:17 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: What did they give you? | Apr 10 17:17 |
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