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IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: August 16th, 2008

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ld50hiAug 16 00:32
schestowitzHi there.Aug 16 00:36
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anivarschestowitz: heyAug 16 03:48
anivar"In a major victory for the open source software movement, the federalAug 16 03:49
anivarappeals court in Washington, D.C., has ruled that simply because aAug 16 03:49
anivarsoftware programmer may give his work away for free does not mean thatAug 16 03:49
anivarthe software cannot be protected. The decision legitimizes the use ofAug 16 03:49
anivarcommercial contracts for the distribution of computer software andAug 16 03:49
anivardigital artistic works for the public good. The ruling also boosts theAug 16 03:49
anivaropen source movement by easing the concerns of large organizationsAug 16 03:49
anivarabout relying on free software from developers who contributed to theAug 16 03:49
anivareffort without pay. The ruling will also have implications for theAug 16 03:49
anivarCreative Common license, which is used by organizations such asAug 16 03:49
anivarWikipedia and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology forAug 16 03:49
anivardistributing courseware and other materials. Creative Commons CEOAug 16 03:49
anivarJoichi Ito says the ambiguity facing open source licensing has beenAug 16 03:49
anivarone of the obstacles hindering the movement. The appeals courtAug 16 03:49
anivardecision reversed a San Francisco federal court ruling over theAug 16 03:49
anivarmisappropriation of a software program by Kam Industries, a companyAug 16 03:49
anivarthat publishes model train hobbyist software. Kam Industries ownerAug 16 03:49
anivarMatthew A. Katzer had sued free software developers for patentAug 16 03:49
anivarinfringement while the free software community argued that KatzerAug 16 03:49
anivarfailed to disclose earlier technology, or prior art, in his patentAug 16 03:50
anivarfilings. In March 2006, University of California, Berkeley professorAug 16 03:50
anivarRobert G. Jacobsen filed a lawsuit against Katzer claiming that hisAug 16 03:50
anivarcompany was distributing a commercial software program that used codeAug 16 03:50
anivarfrom the Java Model Railroad Interface project, and was redistributingAug 16 03:50
anivarthe program without the credits required as part of the open sourceAug 16 03:50
anivarlicense it was originally distributed under. The lower court ruledAug 16 03:50
anivarthat the terms of the open source contract were overly broad..."Aug 16 03:50
anivarhttp://www.nytimes.com/2008/08/14/t...Aug 16 03:50
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prasadschestowitz,  No software Patents Bangalore planning meeting is about to start at #bmslugAug 16 06:01
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neighborleeLOL, the 'other side' is now resorting to saying things like boycottnovell has lied just to try to get rid of novel LOL,,they are really desperate ;)Aug 16 08:06
neighborleehttp://ubuntuforums.org/showthrea...Aug 16 08:07
*schestowitz looksAug 16 08:07
neighborleein this case, smartboyathome <Aug 16 08:07
neighborleewhat a name :)Aug 16 08:08
schestowitzYour reply pretty much says it all.Aug 16 08:09
neighborlee:)Aug 16 08:09
schestowitzThat's why the name of the Web site has never been helpful.Aug 16 08:10
schestowitzMicrosoft people also have their share of smears about Groklaw too being "unfair".Aug 16 08:11
neighborleeof courseAug 16 08:12
neighborleelaughingly, directHEX had no reply when caught in his deceipt in trying to paint a supposed patent encumbered kenrel issue : double click LOL...absolutely stunning nonsense and Im glad I caught it quickly as it just shows the level of crud they are willing to goto in order to get what they want...its like fighting back Microsoft..oh wait they are Microsoft ha-ha ;Aug 16 08:20
schestowitzIf they trust Groklaw, show them Groklaw too. PJ has protested against Mono for years. Here is a recent one: http://www.groklaw.net/article.php?...Aug 16 08:21
neighborleeok kewl thxAug 16 08:22
schestowitzYou can also tells them that Groklaw suspects Microsoft /will/ sue. It's just a matter of time (going beyond the extortion bit).Aug 16 08:22
neighborleewho is PJ sorry I dont recall that oneAug 16 08:22
schestowitzAnd hey! That's not me. That's just Groklaw. Maybe they'll just make fun of Pam.Aug 16 08:22
schestowitzShe runs Groklaw.Aug 16 08:23
neighborleeahhh ah.Aug 16 08:23
neighborleeahhh ok.Aug 16 08:23
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neighborleeits laughable it really is...no patent grants and no running behavior that would lead anyone to think they are on 'our' side ( a great deal to the opposite in fact ), yet those supporting it are so quick to want to run and adopt it...no great surprise why :)Aug 16 08:25
neighborleethats ok , I dont mind a decent debate, never have ;)Aug 16 08:25
neighborleeschestowitz, anyway overall, how goes it ;)Aug 16 08:27
schestowitzThey probably sing about merits of Mono while neglecting consequences. They want to justify their own choices, which is why it's disappointing that Shuttleworth ety al feed them Mono in the first place (and get them 'addicted').Aug 16 08:27
neighborleefine here, after finally having cooled down to toerable levels ;)Aug 16 08:27
neighborleewhew its been h ot lately for this area..washington state out near seattleAug 16 08:27
schestowitzI woke up half an hour ago. Just been catching up. Microsoft's XBox 360 is still a disaster it seems (just spotted that)... last place in its own back yard: US.Aug 16 08:28
neighborleeyeah indeed, shuttleworth..sheeshAug 16 08:28
neighborleehmm what did I miss about 360..though my wii is going st rong :))Aug 16 08:29
schestowitzHe already pays Microsoft for codecs. Does he also want to pay them for framework? He should be man enough to admit an incorrect choice and figure out a way to address it. Novell is poisoning a lot of distributions.Aug 16 08:29
neighborleeyupAug 16 08:30
schestowitzThe Wii, which everyone mocked at the start, is showing that less is more. XBox360 reminds me of Vista.Aug 16 08:30
neighborleeyeah there is thatAug 16 08:30
neighborleeIve never enjoyed gaming more than wiiAug 16 08:30
neighborleemainly due to wiiTennis, but overall much more and now including wiiFit ;)Aug 16 08:31
schestowitzit crashes (ceases to function), it burns, it's expensive and it has already cost Microsoft $7 billion in _losses_.Aug 16 08:31
schestowitzSeems like there's a revolt down in Bif Blue Australia... http://news.zdnet.com/2424-...Aug 16 08:31
schestowitz*LOL* http://xkcd.com/463/Aug 16 08:32
neighborleeyeah 360 is def. costing them alot lolAug 16 08:32
neighborleecheckingAug 16 08:32
neighborleeLOLAug 16 08:34
neighborleeewwwAug 16 08:34
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schestowitzneighborlee: watch this < http://news.cnet.com/8301-13... ( Why the Wii is well-suited to video game violence ) >Aug 16 09:16
neighborleeI pretty much likely know what its about...I was  very angry to hear off a few games that were allowed on wii...even Nintendo isn't above making a profit even with its not moral ;(Aug 16 09:18
neighborleeI mean how lame must someone be, to suggest games aren't gorey or bloody enough...sounds like a terrible childhood to me, and someone in need of a great deal of psychiatric care.Aug 16 09:19
schestowitzYes, I know the guy.Aug 16 09:19
