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Ubuntu 10.04 Increases Mono Dependency

Mono the Trojan
Source: "Mono, the Trojan" (reused with permission)



Summary: Ubuntu adds Mupen64 and gbrainy, which is another Mono application (for games) that's installed by default

SOME months ago we suggested and laid out practical paths [1, 2] by which Ubuntu 10.04 can get rid of an unhealthy dependency on Microsoft and its little ecosystem at Novell; People like Jeremy Allison and sites like Groklaw agree on this [1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7].



One of our readers (among more who are trying the latest alpha of Ubuntu 10.04 at the moment) says that Ubuntu increased rather than decreased its dependency on Mono. This discussion began here, but some of it was discussed past midnight last night, so we have no logs up yet. That's why we append a potion of the logs below. We do not think that Mupen64 has any Mono dependency (awaiting clarification from the source of the allegation), but perhaps it was tied to it in the repositories in error. There is time to fix this prior to release next month, but gbrainy is the real issue here because it's definitely Mono based. It helps discourage Ubuntu GNU/Linux users from removing Mono. For details about gbrainy, see the second part of the logs below.






Boycott Novell logo

IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: February 28th - March 1st, 2010



-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Ive been sloppy.....never realized that Mupen64 was a Mono app. Time to remove it. #monoFeb 28 22:44
*Guest6059 has quit (Ping timeout: 252 seconds)Feb 28 22:45
*Balrog (~Balrog@2002:4a6d:3979:0:222:41ff:fe21:e8cc) has joined #boycottnovellFeb 28 22:45
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] RT @_goblin I've been sloppy.....never realized that Mupen64 was a Mono app. Time to remove it. #monoFeb 28 22:45
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] but why can a person receive a tweet and reply. then in the stream the reply comes before the tweet?Feb 28 22:45
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] How I noticed Mupen64 depended on Mono: http://www.twitpic.com/ypnc9 ;) #mono - you know what you can do with the "gift to the world"Feb 28 22:48
phIRCe-BNcTitle: How to tell if you have Mono on your system #mono - Please be... on Twitpic .::. Size~: 7.96 KBFeb 28 22:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] mono updates coming through in ubuntu, how long can canonical ignore the bad feeling they generate?Feb 28 22:51
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera I think if the bad feeling spills into the "mainstream" userbase. Having said that a Mono removal would hardly cripple CanonicalFeb 28 22:52
schestowitzhttp://pogson.6k.ca/2010/02/26/m-loses-xp-downgrade-lawsuit/Feb 28 22:52
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   M$ Loses XP downgrade lawsuit at  Robert Pogson .::. Size~: 23.2 KBFeb 28 22:52
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera So I think they will merely wait and see which way the wind blows. If its too unpopular they can remove and move on.Feb 28 22:53
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] @_Goblin so how do we look at canonical now? as i suspect just another business or can you tell me they have values?Feb 28 22:59
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_the_mad_hatter] Horay! Gold for the Canadian Men's Olympic team. Now that all the distractions are over, I can get some work done!Feb 28 23:02
*jono_ (~jono@c-76-103-216-105.hsd1.ca.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovellFeb 28 23:06
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera IMO Canonical will do what it believes is best for its product and what its userbase wants. I think being realistic if CanonicalFeb 28 23:20
*oiaohm (~oiaohm@167.136.dsl.brs.iprimus.net.au) has joined #boycottnovellFeb 28 23:21
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-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] Buying ebooks will get you a complete customer service runaround http://tamaranth.livejournal.com/706216.html #amazonfailFeb 28 23:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera or any Linux distro wants to offer itself as a viable alternative to the masses, it will have to engage MS et al in a similar wayFeb 28 23:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera thats why I think the revenue streams of Canonical are a good idea. You are not forced into them, but it helps Canonical compete.Feb 28 23:22
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Tamaranth - The ebook saga continues .::. Size~: 46.65 KBFeb 28 23:22
bruce89forcing people to use them...sounds funFeb 28 23:22
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] If you use AdSense, try pushing people off IE for money. http://explorerdestroyer.com/Feb 28 23:26
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Explorer Destroyer - Switch to Firefox, Make money from Adsense Referral .::. Size~: 11.71 KBFeb 28 23:26
schestowitzFun like brushing the tongue with a razor bladeFeb 28 23:26
*Eruaran has quit (Remote host closed the connection)Feb 28 23:28
MinceRthe parts i like the most about explorerdestroyer are the "click this button to sign up: *big empty space*" dealsFeb 28 23:33
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] @_Goblin you say. we are forced into teen competition game for a few, i look forward to cooperation as natural for the benefit of the manyFeb 28 23:35
schestowitzhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BWK5uxMBeJMFeb 28 23:37
phIRCe-BNcTitle: YouTube- Exposed to Hell by 5th Grader .::. Size~: 141.57 KBFeb 28 23:37
