Bonum Certa Men Certa

Guest Post: Helping Roy Delete Debian at Work and Home

By figosdev

Geese in flight

Summary: "What we probably don't want to do is continue to support Debian or systemd, if we can help it."

Roy needn't go far for reasons to delete Debian, he only needs to read Techrights. I mean, look at all this.



I've also read (from a source Roy should consider reliable) that Stallman is aware of the problems created by Microsoft systemd, which Debian has used to undermine and divide against its community and developers for years.

In better days, Ubuntu was a nice gateway to Debian, but today it is increasingly monopolistic (putting itself in app-store-like control of Snap -- not its development, but its deployment) and acting as a shill for WSL -- Ubuntu devs have increasing influence in the Debian world as well.

"I've also read (from a source Roy should consider reliable) that Stallman is aware of the problems created by Microsoft systemd, which Debian has used to undermine and divide against its community and developers for years."I had fewer reasons than this when I migrated from Debian nearly six years ago; none of us get to choose what Roy uses at home, though I often wonder why he persists in relying on such an incredibly toxic distribution.

Then again, migration is often far from simple -- and if you count activism, Roy has several full-time jobs.

The goal then isn't to put pressure on Roy which he can just shrug off as simply as he would not having wings or extra limbs, but to try to make it a bit easier for him to imagine his world without the horrors of Debian. "Better the Devil you know," sure, but Roy knows that's really not true.

Surely one of the reasons Roy wouldn't change his distro is that he would have to change his workflow; this is like gambling with both spare time and extra trouble. A migration that's smooth as possible would minimise the gamble and instability likely to result from changing distros.

Another thing to consider would be how much control the change is either giving or taking away from Microsoft.

While I could write an article about the long-term advantages of moving to a more modular distro like Tiny Core, as I did before moving to BSD, this article will instead focus on seeking short-term benefits and minimising workflow disruption; if we want to tempt Roy away from Debian, I doubt Tiny Core is the best place to start. I simply went to more trouble to make it suit my own needs than I want to subject Roy to if he even seriously considered doing this soon.

"In better days, Ubuntu was a nice gateway to Debian, but today it is increasingly monopolistic..."I do however, note that Techrights itself has migrated to something more minimalist; perhaps Roy would benefit from using Alpine at home, perhaps not. It should be considered, even though it's not a choice I would likely make as I believe Alpine has a GitHub-based init system. Although it is a step up from systemd, in terms of being GitHub-based this would make Alpine a lateral move from what he uses now. Though as I said, there are lots of reasons to leave Debian.

I think it is best to let Roy worry about which distro he would move to IF he decided to move, and I would also recommend the following criteria towards that decision:

* A distro that is not itself developed on GitHub, obviously. This counts Void out.

* A distro that does not use systemd.

* A distro that is as close to Debian as possible, but is not Ubuntu or Devuan.

Obviously my first choice for Roy would be OpenBSD, but even for me I decided to switch distros before switching operating systems -- for Roy this step would help even more.

Devuan was considered before the Alpine migration I think, and for whatever reason it was dismissed, Roy knows I have others. Besides, I think Devuan has most of the problems that Debian has except for a couple well-known exceptions.

Roy has a setup consisting of several machines and even more screens. He most likely manages those screens with either xrandr or a tool that uses xrandr. Even if Roy were to switch to BSD, this would not likely change. Probably the most trouble I've had with more than one screen is from Tiny Core -- you need to install the "graphics" package to get a window system and xrandr that can handle more than one screen.

Roy likes Falkon and I confess, I do not keep track of which distros support KDE. I've had nothing but complaints about KDE since 4.x (props to Trinity) and their recent cancel-fest was not inspiring. I don't blame Roy at all for liking Falkon relative to other choices though; web browsers suck.

"I had fewer reasons than this when I migrated from Debian nearly six years ago..."I think Roy makes heavy use of tmux and it is incredibly standard; even OpenBSD comes with tmux included (though I've deleted it because it's developed on GitHub).

You can migrate piecemeal without a plan, but for Roy I recommend a plan (which he can tweak as it suits him) since it will increase both the ease and likelihood of an actual move. The plan is also piecemeal.