schestowitzHeavy metal fan. But he's the CEO of MuleSource and we corresponded a few times.Aug 16 09:20
neighborleeahhh now the pieces of the puzzle add upAug 16 09:20
schestowitzComing from his, this post isn't a surprise.Aug 16 09:20
neighborleemy friend, when very young was allowed by his mother ( although she was totally clueless) to go see heavy metal movie..and now he    craves gorey, bloody games as a adult, and is basically very angry type with little patienceAug 16 09:21
*schestowitz is generally not a fan of violent games based on grounds of impact (but plays them nonetheless)Aug 16 09:21
schestowitzWhich movie was that? Headbangers?Aug 16 09:22
neighborleehonestly no idea, I'd have to ask himAug 16 09:22
neighborleeit was many years ago when he was very youngAug 16 09:22
neighborleehe wasn't very well supervised.Aug 16 09:22
schestowitzI watched that a few years ago. Madness.Aug 16 09:22
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neighborleeand it shows..he's also not a very nice person usually, but I try to befriend him .Aug 16 09:23
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schestowitzI've seen good families whose children were pulled by the goth 'cult'. They become sociopaths.Aug 16 09:23
neighborleeweirdAug 16 09:23
neighborleeyeah I dont get what that crap is all about at allAug 16 09:24
neighborleeI must be boring by comparison, with my like of The C arpenters LOLAug 16 09:24
schestowitzIt seems common when the parents don't pay attention to the child. It's rather tormenting and painful for parents to see their child bending that way.Aug 16 09:24
neighborleeboring and or nuts maybe ha-haAug 16 09:24
neighborleeyeah it would seem horrid.Aug 16 09:25
schestowitzI'd still like to know the story about Novell's mormons in Utah.Aug 16 09:25
neighborleeIt reallly does take a village to raise a child ;)Aug 16 09:25
neighborleemormons scare meAug 16 09:25
neighborleethough some christians scare me too  <G>Aug 16 09:25
schestowitzOther than hearsay I found little evidence of this. I watch some American TV shows about this phenomenon, but I know too little about how pervasive it is in Provo (I'm told so).Aug 16 09:26
neighborleeI mean its all academic at end of day,,very few people   really adhere to jesus teachings on many meaninful level, though thankfullly there are many exceptions ;)Aug 16 09:26
neighborleeto me it sounds like leave out jesus and insert some guy who claims to have seen god or something oddAug 16 09:27
neighborleedunnoAug 16 09:27
schestowitzEither way, it won't be relevant to investigations around Novell  because the main branch is in Waltham, MA.Aug 16 09:27
neighborleeahhh ;)Aug 16 09:27
schestowitzAll I can say is that people who used to work at Novell told me about it.Aug 16 09:28
neighborleeweirdAug 16 09:29
neighborleeI always saw the wii as last gaming  haven against madness of ever increasing game violence, which I think is helping to desensitize people ( youth mainly) to it, and you can see the results in society in general I think.Aug 16 09:31
neighborleewhen I saw the topic, I thought it was a joke actually, so its sad to see its not .Aug 16 09:32
neighborlee:)Aug 16 09:32
schestowitzYes, same here. I se Jack Thompson smeared a lot (by young people), but while I can admit that I know too little about that saga, I agree that violent computer games cause a lot of damage.Aug 16 09:33
*schestowitz used to play lots of FPSs as a childAug 16 09:33
neighborleehere is why such things bother me alot: http://heartseed.sf.net < that is me and what im doing and this website is the antithesis of everything I stand for. :) <  no surprise I would find it appauling heh>Aug 16 09:35
neighborleeyeah, there are  studies clearing showing violent video games does cause violent behaviorAug 16 09:35
neighborleebut , you wont find game developers, that make money from it citing such studies LOLAug 16 09:35
schestowitzneighborlee: appalling? Why?Aug 16 09:37
neighborleeI guess I never got caught in any of that, but I can see someone that did easily getting desensitized by it ;0-Aug 16 09:37
neighborleewell if you consider the ways in which we interact with each other in real lifeAug 16 09:38
schestowitzIt's like global warming. They'll say anything to keep selling games.Aug 16 09:38
neighborleeviolence on any level is immoral reallyAug 16 09:38
schestowitzIf you haven't watched this < http://lessig.org/blog/2008/07... >, do it sometimes.Aug 16 09:38
neighborleeif thats what you were asking that isAug 16 09:38
neighborleeokAug 16 09:39
neighborleeim one of those that actually lives jesus teachings, on every levelAug 16 09:39
neighborleeso yes things like this to me are appauling ;)Aug 16 09:39
schestowitzThen again, violence is bing glorified also on TV. I believe the administration/military is happy with it. In a land of pacifists, who would ever go to war that promote financial agendas?Aug 16 09:39
neighborleeyes.Aug 16 09:40
neighborleecarter I think really t ried to place our nation on the right path, then things went downhill from there ;0-Aug 16 09:40
neighborleepolitics can be so messy ;(Aug 16 09:41
schestowitzCorrupt, not just messy.Aug 16 09:41
neighborleeyupAug 16 09:41
schestowitzAt this very moment I multitask with the placement of a new reference in http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/15/...Aug 16 09:42
neighborleebut yeah...tv is also turning out to be pretty darn odd/violent yes..my grandmother would be horrified ;)Aug 16 09:42
neighborleetv , and movies....ohhhhhh ick ;)Aug 16 09:42
schestowitzThe addition at the bottom is something I've just found. It all comes together now... the way politics is gamed by Microsoft through hired of secretive shills.Aug 16 09:42
schestowitz*hiresAug 16 09:42
neighborleegratuitous violence to me is just sillly,,I mean it really serves no purpose but to line pockets of ceo's LOLAug 16 09:42
neighborleehehe go you ;)Aug 16 09:43
schestowitzWhat was the frequency of acts of violence and of crime in a Hollywood blockbuster? I can't recall the number, but it's like hundreds. It's all very violent/mischief packed. And then people wonder why "bad" is the new good and sabotage is seen as "cool".Aug 16 09:44
neighborleeyupAug 16 09:44
neighborleegames, t v, movies, its all there..oh and as much as it might paint me as old fashioned...porn too ;00-Aug 16 09:44
schestowitzCorruption too is caused by glorification of mafias, casinos and the likes of that.Aug 16 09:44
neighborleein the right place I guess porn 'can' be useful, but honeslty overall I think its a waste of time,,if you need porn to be active with your partner you are prob. with the wrong person LOLAug 16 09:45
schestowitzI sometimes wonder how Ballmer reacts deep inside when he bribes some politician, probably thinking of himself as a new-age Godfather Soprano. Gates with his bribes still wants to be seen as a Rockafeller.Aug 16 09:45
neighborleehow true lolAug 16 09:46
neighborleeoh btw..has novel ever to date disclosed the deal with m$ ??Aug 16 09:52
neighborleeI mean all those patent violations as suchAug 16 09:53
schestowitzThey published a redacted version in Easter 2007. They sort of hid all the important bit, let some nasty stuff  (e.g. about Wine) be revealed ans went off to holidays.Aug 16 09:53
neighborleehm , so wine is one of the patent enfringements ?Aug 16 09:54
schestowitzI can find the details if you are interested. Either way, Bruce Lowry who let this out at the time quit the company. Many others quit as well for all I can tell and the worry is not just that Novell is dying but that it's being replaced by Microsoft-sympathetics types and .Net programmers.Aug 16 09:54
