IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: September 12th, 2008

Posted in IRC Logs at 5:15 am by Dr. Roy Schestowitz


Enter the IRC channel now

trmanco I got it from one of your posts on usenet and it wasn’t on this channel that I was thinking on posting the link Sep 11 22:43
PetoKraus :) Sep 11 22:47
schestowitz It’s an important one nonetheless because it’s about Microsoft disregard for standards. There’s lot of this in the Novell deal (interop versus real standards) Sep 11 22:47
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schestowitz http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?… “I’m sure the LSE was a big part of Microsoft’s Get the Facts campaign, and a poster for how reliable their software is. Mind you, it’s not just Microsoft software but the culture that grows around it. I’ve seen some almighty messes made by Accenture, and given how much money that outage cost I’m not surprised no one is commenting.” Sep 12 07:15
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schestowitz http://searchenterpriselinux.techtarget.com/news… “George Weiss, the vice president of Stamford, Conn.-based Gartner Inc., said that there is probably “a whole lot more Linux [in use] than people realize” because so much is downloaded for free that is not counted in server shipments.” Sep 12 07:54
MinceR whoa, gartner has discovered ‘installed base’ Sep 12 07:55
schestowitz No. Sep 12 07:55
schestowitz It denies it pretty much. And IDC/IDG meanwhile takes money from Microsoft to study ‘Linux use’ (preinstalls from large vendors) announcing that Linux has just 13% of the pie Sep 12 07:56
schestowitz Weeks ago: “There’s a lot of Linux out there — much more than Microsoft generally signals publicly — and their customers are using it…” –Paul DeGroot, a Directions On Microsoft analyst. Sep 12 07:57
schestowitz Another recent favourite from the Partner Group (Microsoft’s ‘partner’): http://digg.com/linux_unix/GNU_… Sep 12 07:58
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schestowitz FWIW, I’ve just put that in Digg: http://digg.com/linux_unix/A_Whole_Lot_M… http://digg.com/linux_unix/There_s_a_l… Sep 12 08:04
schestowitz Oops. Typo in that second one. Sep 12 08:04
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schestowitz The Microsoft-O-Gara shill is repeating some old speculation from Sam Dean: http://virtualization.sys-con.com/node/651819 (note: VMware is headed by Microsofters now) Sep 12 08:18
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ZiggyFish schestowitz: hey I like the video at the end of ‘Links 11/09/2008: Many New Releases, KDE in CERN’ Sep 12 10:09
schestowitz No Ogg though. Sep 12 10:09
schestowitz Maybe I should get back to producing Oggs. Sep 12 10:10
ZiggyFish yeah Sep 12 10:10
schestowitz It fills up the server. Sep 12 10:10
ZiggyFish didn’t know linux could do that Sep 12 10:10
schestowitz That’s an old video Sep 12 10:10
schestowitz Years ago. Maybe 3 or 4. Sep 12 10:10
ZiggyFish anyway shows you the power of Linux. Sep 12 10:11
schestowitz It came from an argument I had in USENET Sep 12 10:11
ZiggyFish lol Sep 12 10:11
schestowitz http://groups.google.com/group/comp… (many trolls here, so be warned) Sep 12 10:11
ZiggyFish lol Sep 12 10:13
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ZiggyFish http://linuxvoid.com/2008/09/09/… (are these guys computers?) Sep 12 10:14
ZiggyFish they sound like robots Sep 12 10:15
schestowitz *LOL* Sep 12 10:16
schestowitz Maybe their mother’s tongue is Robotics Sep 12 10:16
ZiggyFish lol Sep 12 10:16
ZiggyFish don’t you get that impression? Sep 12 10:16
schestowitz One sounds more like a robot Sep 12 10:17
ZiggyFish why can’t they speak like the guys on Linux Action Show Sep 12 10:18
schestowitz It’s a Linux void (of soul). No action./ Sep 12 10:22
ZiggyFish heh Sep 12 10:22