As far as I can tell, there are two sane ways to begin this process: one is with a quick and simple assessment of his workflow, and the other is with a plodding, methodical and tedious assessment. If Roy wasn't always spread among lots of other projects, I would suggest the plodding and tedious assessment; for that, you boot Debian from live and list the installed packages using apt list, then compare this to a list from Roy's installation(s).

"Obviously my first choice for Roy would be OpenBSD, but even for me I decided to switch distros before switching operating systems -- for Roy this step would help even more."But possibly even before that, I would suggest Roy start by figuring out which of his machines has the "simplest" job in terms of his regular workflow, as I believe he uses each machine a bit differently. The whole process is actually easier if he uses all of the machines for the same things, but I doubt he does. If he uses them all the same way, then he can simply remove one machine from the "RAIL" (redundant array of inexpensive laptops) and redistribute the workflow manually over the other machines.

BirdsWe are going to assume Roy has a slightly different workflow on each machine, though either way it should be reasonable to assume that one machine has the smallest or simplest workflow. I recommend he target that one for migration.

The priority is to make a reasonably complete list (even if only pen and paper are used) of purposes that machine serves. For the purpose of choosing a distro to switch to, a similar list for each machine would probably be beneficial as well -- but we at least need a list for the target machine.

Depending how important that machine is, a full backup with tar or rsync to one of the other machines is obviously recommended; if it is very important, a second backup to standalone media may also be worthwhile.

The machine can then have the new distro installed to it -- I'm not certain dual booting is worth the trouble, but Roy knows best. I would lean away from it for this purpose because it simply makes getting used to the new system take more time (and in some ways, more trouble).

"Depending how important that machine is, a full backup with tar or rsync to one of the other machines is obviously recommended; if it is very important, a second backup to standalone media may also be worthwhile."A reasonable goal is to retain as many of the tools already used on that machine as possible. Some minor workflow goals may change or even improve. The backup of the system should be moved (or copied) back to the target machine, so that it is trivial to access old files. Only the most valuable, high-priority cruft from the old installation should make its way into the new installation as needed, but a repository of all old files can sit under a folder in /root, /home or /opt.

Soon the new machine will be up to capacity in terms of its purpose on the RAIL, and Roy can consider repeating the process with the second-least used machine.

As the migration moves forward, Roy will likely learn some new tools or at least new tricks with existing tools. Even when his migration from Debian is complete, it could be years before his wife wants to migrate; but then this is just about Roy. What distro his S/O uses is really no concern of mine.

"What we probably don't want to do is continue to support Debian or systemd, if we can help it."We can't force Roy to do anything, but perhaps this will offer him a friendly nudge for future consideration. In this short run, this is workflow-disruptive; in the long run, it would inspire new innovations or shortcuts -- not entirely unlike the ones that have happened at Techrights lately. What we probably don't want to do is continue to support Debian or systemd, if we can help it.

Long live rms, and Happy Hacking.

Licence: Creative Commons CC0 1.0 (public domain)

Recent Techrights' Posts

Our Case is a Very Easy Win, the SLAPPs From Microsofters Were a Grave Error, and Censoring Information Won't Work (It'll Only Ever Backfire)
Censoring is what people do when they lose the argument
 