neighborleeyeahAug 16 09:55
neighborleena no biggieAug 16 09:55
neighborleejust t he fact that they did this without disclosure is  enough for me to know the answer ;)Aug 16 09:55
schestowitzThe sponsored-by-Microsoft SourceForge.NET awards made Wine the most likely to get sued (or users sued). Surely, these awards were somehow Microsoft's idea and plan to stir up panic.Aug 16 09:55
neighborleeweird,,first Ive heard of it ;))Aug 16 09:56
schestowitzWine may be offering better win32 compatibility than Windows Vista and Microsoft knows that it renders its cash cows redundant. No lock-in.Aug 16 09:56
neighborleehaha true enough ;))Aug 16 09:56
neighborleevista is just dain scary...my friend bought it from me ( whew ),,even though I warned him twice...I think he regrets it to this day LOLAug 16 09:57
schestowitzFor legacy applications like those which are required in Munich, Wine is a mint. Without it, a lot of migrations would not work. Hypervisors are costly if there's Windows dependence.Aug 16 09:57
neighborleehmm yeahAug 16 09:58
schestowitzhttp://ubuntuforums.org/s...Aug 16 09:59
schestowitzOops. This one is more relevant: http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/15/no...Aug 16 09:59
neighborleesweeetAug 16 10:02
neighborleeand a few people confused, trying to say nope, its all still there..so clueless :))Aug 16 10:02
neighborleeah man, thx for posting thatAug 16 10:03
neighborleethey all like my flower heheAug 16 10:03
schestowitzWhoa!!! This is so fishy: http://blogs.zdnet.com/open-source/?p=2790Aug 16 10:07
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ZiggyFishheyAug 16 10:08
schestowitzQuick background to this: the man makes proprietary software, he is a FORMER MICROSOFT PERSON and he took authority over GPLv2 and v3 things, even stole data.Aug 16 10:08
schestowitzHey,ZiggyFish, watch this Aug 16 10:08
schestowitzhttp://blogs.zdnet.com/open-...Aug 16 10:08
schestowitzThe "GPL is dangerous" Microsoft guy left at an interesting time.Aug 16 10:09
ZiggyFishI'm trying to run the new 8.10 alpha, but I keep getting kernal panicsAug 16 10:09
schestowitzWhen he says it's unrelated, I doubt it. He could be BSing.Aug 16 10:09
schestowitzTell the kernel to calm down then. Put some Prozac in it. :-DAug 16 10:10
ZiggyFishmm, I think so tooAug 16 10:10
ZiggyFishlolAug 16 10:10
ZiggyFishI'm trying to run it in vboxAug 16 10:10
neighborleethats what you get for using ubuntu infestation ;)Aug 16 10:10
neighborleehaAug 16 10:11
neighborleeif  I wasn't so tired, I would be backing up important data and getting  fedora 10alpha installed..tomorrow am <!! ;)Aug 16 10:11
neighborleeI just can't wait ;)Aug 16 10:12
ZiggyFishtheir's a program I want that is meant to be working in this new ubuntu. One of my friends has a 3g modem, he wants to use, but he won't install linux until _I_ can get it workingAug 16 10:12
neighborleehmAug 16 10:13
schestowitzDoug Levin (hypothetical: "But what if it's not compliant? The GPL... it's viral... it's dangerous, why don't you buy our non-Free software to keep the 'threat' away from your project?" Just to give you an idea of what these people are about....Aug 16 10:13
ZiggyFishunless you can get network manager 0.7 running on fedoraAug 16 10:13
neighborleeschestowitz, LOL ;)Aug 16 10:13
neighborleeZiggyFish, please tell me this isn't dialupAug 16 10:14
ZiggyFishit's a 3g modem (so yes and no)Aug 16 10:14
neighborleeZiggyFish, oh eeekAug 16 10:14
neighborleewellAug 16 10:14
schestowitzneighborlee: regarding "mono infestation", some people told me that it's bad when Ubuntu (or others) give no warning whatsoever if you install Mono, even through dependencies.Aug 16 10:14
neighborleeschestowitz, i agreeAug 16 10:14
neighborleethats the least they can do until they d ecided to remove it ;0-0Aug 16 10:15
schestowitzIt's so easy to naively lick "install" on something and then find Mono somewhere up the tree. It sticks to all sort of programs like Cheese.Aug 16 10:15
neighborleehehAug 16 10:15
ZiggyFishneighborlee: it's a usb modem tooAug 16 10:16
schestowitzA friend of mine is a Fedora maintainer and he gave up on chances of keeping GNOME clean from Mono.Aug 16 10:16
neighborleeschestowitz, yup..gtk is also creeping into mono realm on their 'about' pageAug 16 10:17
neighborleeschestowitz, nothiing stopping any of us from forking, which I shall soon if this doesn't end.Aug 16 10:17
neighborleeI hate to, but Im willing to.Aug 16 10:17
schestowitzNovell has too much momentum though.Aug 16 10:18
neighborleeNever underestimate the power of a good cause ;)Aug 16 10:18
schestowitzI bet on being able to keep KDE away from this trap. At least other people feel the same and they'll watch KDE closely.Aug 16 10:18
neighborleewe can hopeAug 16 10:19
ZiggyFishneighborlee: are you a devAug 16 10:19
neighborleenope, not yet anyway, but im likely to be one if things dont change.Aug 16 10:19
schestowitzAccording to Glyn (http://www.linuxjournal.com/cont... ), the days of Windows are gradually ending. Microsoft will become a licensing+services company. It treid hardware (XBox, Zune) and it failed badly. Windows mobile too was a money burner.Aug 16 10:19
ZiggyFishlol, I'm a devAug 16 10:19
neighborleeon whatAug 16 10:20
schestowitzI'm a developer myself.Aug 16 10:20
neighborleeschestowitz, hmm interesting..yeah poor M$ lolAug 16 10:20
ZiggyFishATM, I'm maintaining a tsunami warning systemAug 16 10:20
neighborleewell technically Im a developer, but not gnome wize is what I meant.Aug 16 10:20
schestowitzSeen the Economist article?Aug 16 10:20
neighborleeZiggyFish, nice indeed, I hope you succede amazingly ;)Aug 16 10:21
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/13...Aug 16 10:21
ZiggyFishmaybe we should reimplement cheese in another langAug 16 10:21
ZiggyFishneighborlee: thanksAug 16 10:21
neighborleeohhhhh speaking of water..I watched neat cable show about dolphins saving humans from sharks..it was truly stunningAug 16 10:21
schestowitzThey could product versions after XP, so there was little to keep money flowing other than bucket-shuffling, buybacks, acquisitions, etc. The margins eroded very badly for them because of GNU/Linux.Aug 16 10:22
schestowitz*couln't produce, I meanAug 16 10:22
neighborleeyup npAug 16 10:22
neighborleewell, is it any wonder why they tried so hard to PUSH vista , even on their unsuspecting employees LOL!!Aug 16 10:22
neighborleebad bad idea ;)Aug 16 10:22
schestowitzZiggyFish: other programs already exist. The problem is that they don't get packaged under the same priorities and Novell spills money into development with Mono (e.g. fspot, banshee).Aug 16 10:23
neighborleewhat a nasty mess that is too...I followed much of that closely, and fspot ( and any mono app ) used a OLD mono lib in ubuntu for very long time,,terrible memory usage and crashy...but no one listened they just continued to push it even on warnings from other developers..blind trust ;)Aug 16 10:25
ZiggyFishjust looking at the cheese source code, it's CAug 16 10:26
neighborleeI remember the bugzilla's on them.Aug 16 10:26
schestowitzZiggyFish: someone told me that when installed in Ubuntu, it pulls Mono along with it.Aug 16 10:27
ZiggyFishlet me confirm thatAug 16 10:27
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/02...Aug 16 10:27
schestowitzCheese is mentioned in this post.Aug 16 10:27