schestowitz Maybe Dorothy will sort them out when they find the Wizard of Oz. Sep 12 10:23
ZiggyFish lol Sep 12 10:23
schestowitz Anyway, enough laughing at them. They might notice. Sep 12 10:23
ZiggyFish didn’t no robots were that smart yet Sep 12 10:23
ZiggyFish ;) Sep 12 10:23
schestowitz They’re overclocked Sep 12 10:24
ZiggyFish hehehe Sep 12 10:24
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schestowitz How  true: “t should be Linux only. That’s how it was all started prior to MS sticking their thumb into the media circle. However, once MS dropped it’s five ton gorilla onto the plate the initiative has all but died. it’s the MS “extend, embrace, extinguish” plan in full action.” http://digg.com/linux_unix/OLPC_s_Amazon_No… Sep 12 10:32
ZiggyFish very true Sep 12 10:33
schestowitz I just never though of it like this, but anyone whom I know that advocated OLPC got sick of it when Microsoft rubbed it in the media. They also drove away key OLPC people that way. Sep 12 10:36
schestowitz Microsoft fumigates anything it enters. ODF… Apache..? Hopefully never. Sep 12 10:36
ZiggyFish but what have Microsoft to gain in taking down OLPC. Sep 12 10:37
schestowitz A lot. It’s the Slog: http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/… http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/upl… Sep 12 10:37
schestowitz ZiggyFish: Microsoft fears low-cost laptops; same with Intel. Price-fixing has been their thing for ages. Sep 12 10:37
ZiggyFish true Sep 12 10:38
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schestowitz I rely now on the Chinese to make those better chips and not to be corrupted by the Ballmer/Gates axis that has a lot of influence on their totalitarian regime. Sep 12 10:38
schestowitz $98 laptops. What will Wintel do? Sep 12 10:38
ZiggyFish lol Sep 12 10:39
schestowitz They’ve struggled against computers becoming a commodity or a generic ‘drug’ like Aspirin. Sep 12 10:39
schestowitz They want the kids on MSD, not Aspirin Sep 12 10:39
schestowitz *LSD Sep 12 10:39
schestowitz “Although about 3 million computers get sold every year in China, but people don’t pay for the software,” he said. “Someday they will, though. As long as they are going to steal it, we want them to steal ours. They’ll get sort of addicted, and then we’ll somehow figure out how to collect sometime in the next decade.” Sep 12 10:40
schestowitz –Bill Gates on how to get people addicted to expensive stuff Sep 12 10:40
mib_s8rnj5 I have an interesting email sent from Jack Messman to Novell partners complaining and attempting to correct microsoft fud.    http://embed.mibbit.com/pb/U4fV4p Sep 12 10:41
*schestowitz looks Sep 12 10:41
schestowitz I can recall a comment in Groklaw about Messman using FUD in 2005 Sep 12 10:41
schestowitz I see it here: http://www.sdoss.org/events/Presentations/2004/3… Sep 12 10:43
schestowitz That’s very interesting, thank you very much! Sep 12 10:43
ZiggyFish yeah Sep 12 10:43
mib_s8rnj5 Welcome.  I am sure I have a few more as I worked for a novell partner for 10 years Sep 12 10:44
schestowitz Especially after Novell had torn down all its anti-FUD pages from novell.com (just after the deal was signed) Sep 12 10:44
mib_s8rnj5 Ill post if I find them Sep 12 10:44
schestowitz Novell is now *USING* Microsoft’s FUD to its advantage against other vendors. Sep 12 10:44
ZiggyFish sure Sep 12 10:44
ZiggyFish lol Sep 12 10:44
schestowitz Excellent! Thanks for that. Sep 12 10:45
schestowitz Let me try to see if I can find the Messman FUD remark Sep 12 10:45
schestowitz Got it! http://boycottnovell.com/2007/10/01/j… Sep 12 10:46
mib_s8rnj5 Messamn was the most boring man ever. Sep 12 10:46
schestowitz I have some interviews of  his Sep 12 10:48
schestowitz http://www.archive.org/search.php?q… Sep 12 10:48
ZiggyFish Oh, Bill, usually wins that title (the most poring man ever), you’ve just upset him, watchout he’ll try to ‘extend, embrace, extinguish’ you ;) Sep 12 10:49