Links 04/06/2025: WSL Backfiring on Microsoft and "Disney, Microsoft Announce Massive Layoffs"
Links for the day
Say the Truth, the Rest Will Follow
There's no guarantee that writing the truth will result in an audience (or readership), but over time - in the long run - people generally gravitate towards what they know or feel to be crude truth, not just what's comforting (albeit false or self-deluding, usually groupthink dictated from above)
How to Expose High-Level Corruption Without Getting in (Too Much) Trouble
Democracy depends on free press and freedom of the press depends on being able to safely publish (and keep available) material that bad people don't want to be known to anybody
In-Depth EPO Coverage at Techrights Turns Eleven
11 years is a very long time
Windows Measured Below 10% in Afghanistan, GNU/Linux Gaining a Lot
about 80% are Android (Linux) users, compared to only about 10% for Windows
Poland's Political Predicament and Social Control Media
Democracy and fake "tech" don't mix well; the latter tends to interfere with the former and that's why we get more "Putins" out there
EPO: Taking Away From the Staff to Give More to the Rich
The Central Staff Committee (CSC) wrote to EPO staff earlier this week
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, June 03, 2025
IRC logs for Tuesday, June 03, 2025
Abuse Inside the Polish Patent Office (UPRP) - Part I: It's a Lot Like the EPO
we can commence a series soon
Gemini Links 04/06/2025: Inescapable Questions and Quitting All "Oligarch Tech"
Links for the day
Slopwatch: Linux FUD From Slopfarms, Blaming Linux for Microsoft Issues; Even WebProNews Has Become a Slopfarm (Googlebombing "Linux" With Slop Images and Fake/Plagiarised Text)
The Web is really getting bad; it's also overwhelmed by fake material or plagiarised material, wherein the plagiarism gets disguised/hidden by LLM sausage factories
Links 03/06/2025: Tiananmen Square Massacre Censorship and Growing Military Activities Around Taiwan
Links for the day
Linux is Already Dominant (Android), Let's Make GNU/Linux Dominant in Desktops/Laptops as Well
"Dr. Stallman recently warned everybody about Microsoft."
The Loyalty to Microsoft and the Salaries From Microsoft (Funding SLAPPs Against Techrights and Tux Machines)
Garrett always knows better. He knows everything best.
Windows Falls in Italy as GNU/Linux Jumps to 5%
Italy knows a thing or two about digital autonomy
Nigeria is All Android and Google
Windows down to almost nothing in Africa's largest population
Mass Layoffs at Microsoft (Second Wave) Not Limited to Redmond
"More layoffs at Microsoft as axe falls in Washington and California"
Gemini Links 03/06/2025: Forth System and "Common Lisp is a Dumpster"
Links for the day
The Leaks Were Right: Mass Layoffs at Microsoft in May, Then Another Wave in June
Just as we've been saying for over a month
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Monday, June 02, 2025
IRC logs for Monday, June 02, 2025
Last Article From Australia's Sam Varghese Was a Year Ago and It Covered the Release of Julian Assange, Who Will Apparently Come Back as 'Politician'
It'll soon be exactly 12 months
Hungary Seems Hungry for Linux
Windows down by a lot
Like in Europe, Bad News for Microsoft in US and Canada
If it loses those "regions", then what's left?
About 8 Waves of Mass Layoffs at Microsoft in 2025 (in Less Than 5 Months), Now Vista 11 "Market Share" Decreases
Really bad news for shareholders of Microsoft
statCounter Sees Bing "Share" Falling Over 0.5% in One Month, Now Lower Than Before the ChatGPT/Bing Chat Hype
Bing has been part of the mass layoffs for quite some time
After Microsoft's Bankruptcy in Russia Android (Linux) Will Dominate Asia Completely
Windows probably peaked in "XP" or "2000"
Microsoft's Demise is a Global Phenomenon
mass layoffs justified using mindless buzzwords
All-Time Highs for GNU/Linux in EU and the UK, All-Time Lows for Microsoft
Combining ChromeOS and GNU/Linux, it adds up to and almost reaches 6%
India: Windows Falls to 50% in Desktops/Laptops and 8% Overall
laptops/desktops fell to 16% of the whole
statCounter: GNU/Linux Up to 4.7% "Market Share" This Month
30,000 Microsoft jobs may be eliminated by year's end
Microsoft is in Trouble and Microsofters Know It
"I've been happy on Win 3.11 for years."
[Video] New Introduction to Richard Stallman's Contributions Including GNU Emacs, GNU/Linux, and Software Freedom
from the channel previously bullied for supporting RMS
Links 02/06/2025: South Korea to Vote, Russia Blitzed From Within
Links for the day
Links 02/06/2025: Political Leftovers, DRM, and Patents
Links for the day
Links 02/06/2025: Microsoft Spins Layoffs as "Slop", Frontier Settles Lawsuit
Links for the day
When You Publicly Boast About Wanting to Violently Attack People (Even Colleagues) Finding a Job Will Prove Difficult
there's a lesson to be learned here
The Web We Lost, the Information Lost Due to Microsoft's Attacks on Companies Like Yahoo! (Before the LLM Slop Frenzy)
When it comes to news sites, what can we say?
Covering Corruption in Poland, Including a War on Science (Due to Bad Politicians)
What we're about to show is that skilled and experienced scientists in Poland are besieged by bureaucrats
Gemini Links 02/06/2025: "Star Wars Day" and "Security Day"
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Sunday, June 01, 2025
IRC logs for Sunday, June 01, 2025