schestowitzThat's just the problem. It's enough for a C program to just /touch/ something that touched Mono in terms of function calls and voila! The whole thing is infected by association.Aug 16 10:28
ZiggyFishwell looking at the dependencies, it doesn't seem so (there is no dep on libmono or anything to do with mono)Aug 16 10:29
ZiggyFishtomboy and fspot do howeverAug 16 10:31
schestowitzOh, I see now: "f-spot for F-Spot export (optional)"Aug 16 10:31
schestowitz"Here is not an example of the dependencies, but of more peripheral incursion: http://www.gnome.org/projects/cheese/ Note the recommendation of f-spot."Aug 16 10:32
neighborleegez, more nonsense from gnome-M$ team ;)Aug 16 10:33
neighborleestart calling them GnoM$eAug 16 10:34
ZiggyFishdependancies on cheese areAug 16 10:34
schestowitzWell, it's Novell. I'm not sure everyone in GNOME is fascinated with Mono at all.Aug 16 10:35
schestowitzNovell just seems to favour Mono because it sees it as a danger zone to other distros that wants to use the same GPL-licensed programs (with Novell copyrights).Aug 16 10:35
neighborleeIf gnome developers really cared about foss and keeping it clean they likely would have avoided this mess long agoAug 16 10:36
neighborleeso nope I just can't buy itAug 16 10:36
neighborleeor would have forked it long ago at least-Aug 16 10:37
ZiggyFishgconf2, gstreamer0.10-plugins-base, gstreamer0.10-plugins-good, gstreamer0.10-x, libart-2.0-2. libatk1.0-0, libbonobo2-0, libbonoboui2-0, libc6, libcairo2, libdbus-1-3, libbus-glib-1-2, libeboot1.2-9, libedataserver1.2-9, libgconf2-4, libglib2.0-0, libgnome2-0, libgnomecanvars2-0. libgnomeui-0, libgnomevfs2.0, libgstreamer-plugins-base0.10-0, libstreamer0.10-0, libgtk2.0-0, libhal, libice6, liborbit2, libpango1.0-0, libpopt0Aug 16 10:40
neighborleefriend showed me this in #lemmings, so I share this kewl thing here :) :: http://www.glumbert.com/media/coolwaterfallAug 16 10:40
neighborleetalk about stunning ;)Aug 16 10:40
schestowitzNice!!Aug 16 10:41
neighborlee:)Aug 16 10:41
schestowitzIt's too engaging. I forced myself to close it.Aug 16 10:42
neighborleehehAug 16 10:43
schestowitzJust spotted: http://www.computerworld.com/action/article...Aug 16 10:45
schestowitzI put the news in Digg and it made the front page earlier.Aug 16 10:46
ZiggyFishnice vidAug 16 10:47
schestowitz"From a Microsoft perspective, Latitude ON represents a debacle comparable to the UMPC disaster. Microsoft led a big push to drive sales of Vista-based Ultra-Mobile PCs, all of which failed catastrophically in the market, rejected by users in favor of first Linux-, then XP-based subnotebooks."Aug 16 10:47
schestowitz"Now, it's happening again. Remember Windows Vista Sideshow? The feature was part of a broader effort by Microsoft to provide basic functionality on laptops while the main Windows OS was in sleep mode. A tiny screen on the lid would display the UI. Obviously that failed, and now partner Dell is delivering roughly similar but vastly superior functionality using Linux and other non-Microsoft software. "Aug 16 10:48
neighborleeoh boy, M$ is getting bad news right and left..Aug 16 10:48
neighborleeno wonder they try to infest linux hahaAug 16 10:49
neighborleealmost made it tooAug 16 10:49
ZiggyFishlikes attract ;)Aug 16 10:49
neighborleehehAug 16 10:49
schestowitzIt's gratifying to live in an age where FOSS gains traction. The danger, however (the raison detre of BoycottNovell), are attempts to harm FOSS from the inside, like planting a bomb that will have it self destruct or its ownership (in the IP sense)be passed to Microsoft.Aug 16 10:50
neighborleeyupAug 16 10:50
schestowitzMiguel wants Linux for himself (and for Microsoft/Novell). They use patents and exclusion (e.g. hypervisors) to crack GPL right down the middle. The FSF should start voicing its opposition more openly and furiously, IMHO.Aug 16 10:51
neighborleewell fedora livecd is a good start anyway...with any luck the others will follow, though I dont know really since ubuntu , and now mandriva are in non patent zones I guess ? ;(Aug 16 10:52
neighborleelegallyI have no idea how all that worksAug 16 10:53
neighborleelegallyAug 16 10:53
schestowitzMandriva?Aug 16 10:53
neighborleeyup, they now have it.Aug 16 10:53
schestowitzNovell's story goes like this: "Our Linux is better *AND* safer than your Linux. And you can't have a copy because it requires royalties (to Microsoft/Novell)..."Aug 16 10:53
neighborleeyup you read that righgtAug 16 10:53
schestowitzHave what? Mono?Aug 16 10:53
neighborleeyupAug 16 10:53
schestowitzIn GNOME only, right?Aug 16 10:54
neighborleein gnome versoin anyway..no idea bout kdeAug 16 10:54
neighborleefaik yesAug 16 10:54
schestowitzI use Mandriva with KDEAug 16 10:54
neighborleeahAug 16 10:54
schestowitzBut that's a fair point, though. TBH, most GNOME distros come with Mono now. Jeff Waugh uses it as 'proof' that it's OK.Aug 16 10:54
schestowitzThe problem is, developer naively include it based on the hypothesis that "everyone else does". Meanwhile they incorporate more dependencies while Richard Dale put some hooks for it in KDE (first seen over  a year ago).Aug 16 10:55
neighborleeThe Latitude ON feature uses a low-power Intel Arm processor (just like the new Eee PCs), flash storage and Linux (SUSE Linux Enterprise Desktop 10) separate from the laptop's main CPU, hard drive and Windows OS.Aug 16 10:56
neighborleeoh great they u sed suse eek ;0-Aug 16 10:56
neighborleeno idea if that version has mono though..maybe not ,but still scary by  any standard ;)Aug 16 10:56
ZiggyFishI was thinking about switching to fedoraAug 16 10:56
schestowitzneighborlee: yes, I wrote about it.Aug 16 10:57
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/14/...Aug 16 10:57
neighborleeahhhAug 16 10:58
schestowitzThat's Mono on board, mind you. Some Windows ISV also tried to shove Mono into  LiMo (Linux phones). For all I know, Samsung pays Microsoft for Linux... probably its Mono/Linux phones.Aug 16 10:58
schestowitzWith boiler room deals, you never know. They leave you to just speculte and then insult you with terms like "paranoid" and "conspiracy theorist".Aug 16 10:58
neighborleeyup :)Aug 16 10:59
neighborleethats ok, ever vigilent we remain ;0-Aug 16 10:59
neighborleekeepin em honest !Aug 16 10:59
schestowitzI thought about contacting Dell before, but who to ask there....?Aug 16 11:00
neighborleetheir coorporate headquarters as def. start of courseAug 16 11:02
neighborleebut hm, if they were in deal with M$/novel, I dont  plan on much of a reply ;)Aug 16 11:02
neighborleetime to rest here its a bit late...bbl take care all ;))Aug 16 11:03
neighborleelee over and out 0-0Aug 16 11:03
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schestowitzNo reply from IBM (except Chris Ward, as usual) about Lotus being proprietary and marketed as "open": http://www.sutor.com/newsite/...Aug 16 11:07
schestowitzhttp://blogs.the451group.com/opensour... "For his part, Levin sees proprietary software not being displaced by open source, but vendors being forced to evolve..." Sounds like Microsoft.Aug 16 11:12
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schestowitzhttp://news.cnet.com/8601-13... "This is sad. The Wii was the one last gaming haven against the madness of ever-increasing violence and gore in gaming, which is desensitizing our youth to the horrors of evil and death and destruction. We see the results in the news almost every day."Aug 16 12:06
schestowitzhttp://tirania.org/blog/archive/2... *Blech* Having done the Mono-Google Summer of Code, they now assist the Web get further encumbered by Microsoft .NET. Who pays the wage of these people?Aug 16 12:12