ZiggyFish *boring Sep 12 10:49
schestowitz There\s the thing about VML Sep 12 10:49
schestowitz http://www.theinquirer.net/gb/inquirer/new… Sep 12 10:49
schestowitz With OOXML they try to make it s ‘standard’. Sep 12 10:49
schestowitz Very annoying. Sep 12 10:49
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MinceR 124457 <@schestowitz> I see it here: http://www.sdoss.org/events/Presentations/2… Sep 12 10:54
MinceR the domain’s dead :/ Sep 12 10:54
schestowitz… Sep 12 10:57
schestowitz nux+in+their+latest+SEC+filing.+ These,+however,+are+the+true+facts.&amp ;hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1 Sep 12 10:57
schestowitz http://tinyurl.com/5xddp9 Sep 12 10:57
ZiggyFish I recon that the Major vendors have an agreement with Microsoft (any computers they sell, Microsoft get’s a percentage of, in exchange for lowered Windows licences cost (can’t find any references to back it up though)) Sep 12 10:58
schestowitz There was lots in the Iowa trial, e.g. http://boycottnovell.com/200… Sep 12 10:59
schestowitz Intel has some similar illegal deas. Sep 12 10:59
schestowitz Dell’s investors sued for accepting secret bribes (kickbacks) from Intel. Lenovo is said to have played the same game. It’s all corrupt Sep 12 10:59
ZiggyFish reading http://boycottnovell.com/2008/09/1… confirms it Sep 12 11:00
schestowitz The Acer one is a better example. Sep 12 11:00
schestowitz http://boycottnovell.com/2008… Sep 12 11:00
ZiggyFish yeah Sep 12 11:02
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schestowitz One site vainly claims to know precisely Microsoft’s hare on desktop: “And others talk of switching allegiance completely, though in reality Microsoft Windows still holds a massive 94.9% share in desktop OS use.” ORLY?  http://searchcio-midmarket.tec… Look who is cited as the ‘source’? The media propagates the Big Lies. Sep 12 12:46
schestowitz The Microsoft O’Gara shill (see http://boycottnovell.com/2008… ) is doing a series of attacks on VMWare: http://openwebdeveloper.sys-con.com/node… http://symbian.sys-con.com/node/488349 Sep 12 12:51
schestowitz WTF? She’s still going ballistic. Classic Microsoft slog: http://silverlight.sys-con.com/node/670417  It’s just like in http://boycottnovell.com/wp-content/u… Sep 12 12:53
schestowitz “Ideally, use of the competing technology becomes associated with mental deficiency, as in, “he believes in Santa Claus, the Easter Bunny, and OS/2.” Just keep rubbing it in, via the press, analysts, newsgroups, whatever. Make the complete failure of the competition’s technology part of the mythology of the computer industry. We want to place selection pressure on those companies and individuals that show a genetic weakness for com Sep 12 12:53
schestowitz petitors’ technologies, to make the industry increasingly resistant to such unhealthy strains, over time.” Sep 12 12:53
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schestowitz And the O’Gara VMWare FUD then continued: http://cloudcomputing.sys-con.com/node/454273 Sep 12 13:01
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trmanco http://www.heise-online.co.uk/news/Canoni… Sep 12 13:27
schestowitz It’s being hyped up in the media like it’s the second coming, as opposed to a blog post. There are already thousands of contributors. Sep 12 13:28
schestowitz What’s with this picture? http://www.businessweek.com/magazin… Sep 12 13:54
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PetoKraus so is chrome opensource? Sep 12 15:23
schestowitz Yes. Sep 12 15:24
PetoKraus where’s the code? Sep 12 15:24
schestowitz http://code.google.com/chromium/ Sep 12 15:24
schestowitz The Apple and GNU/Linux versions are very much behind, so while Wine can now run it decently, don’t expect native versions any time soon. Sep 12 15:25
PetoKraus i say Sep 12 15:27