trmancohttp://www.microturfs.org/ -> nice websiteAug 16 12:43
trmanco... and nice article too -> http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/15/l...Aug 16 12:44
trmanco:)Aug 16 12:44
schestowitzYes, there's room for expansion.Aug 16 12:44
schestowitzMaybe we can build an index of shills at some stage. Shill-o-meter with an inputbox.Aug 16 12:44
trmancololAug 16 12:45
trmancocoolAug 16 12:45
MinceRthat wii outrage is ridiculousAug 16 12:45
trmancoshill-o-meter sounds great :)Aug 16 12:45
MinceRif he doesn't want to see violence on his wii, he shouldn't buy the damn gameAug 16 12:45
schestowitzYes, but the point is different. It's about what children are given.Aug 16 12:46
MinceRchildren are given what they parents buy for themAug 16 13:15
schestowitzYes, if they are under 10.Aug 16 13:15
MinceRor if they can't afford them otherwise. :>Aug 16 13:16
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ZiggyFishlol, just reading the requirements for cheeseAug 16 14:24
schestowitzFound anything news?Aug 16 14:25
schestowitz*newAug 16 14:25
ZiggyFishWhat are the Requirements?                                                                   GNOME 2.22               GStreamer 0.10               postr for Flickr export (optional)               f-spot for F-Spot export (optional)               a webcam               _____________a brain_______________Aug 16 14:25
schestowitzYes, that's the snag.Aug 16 14:25
ZiggyFishlolAug 16 14:26
ZiggyFishyou need a brain to use cheese, that means half of the population can't use itAug 16 14:27
MinceRonly half?Aug 16 14:28
ZiggyFishlolAug 16 14:28
ZiggyFishanyway it's 11:40 here, going to bed, c yaAug 16 14:34
schestowitzI've just posted http://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/... and I hope it'll wake some people up already.Aug 16 14:34
alfaurosyou are one busy man, i'm starting to suspect that boycotnovell is you day job :)Aug 16 14:35
*ZiggyFish thinks the sameAug 16 14:36
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pcoleVaporware announcement "Windows 7 details to be released". http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/te...Aug 16 15:56
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schestowitzThanks, seen it and will post about it.Aug 16 15:58
schestowitzMary Jo Foley made fun of this latest hype burst.Aug 16 15:58
anivarschestowitz: Planning a public protest in Bangalore on swpat http://fci.wikia.com/wiki/Say_No_To_...Aug 16 15:59
schestowitzThanks, I noticed that Groklaw has it up too.Aug 16 16:01
schestowitzI mentioned it 2 days ago.Aug 16 16:01
schestowitzhttp://boycottnovell.com/2008/08/15/assor...Aug 16 16:01
anivari found it. but it was just a planning meetingAug 16 16:02
anivarNot a protestAug 16 16:02
schestowitzOh!Aug 16 16:02
anivarProtest is on next saturdayAug 16 16:02
anivarI started a facebook page tooAug 16 16:03
anivarhttp://www.new.facebook.com/eve... (not public)Aug 16 16:03
schestowitzI'll give that a mention.Aug 16 16:04
*schestowitz away for a few hours.Aug 16 16:06
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_Doug:PAug 16 17:28
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os4everdidnt microsoft "buy" novell just to get miguel deicazaAug 16 18:36
schestowitzNovell bought Ximian for a "Red Carpet", according to its ececutive/s.Aug 16 18:37
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schestowitz*Executives.Aug 16 18:37
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schestowitzHiAug 16 18:38
os4everHiAug 16 18:38
schestowitzHave you logged in before?Aug 16 18:39
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twitterGood morning.  Catching up.  Voting machines, funny. Mono code infection ... isn't it funny how the Munchkins used to tell people to beware of GPL "cancer" and to quarantine GPL code along with people who used it?  Typical M$ hypocrisy.  Waterfall - flash. ...Aug 16 19:17
schestowitzI'm catching up with Novell this afternoon. Not much for SUSE recently...Aug 16 19:20
twitterWe've had the Lattitude On is nice, but I'd like to see it with Ubuntu instead of Vista.Aug 16 19:20
schestowitzhttp://digg.com/linux_unix/Dell_int... (Some troll comments there)Aug 16 19:20
schestowitzHere is a "Linux 1%"  troll: http://digg.com/linux_unix/15_to_25...Aug 16 19:21
schestowitzThe second troll here is Gary Steart with libel. I suspect the first is his sockpuppet because he went around the Web picking photos of mine and he makes the same jokes: http://digg.com/linux_unix/Start_...Aug 16 19:23
twitterDo any of those 10 laptops have an OS choice?Aug 16 19:35
schestowitzI don't know. Might be... it's a really early stage and more of an announcement rather than a  product. I saw it coming about 6 months ago because a Dell strategist there clues and Michael Larabel leaked rumours a couple of months ago. H-P might do this too, but the clues about the are fewer. NVidia is supposed to deliver a biggie this month.Aug 16 19:37
twitterDell's search engine blows.  It finds ubuntu, some XPS but then a bunch of spare parts.  Someone looking for a laptop with GNU/Linux is going to run away screaming.Aug 16 19:41
twitter"Linux laptops" finds no such animal.Aug 16 19:41
pcoleThat's happened before at dellAug 16 19:41
schestowitzYes, also in the UK.Aug 16 19:44
twitterprobably why I stick to used thinkpads.Aug 16 19:44
schestowitzI did a bit of a tour a while ago (they say that 3% of the PCs in the UK now come with GNU/Linux preinstalled): http://schestowitz.com/Weblog/archives/200...Aug 16 19:45
twitter:) amazing that people find it.Aug 16 19:45
MinceRwhy used thinkpads? why not new thinkpads?Aug 16 19:45
schestowitzTo find the Linux desktops at Dell I needed to search for Ubuntu or Linux, but it's still a case of digging rather than navigating.Aug 16 19:45
twitterYou found one, not me.Aug 16 19:46
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twitterUsed thinkpads cost a lot less than new ones.Aug 16 19:46
MinceRicAug 16 19:47
schestowitzThinkpads are ugly :-DAug 16 19:47
twitterOne day, when I'm rich and famous, I might buy a new laptop.  I expect to see better deals in UMPCs before that happens.Aug 16 19:47
schestowitzI had a 400MHz laptop between 1999 and 2005. I actually used such a machine with just 32MB of RAM until 2005.Aug 16 19:48
pcoleThe last laptop I bought was a T30Aug 16 19:48
twitterLaptops look about as good as their screen and software.  I don't see the rest of it often.Aug 16 19:49
twitterCan't live without track point.Aug 16 19:49
pcoleInstalled SIDUX on T30 and never looked back.Aug 16 19:49
twitterMy last laptop was an X30 which I got two or three years ago.  It runs Debian well, but the front bezel broke after a couple of hard falls.  It is still all I need.  One day, I'll buy a new bezel.Aug 16 19:51
schestowitzThe eWeek people seem to be keen on Debian+Thikpads.Aug 16 19:51
twitterRMS had one but said he was moving to OLPC.Aug 16 19:52
twitterAlan Cox had his 600 burst into flames.  My 600 is doing better than that.  233 MHz, 256MB, it's not so fast but it has a great screen.Aug 16 19:53
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twittergood keyboard and good feel, but heavy next to the X30.Aug 16 19:53
twitterMy 600 is about 10 years old.  I only replaced it because work gave me gigs of data to deal with.Aug 16 19:56
pcoleThat's all I do right now, is play on the benevolence of the company and use their throwaways.Aug 16 19:57
twitterI got a really beat T23 before the X30, but it was so broken mechanically that it would lose it's mind when I moved it.  I think it came from a high school program, so it was 3rd hand.Aug 16 19:58
pcoleI will not buy any machine with windows, suse, or xandros preinstalled.Aug 16 19:58
twitterThe X30 had XP.  That did not last long.Aug 16 19:59
twitterbrbAug 16 19:59
twitterI did a big upgrade (400MB) of lenny and need to restart X.Aug 16 20:00
twitterI have a few other things to do to ...Aug 16 20:00
twitterlaterAug 16 20:00
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schestowitzAt least Linspire is out of sight now. Less trouble to keep track of...Aug 16 20:03
MinceR205024 <@schestowitz> Thinkpads are ugly :-DAug 16 20:08
MinceRno uAug 16 20:08
trmancoschestowitz: http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php... -> nice quote you caught thereAug 16 20:08
trmanco:)Aug 16 20:08
schestowitzMinceR: they are very durable though. Maybe IBM gave them away to Lenovo because they harmed its *image*.Aug 16 20:10
schestowitztrmanco: it's true. Did you see the article I wrote about it?Aug 16 20:10
trmancoyes indeedAug 16 20:10
MinceRi doubt IBM cares about its image that muchAug 16 20:10
trmanco:)Aug 16 20:10
trmancoloved itAug 16 20:11
MinceRor that thinkpads would harm itAug 16 20:11
trmancoschestowitz: don't mind if I digg it do you?Aug 16 20:11
schestowitzOh, please do.Aug 16 20:11
trmancook, just one sec...Aug 16 20:12
trmancohttp://digg.com/linux_unix/Why_Micros...Aug 16 20:15
trmancodone :)Aug 16 20:15
schestowitz:-))Aug 16 20:17
schestowitzThanks!Aug 16 20:17
schestowitzI've noticed two new comments in http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_...Aug 16 20:18
trmancono problemAug 16 20:18
trmancochecking the comments :)Aug 16 20:18
schestowitzThe Linux Today people are hard to fool. There are hardly eny trolls there, either. It's one of the sites where almost nobody trusts Novell.Aug 16 20:19
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trmancoI've seen Jose_X as commented on one of your blog posts, about 3 times in a rowAug 16 20:22
trmancobut I don't get him :|Aug 16 20:22
schestowitzHe's quite insightful. He likes some terms like monopolyware and monopolysoft.Aug 16 20:23
schestowitzHmmmm... Jose has just left 4 comments in BN.com. I'm reading them right now.Aug 16 20:27
trmanco5 digg in 12 minutes :)Aug 16 20:27
trmancowell 4 ...Aug 16 20:28
schestowitzHeh. They seem receptive to this site in Digg. I always see it getting many Diggs there very fast (compared to other stuff that's more important).Aug 16 20:31
trmancocool thenAug 16 20:32
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schestowitzHm... that's concerning: http://www.infowars.net/artic... Aug 16 21:48
twitter1Ick, an autotroll http://www.pakin.org/complaintAug 16 21:53
schestowitzNice http://www.pakin.org/complaint?title=Mr...Aug 16 21:55
twitter1saw that Lessig article, things can and will get worse.  Richard Clark has been making stupid noises for a long time http://slashdot.org/~twitter/journal/183721Aug 16 21:57
twitter1The bit about a false flag operation is new but predictable.Aug 16 21:58
schestowitzI thought it had already started. I complain a lot about this too. It's part of the same fight (FOSS vs digital slavery)Aug 16 21:58
twitter1It has always been on but it will get worse http://ipower.ning.com/netneutrality2Aug 16 22:02
schestowitzYes, it's easier to identify the crooks. ACTA is indirectly related.Aug 16 22:03
schestowitzBTW, be careful of OStatic. They carry on with the "OSS is Mac and Windows" message (seen here http://ostatic.com/170876-blog/f... ) and the man on top was caught astroturfing for Microsoft.Aug 16 22:04
twitter1ACTA is a slavery "harmonizing" act.  There's been a lot of this lately.Aug 16 22:04
schestowitzMcCreevy, that tosser, is behind a lot of that. At least 3 such things.Aug 16 22:05
schestowitzPeople should really find out who he dines with and track that bank account or something. He sells EU to the US...Aug 16 22:05
twitter1The "breaking down the stovepipes" stuff was going on before 911 provided fear and excusses.Aug 16 22:06
twitter1Everyone is being sold to the mega corps.Aug 16 22:06
schestowitzAnd this can be combated how? Other than street protests or outings of corrupt people for scrutiny?Aug 16 22:07
twitter1The US sold itself first though.Aug 16 22:07
schestowitzIt's the same in the UK. I have two new links about it. Will post them tonight.Aug 16 22:08
twitter1Knowledge and freedom are the only answers to tyranny, that's why the megacorps are moving so fast to shut down the internet and free software.  We are still, theoretically, democracies that can act.Aug 16 22:10
schestowitzHehe. Well, they took Slashdot away from you, didn't they?Aug 16 22:11
twitter1The inordinate attention paid to smearing advocates of freedom is good evidence the megacorps are running scared.Aug 16 22:11
schestowitzIn an interview yesterday I shared my experiences on the abuse in Digg, which I consider far more serious than the gaming.Aug 16 22:12
twitter1Slashdot is not lost to anyone.Aug 16 22:12
twitter1Gaming is why you are abused.  It's propaganda with a purpose.Aug 16 22:12
schestowitzDigg is now a high-flyer with Google and the big money. They want users, ads, CON-tent... never mind the abuse in the 'community' (ants)Aug 16 22:12
twitter1Google wants to apply technical solutions to problems.  They understand that their system must work automatically if it is to succeed.Aug 16 22:13
schestowitzWell, they censor in China... for cash.Aug 16 22:14
twitter1All business with China is unethical.Aug 16 22:15
schestowitzI guess they could argue that if they didn't do it, others would (and grab the market share... Baidu comes to mind), but there was a hearing with the Big 3 in the high court 2 years ago. Corruption seems acceptable when there's money on the table. That's just repulsive.Aug 16 22:15
twitter1The problem is that trade is allowed in the first place.  People who trade with slave labor ruin themselves.Aug 16 22:16
twitter1why am I twitter1?Aug 16 22:16
schestowitzI don't know. Wondered this myself...Aug 16 22:17
schestowitzDid you see what RMS said about trade with Cuba last week?Aug 16 22:17
trmancoyour irc client is crazy :PAug 16 22:17
twitter1Pidgin's problem is it's operator.Aug 16 22:18
twitter1I saw that article you linked up but did not really read it.Aug 16 22:18
twitter1I imagine RMS said the US position was crazy.Aug 16 22:19
schestowitzBesides, some could argue that doing business with the Bush Admin is also unethical. It harbours neo-imperialists and offers them protection in exchange for money. In turn, they  exploit foreign countries.Aug 16 22:19
twitter1Something about the difference between US relations with China and Cuba and N. Korea.Aug 16 22:19
schestowitzOr... slaughter many people by going to unnecessary wars.Aug 16 22:20
twitter1This is true.  There are impeachment articles pending.Aug 16 22:20
schestowitztwitter1: no, he said they should only focus on social issues. He escaped that question about embargo, but he gave a brilliant answer.Aug 16 22:20
twitter1I should have read it but I did not trust Infoworld, or whatever it was, to get it right.  The sudden focus on RMS from the Wintel press looks like an attempt to smear RMS as a radical.Aug 16 22:22
twitter1RMS has been all over the world, why only pay attention when he's in Cuba?Aug 16 22:23
schestowitzYes,, they sort of smeared him.Aug 16 22:24