PetoKraus fuck google Sep 12 15:27
PetoKraus also Sep 12 15:27
schestowitz Check out the comments here (mind also): http://radar.oreilly.com/2008/05/goo… Sep 12 15:29
PetoKraus is chromium REALLY the same thing as chrome? Sep 12 15:29
schestowitz It pissed me off a lot more because they actually /ruined/ the Web. Sep 12 15:30
schestowitz Also see: http://www.computerworlduk.com/community/blo… Sep 12 15:30
PetoKraus ruined? Sep 12 15:30
schestowitz Well, you come and visir a Google page and they tell you “go away, GNU/Linux users. Go and buy Windows, then come back.” Sep 12 15:31
PetoKraus gosh Sep 12 15:32
PetoKraus crappy. Sep 12 15:32
PetoKraus i don’t trust cloud computer for one thing Sep 12 15:33
PetoKraus the board of any company, eg google, can be changed Sep 12 15:33
PetoKraus and the new board forces the devs to switch one boolean variable Sep 12 15:33
PetoKraus and boom, cloud works only under certain os. Sep 12 15:33
schestowitz Yes, I know. Sep 12 15:34
schestowitz I’ll write some more about insiders later. Microsoft is spreading its goons all over the place Sep 12 15:34
schestowitz (Google included, told me one professor) Sep 12 15:34
schestowitz Do you know of high-level people in Google who arrives from Microsoft? Sep 12 15:34
schestowitz *arrived Sep 12 15:34
PetoKraus no, not really, but i guess i can imagine Sep 12 15:34
schestowitz Hmmmmm…. http://governor.state.tx.us/news/press-release/11122/ … I wonder how wtitter is doing under their storm in the east. Sep 12 15:36
schestowitz …Petty to complain about some rainy weather unless it floods. There are worse climatic issues out there. Sep 12 15:38
schestowitz Good news if true: http://www.reghardware.co.uk/200… “But the spec also mentions 1GB of RAM, a 40GB hard drive, “Ubunto Linux” (sic), dimensions extending to 30 x 30 x 17cm and a weight of 1.2kg, all of which are rather large for an MID.” Sep 12 15:42
MinceR it’s dell, therefore it includes the hidden microsoft tax, doesn’t it? Sep 12 15:46
schestowitz Yes. Sep 12 15:46
schestowitz The problem is that many of these vendors are not being ‘infected’. To tell you the truth, I am very pissed off about Novell at the moment (usually I’m more clam). Microsoft is slogging some companies (this time VMware, not just Red Hat) and Novell is /helping/ it. It’s like an abusive dunce. Sep 12 15:47
schestowitz not->now Sep 12 15:47
schestowitz clam->calm.    Microsoft is still losing but to whom? To Novell? No, it ‘bribed’ Novell to keep it alive (kind of like SCO) in order to have its competition change sides (remember the Caldera trial that was settled secretly?) Sep 12 15:49
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schestowitz From http://beranger.org/index.php?p… “boycottmandriva.com might soon have a market value!” OH NO. Don’t ruin Mandriva, Radu. Sep 12 15:53
schestowitz Mandriva is based in Europe (and South America). They ought to complain about Microsoft… and not just in an open letter over the bribery, e.g. in Nigeria. It’s down to bureaucracy, but they are all being surrounded by undercover shills like Zuck and his pressure-group-for-Microsoft-du-jour, which impacts corruptible politicians. Sep 12 15:59
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schestowitz Linux.com: promoting Free (as in humour) software, as usual: http://www.linux.com/feed/147613 :-) Sep 12 16:28
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tessier_ schestowitz: What do you think of Nexenta? Open-solaris based distro with GNU userland. Sep 12 18:03
schestowitz I’ve not tried OpenSolaris before. CDDL… Sep 12 18:05
tessier_ You haven’t tried it because it is CDDL? Sep 12 18:07
MinceR slowlaris. Sep 12 18:08
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schestowitz tessier: it seems like something useful if you need Sun-only features like ZFS. I don’t know how much software it runs well (don’t know != runs badly). Sep 12 18:12