schestowitzThere was the interview (from Tenet, IIRC), but it was only a  blog.Aug 16 22:24
twitter1Focusing on social issues is a good idea anywhere.  These are where your rights are stolen.Aug 16 22:25
twitter1gotta run, I'll be back.Aug 16 22:25
schestowitzHe then made an article which, IMHO, demonised Stallman. You know the sort of people who concentrate on radicalism, appearance and tinfoil hats rather than the /KEY/ message...Aug 16 22:25
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schestowitzHi, CrimsonJupiter.Aug 16 22:47
CrimsonJupiterHiAug 16 22:48
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schestowitzkentma: get a load of this: http://www.infowars.net/articles/au...Aug 16 22:52
trmancohttp://www.linuxloop.com/news/2008/0...Aug 16 23:03
schestowitzYes, I spotted this. He quotes 4%, which is what I put in the front page of Digg (highlighting a paragraph from Yahoo). :-)Aug 16 23:05
trmancogoodAug 16 23:06
trmancobut I still think Linux has more marketshareAug 16 23:06
trmancothen just the 4%Aug 16 23:06
schestowitzSee http://groups.google.com/group/c...Aug 16 23:07
*kentma looksAug 16 23:07
schestowitzAnd desktop market share is not all. Desktop processors only make up about 2% of the overall picture.Aug 16 23:07
*kentma is busy typing french vocab into a new testing script for the kids. Have bitten the bullet, and am now using mysql and a 'c' test script... Aug 16 23:08
schestowitzYou get them to grok mysql at that age? What are you doing!?!?!1111Aug 16 23:08
kentmahehe no - I'm writing the mysql stuff, they just have to learn the french & the spanish :-)Aug 16 23:09
trmancoWow -> According to our statistics, 96.4% of computer users are running Linux. Whoa!Aug 16 23:09
kentmatrmanco: which users would they be?Aug 16 23:10
schestowitzIt all depends on definitons. Microsoft loves talking about 'desktop' as 'computer'Aug 16 23:10
trmancoallAug 16 23:11
kentmawell, I refer you to the debate I recently had on cola wrt Desktop.Aug 16 23:11
trmancoservers, desktops, all kinds of devices and gadgetsAug 16 23:11
schestowitzAccording to Live.com visitors and servers, maybe everything is Microsoft. But that's a /narrow/ definition.Aug 16 23:11
kentmayou don't have to convince me :-)Aug 16 23:11
trmancomy router is running linux, these little gadgets aren't countingAug 16 23:11
schestowitzAccording to boycottnovell.com logs, there are more GNU/Linux users out there than Windows users. :-)Aug 16 23:11
trmancohmmAug 16 23:12
kentmatrmanco: I have a pair of wrt54gls which run white-russian.  My house is full of linux things :-)Aug 16 23:12
kentmaschestowitz: aha - of course heheAug 16 23:12
schestowitzWell, it's true.Aug 16 23:12
trmancothats good :)Aug 16 23:12
schestowitzLet me check again.Aug 16 23:12
schestowitzThis month it's 42.7 % for GNU/Linux and 42.5 % for Windows. Close race.Aug 16 23:13
trmancoit depends on the website, more people using Linux will go to BN just to see the latest articles about microsoft's monopoly and corruptionAug 16 23:14
schestowitzMacs at 4.3 %. *Chuckles*Aug 16 23:14
kentmaschestowitz: you should publish those numbers in cola every week as a news item ... it would certainly wind up the trolls.Aug 16 23:14
trmancoI don't think a windows fanboy would even read the title of BN, IMHOAug 16 23:14
schestowitztrmanco: the web ;surveys' only weigh sites that support an assertion of /value/Aug 16 23:14
trmancothats trueAug 16 23:15
trmancocan't argue with thatAug 16 23:15
schestowitzAccording to Microsoft (a coiuple of years ago), only 0.2% (or 2%) of all computers had malware.Aug 16 23:15
schestowitzThe real number is somewhere around 70% I believe...Aug 16 23:16
kentmaanybody know what dead key to use for a cydilla?Aug 16 23:16
trmanco:)Aug 16 23:16
trmancowindoze zombiesAug 16 23:16
kentmaschestowitz: the 1984 internet thing has been on the cards for so long, it's amazing.  Governments deeply dislike anonymous communications - it annoys me intensely that our trolls are probably contributing massively to this.Aug 16 23:18
kentmaor even unfettered comms, for that matter.Aug 16 23:19
schestowitzMost GNU/Linux users who visit BoycottNovell use SUSE (so far this month).Aug 16 23:19
trmanco:|Aug 16 23:19
trmancothats not goodAug 16 23:20
kentmaah, got it - cydilla key is =Aug 16 23:20
schestowitzThat's the Novell people.. it's expected.Aug 16 23:20
trmancowell yesAug 16 23:20
trmancowhat about browsers?Aug 16 23:20
trmancogot any info on that?Aug 16 23:20
schestowitzMandriva, Debian, Ubuntu and Fedora are almost equal. SUSE is just a little ahead.Aug 16 23:20
schestowitztrmanco: I can do a post about it (with pictures).Aug 16 23:21
trmancogood, I will stay tunnedAug 16 23:21
trmancotuned*Aug 16 23:21
schestowitzBut there was something similar before.Aug 16 23:21
schestowitzIt gives the impression that there's tracking although the logs are flushed after graphs are plotted.Aug 16 23:22
MinceRhow do you know the distro of a visitor?Aug 16 23:24
MinceRrevealing version numbers?Aug 16 23:24
schestowitzNo, not quite. The thing is, many are not identified at all. Many are unspecified.Aug 16 23:25
schestowitzI wanted to check versions of Konqy to see if KDE4 adoption is rising fast, but AWStats doesn't do version breakdown of the 'lesser-known' Web browsers.Aug 16 23:26
*dsmith_ (n=dsmith@c-76-114-142-224.hsd1.md.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovellAug 16 23:41
schestowitzIt looks like CompiterWorld is daemonising RMS again: http://computerworld.co.nz/news.n... (watch how they cut the video)Aug 16 23:48
kentmaschestowitz: it's a standard technique.  it does seem to work on stupid people, though.Aug 16 23:50
schestowitzPlease watch it. It's disgusting. This Intelsoft press is making his look like a dangerous man.Aug 16 23:50
schestowitz*himAug 16 23:50
kentmahe is a dangerous man, though, as is Mr Lessig.Aug 16 23:52
schestowitzThis is bad. Look how they sliced the video. They present it as though he's a dangerous man while cutting/editing out his rationale.Aug 16 23:53
schestowitzYes, Lessig too. He's exposing some crooks in government these days. He could get hurt for it.Aug 16 23:54
kentmathere are very big guns out for both of them, I'm sure.Aug 16 23:58

Recent Techrights' Posts

[Meme] Community of People to be Exploited, Then Thrown Away, Left Behind or Even Slandered
Debian.org front page
Alexandre Oliva's FSF disposition
During my recent trip for LibrePlanet, I was fortunate to have, or at least start, long conversations with nearly everyone in FSF staff
One More (Failed) Attempt to Deplatform the Sites by Harassing and Threatening Webhosts
What we're seeing here is a person who abuses the system in Canada at Canadian taxpayers' expense trying to do the same in the UK, at British taxpayers' expense
12 Days Have Passed Since the Edward Brocklesby Revelations and Debian Project Has Said Absolutely Nothing About That
One must therefore assume they have nothing to say in their defence (covering up severe security failings)
Coercion From the "Consent" and "CoC" Crowd is a Self-Defeating Tactic
Freedom of the press; Nothing less
According to statCounter, GNU/Linux Increased From 3.77% to 3.89% This Month (Worldwide), Windows Now Below 20% in 78 Nations, Below 10% in 27 Nations
Highest since March (for GNU/Linux)
 
The World is Becoming (or Has Already Become) Linux
An intercontinental success story
Georgia: Bing Share Fell by Half Since 'Bing Chat' (LLM Hype), Fell Behind Yandex As Well
Georgia's situation is interesting
[Meme] SPI and 'FSFE': Sponsored by Microsoft to...