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_Doug ???????????????????????????????????????????? Sep 12 18:29
schestowitz Hey, Dug. Sep 12 18:30
schestowitz *Doug Sep 12 18:30
_Doug see the latest Gates/Seinfeld advert ? Sep 12 18:30
_Doug http://www.macrumors.com/2008/09… Sep 12 18:31
schestowitz Do you know who showed PJ the “O’Gara sabotages OSDL E-mail”? Sep 12 18:31
_Doug ? Sep 12 18:31
schestowitz I don’t care for Microsoft adverts. It’s free advertising to mention them. Sep 12 18:31
_Doug PM .. Sep 12 18:31
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_Doug What’s extraordenary is they have a strategy in place to attack the OSDL, before its even set up, talk about knifing the fetus :O Sep 12 18:48
_Doug Then attack OSDL ffor what it is doing and put a negative spin on it .. eh Sep 12 18:49
_Doug “Linux and Open Source are supposed to be all about “free” technology and no one group having competitive advantage. This new alliance seems to go against these principles.” Sep 12 18:49
schestowitz That’s the routine. Sep 12 18:49
schestowitz I’m going to write about it. Sep 12 18:50
schestowitz MOG is attacking VMware now. Sep 12 18:50
_Doug So it’s either fragmentation or it’s against the principles of Open Source ,can’t win .. :) Sep 12 18:50
_Doug Got a link to MOG ? Sep 12 18:50
_Doug “Old UNIX guard attempting to hijack Linux to go after Sun” Sep 12 18:51
schestowitz Ah, that’s a classic Sep 12 18:53
schestowitz MOG has begun promoting Novell and slamming Red Hat… wonder why… Sep 12 18:53
schestowitz And her ‘publication’ claims that Microsoft might buy Novell. Sep 12 18:53
schestowitz Must be something they  send her from Redmond. Sep 12 18:54
_Doug :) Sep 12 18:55
_Doug MS don’t want to buy Novell, at least not just yet. They are more usefull as being an independent ‘open source’ company. Sep 12 18:56
_Doug The most obvious impact of the coveneant was to kill any Novell ambitions on the desktop .. Sep 12 18:56
_Doug All for the exchange of some vouchers and loose change out of Redmond .. Sep 12 18:57
MinceR their loss, i don’t miss suse on the desktop. :> Sep 12 19:01
schestowitz I’m typing it right now. :-) Sep 12 19:02
_Doug MS don’t want to buy Novell as they also risk getting call a monopoly, again. It’s best to keep at least the one ‘opne source’ company on life support. If I was an OEM or a media company, I would snap up Novell right now .. Sep 12 19:07
_Doug NovDell should sell a high end multimedia device and make their money back on subscriptions, movies, games etc .. it’s a license to print money … Sep 12 19:09
_Doug A £60 cheep box made in China, would fly off the shelves .. Sep 12 19:09
MinceR i think they’ll just kill novell once they don’t find it useful any more. Sep 12 19:13
MinceR (that seems to be close to what happened to sco…) Sep 12 19:14
_Doug SCO is like a vampire, keeps rising from the dead .. Sep 12 19:15
_Doug Canonical to improve usability of the Linux desktop .. Sep 12 19:21
_Doug http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post/2008… Sep 12 19:21
_Doug ot: virtual racism .. Sep 12 19:24
_Doug http://arstechnica.com/news… Sep 12 19:24
_Doug gtg .. bye … Sep 12 19:24
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cj schestowitz: I thought you might want to read this: Sep 12 20:28
cj http://tirania.org/blog/archiv… Sep 12 20:28
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MinceR http://sackheads.org/~bnaylor/spew… Sep 12 21:17
schestowitz Oh noes! http://www.cyriak.co.uk/lhc/lhc-webcams.html Sep 12 22:18
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cj schestowitz: that Canonical link looks like something my wife would be able to help with! Sep 12 22:56
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cj schestowitz: lol @ webcams Sep 12 23:17
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