women's instincts do not matter to these strongmen
[Meme] Shitburger of an LLM
IBM and the Hololens
Links 17/06/2024: Chatbot Nonsense Thrown Under the Bus (Severe Failure, Pure Hype), How to Finance Free Software 'Hackers'
Links for the day
Debian's Personal Attacks Are Upsetting Women, Too
Female Debian Developer: "I Believe Daniel [Pocock] is On the Right Track."
Microsoft's Bing is So Irrelevant in Moldova (1%) That Russia's Yandex is About 5 Times Bigger
How much longer before Microsoft throws in the towel?
Yes, You Can
Unless you live somewhere like Russia...
[Meme] Listen to the Experts
Bill Gates didn't even finish university]
Roy and Rianne's Righteously Royalty-free RSS Reader (R.R.R.R.R.R.) and the Front-End Interfaces
As the Web deteriorates the availability, quality and prevalence of RSS feeds is not improving, to put it mildly
Algeria Shows High GNU/Linux and Android Adoption, All-Time High and Almost Three-Quarters of Web Requests
GNU/Linux was below 3%, now it is above 3%
Mass Layoffs at Microsoft-owned GitHub (About 80 Percent of the Staff in India Laid Off)
It's not just in India
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, June 16, 2024
IRC logs for Sunday, June 16, 2024
Gemini Links 16/06/2024: Scarecrows, Moles, Ham Radio, and No IPs
Links for the day
Africa is Android and Green (Chrome, Not Just Android Logo)
In Africa Firefox is almost below 1% now
Covering Abuses and Corruption
We'll never surrender to blackmail
Ubuntu Running Out of Energy
Its planet too is deteriorating
Links 16/06/2024: In Defence of Email and Why Recycling Symbol Lost All Meaning
Links for the day
Gemini Links 16/06/2024: Computer Science Course Union and Potentiometer
Links for the day
Cross border crime: sale of Swiss insurance in France and European Union without authorisation
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Letting Microsoft systemd Manage /home Was a Terrible Idea All Along
systemd-tmpfiles, deleting /home
Patriotism is OK, But We Need Facts and Reason, Not Blind Obedience to Authority
Very seldom in the history of human civilisation has groupthink proven to be of real merit
When You Touch One of Us You Touch All of Us
We have a principled, uncompromising stance on this matter
Links 16/06/2024: New Sanctions Against Russia, Fentanylware (TikTok) Causing More Problems
Links for the day
Social Control Media in Japan: Twitter (X) Has Collapsed, YouTube Rising (Apparently)
What a genius Mr. Musk is!
Windows Cleansed in South Africa (Already Hovering Around 10% Market Share)
Plus Microsoft's mass layoffs in Africa
[Meme] Satya Nadella's Windows PC RECALLS Not What He Did
Satya got lucky
Usage of Let's Encrypt in Geminispace Has Collapsed (That's a Good Thing!)
Ideally, or eventually, all capsules will sign their own certificates or have their own CA
North Macedonia: Windows Down From 99.2% to 28.5%
Last year it was even measured at 26%
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Saturday, June 15, 2024
IRC logs for Saturday, June 15, 2024
Gemini Links 16/06/2024: Hand Held Maneuvering Unit and Hugo Static Files
Links for the day
Removing the Tumour From IRC
looking back
[Meme] The Free(dom) Software Engineer in European Elections
“When the debate is lost, slander becomes the tool of the loser.”
Vista 11 Was 'Leaked' Exactly 3 Years Ago and This One Picture Says It All
how 'well' Vista 11 has done
A Smokescreen for Brad Smith
Maybe the key point was to say "Linux is not secure either" or "Windows and Linux are equally vulnerable", so don't bother dumping Microsoft
Windows Sinking Below 13% Market Share in the Island of Jamaica
Microsoft's decline continues and will mostly likely continue indefinitely in Jamaica and its neighbours
Links 15/06/2024: Microsoft's Intellectual Ventures Attacks Kubernetes With Software Patents, More Layoff Waves
Links for the day
Gemini Links 15/06/2024: On Lagrange and on YouTube Getting Worse
Links for the day
Edward Brocklesby: hacker received advance notice of zero-day vulnerabilities in MH and NMH email software
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
[Meme] Code Liberates Kids
Matthias Kirschner: I can't code, but I can write a book
In Armenia, Bing is Measured at 0.6%, About Ten Times Less Than Yandex
Bing will probably get mothballed in the coming years
[Meme] A Pack and Pact (Collusion Against Computer Users)
They never really cared about users, no more than drug dealers care about drug users...
GNU/Linux in Azerbaijan: From ~0.1% to 7%
Azerbaijan is around the same size as Portugal
Women in Free Software (FOSS) Need Action, Not Mere Words
the men who are loudest about women's rights are some of the very worst offenders
Embrace, Extend, Extinguish Minecraft
These folks should check out Minetest
Techrights Statement on Men Who Viciously Attack Women in Free Software
history shows women will win
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Friday, June 14, 2024
IRC logs for Friday, June 14, 2024
[Meme] People Who Cannot Find Gainful Employment Because of Their Poor Behaviour Online (Not the People Who Merely Call Them Out on It)
Imagine trying to become a lecturer while talking like this in public
You Too Would Get Nervous
countries where Windows is down to 2%
[Meme] The Two Phases (and Faces) of Microsofters
Microsofters: stalk IRC, then troll IRC
The 'Nobody Reads Techrights Anyway' Crowd
Send In the Clowns
Books in the Making
I intend to spend a considerable amount of time explaining what my family and I were subjected to for the 'crime' of promoting/covering Free software
Microsoft is Still Losing Malta
And GNU/Linux is doing well on laptops and desktops
Tux Machines: Third Party Impending
There will be more next week