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera I would not like to second guess Canonical, however without ideas such as Ubuntu One or online music stores, how wouldFeb 28 23:38
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera they manage to compete or even stay in business? If Canonical could live off praise then it would be a wealthy company...Feb 28 23:38
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera I think concessions will have to be made if the Windows locked in masses are to be freed from MS MonopolyFeb 28 23:39
sebsebseb Feb 28 23:39
sebsebseb Feb 28 23:39
MinceR Feb 28 23:39
bruce89come on, at least use a non-breaking spaceFeb 28 23:39
sebsebsebbruce89: a non-breaking space?Feb 28 23:40
sebsebsebMinceR:Feb 28 23:40
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] The biggest problem for cooperation is some shite saying another is getting something for free and does not care.Feb 28 23:40
bruce89€ Feb 28 23:40
bruce89like thatFeb 28 23:40
sebsebsebbruce89: looks the same to meFeb 28 23:40
bruce89it's totally different in a variable width fontFeb 28 23:40
sebsebseb Feb 28 23:40
sebsebsebbruce89: Feb 28 23:40
MinceRbruce89: € Feb 28 23:41
cubezzzwhat's with the blank lines? :)Feb 28 23:41
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_the_mad_hatter] Biggest complaint about the Olympics - Don Cherry wasn't the hockey commentator.Feb 28 23:41
sebsebsebcubezzz: bordedom/fun/bothFeb 28 23:41
MinceRi just gave bruce89 a no-break spaceFeb 28 23:41
MinceR(had to search gucharmap for it)Feb 28 23:41
bruce89as did IFeb 28 23:41
sebsebsebbeen at my computer again, for an hour or so, just over something like thatFeb 28 23:42
cubezzz Feb 28 23:42
sebsebsebcubezzz: öäöåöåöäöåööäöåöåöåööäö åöåöäöåööåöåöåöäöåöåöÖäöåö åöäööäåöåöäöäöåöåööäöåöåöäöFeb 28 23:43
MinceRëFeb 28 23:43
sebsebsebMinceR: €£Feb 28 23:43
*DaemonFC (~ryan@c-69-245-224-113.hsd1.in.comcast.net) has joined #boycottnovellFeb 28 23:44
sebsebsebcubezzz: Feb 28 23:44
sebsebsebDaemonFC:  Feb 28 23:44
sebsebsebDaemonFC: HiFeb 28 23:44
DaemonFCeveningFeb 28 23:44
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[davidgerard] No DL found, but major sorting of bedroom done. FLOOR! Lots of stuff thrown away by 5-Year Rule: if not used in last 5 yrs, out it goes.Feb 28 23:45
sebsebsebDaemonFC: eveningFeb 28 23:46
bruce89flipping hell, he's office trolley has floated into the flume!Feb 28 23:48
sebsebsebbruce89: What?Feb 28 23:48
MinceR:DFeb 28 23:48
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[satipera] @_Goblin ref your concessions post. we will have to watch them like rats in a cheese factory and for the obvious reasonFeb 28 23:49
MinceRthe "ffi" ligature in DejaVu Sans Mono is funnyFeb 28 23:49
MinceRit looks just like "ffi" written in CourierFeb 28 23:49
sebsebsebMinceR: Something about a font I assumeFeb 28 23:49
MinceR(or maybe Konsole took that ligature from another font)Feb 28 23:49
sebsebsebMinceR: yep your on about fonts for some reason/sFeb 28 23:49
MinceRwell, these ligatures make little sense in monospaced fonts :)Feb 28 23:49
bruce89of courseFeb 28 23:50
bruce89that's why I did itFeb 28 23:50
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] Lucid 10.04 has a brain training "game" thats Mono dependent btw..."great loss" there when Mono gets removed! ... thanks but no thanks.Feb 28 23:50
bruce89№ℴ℉℡ⅰFeb 28 23:50
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @satipera I think that would be true of any company and I think maybe why when Microsoft wasn't it ended up like it is today.Feb 28 23:51
schestowitzHeh. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZIhRJhylqsFeb 28 23:57
phIRCe-BNcTitle: YouTube- Religion Rant .::. Size~: 143.17 KBFeb 28 23:57
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] IBM saves money by paying workers less http://www.itwire.com/it-people-news/enterprise/37223-will-ibm-offshore-800-jobsFeb 28 23:58
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[schestowitz] @_goblin by _default_?Feb 28 23:58
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*Balrog (~Balrog@2002:4a6d:3979:0:222:41ff:fe21:e8cc) has joined #boycottnovellMar 01 00:00
-BNtwitter/#boycottnovell-[_goblin] @schestowitz You referring to the "Brain" game? If so, yes. It's festering in there upon install. #monoMar 01 00:00
*_Goblin (~goblin@94-193-188-104.zone7.bethere.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovellMar 01 00:00
_Goblinstuff twitter for conversations....Mar 01 00:01
_Goblinwell, spent a bit of time with 10.04 now....Mar 01 00:02
schestowitzHey, _GoblinMar 01 00:02
_Goblinhi!Mar 01 00:02
schestowitz_Goblin: got screenshot of it?Mar 01 00:02
schestowitzI'd like to show it in BNMar 01 00:02
_Goblinwhat 10.04 or the "brain game"?Mar 01 00:02
_Goblinbrain games gone....I can re-install if you wish.Mar 01 00:03
_Goblin10.04 has a pic on my twitpic...but its just one of Yahoo search.Mar 01 00:03
_GoblinI must say though, 10.04 alpha 3 is already showing great improvements over 9.10Mar 01 00:04
_Goblinin terms of performance...Mar 01 00:04
sebsebseb_Goblin:  DaemonFC  jono_  I am reading this what a great read it seems http://www.starryhope.com/linux/2010/confessions-of-an-ubuntu-fanboy/Mar 01 00:04
phIRCe-BNcTitle:   Confessions of an Ubuntu Fanboy - Starry Hope .::. Size~: 84.05 KBMar 01 00:04
_Goblinputting aside Mono and brain games, it's certainly encouraging seeing it so stable and fast and only in alpha 3Mar 01 00:04
_GoblinI feel though for Ubuntu to be considered by the masses it needs to sort its aesthetics out...for me I never use a default theme of any distro, but as Microsoft realized early on, if you want to attract a mainstream audience, it needs to look pretty.Mar 01 00:06
schestowitz_Goblin: ahaMar 01 00:07
schestowitzHow many games in there in total?Mar 01 00:07
sebsebseb_Goblin: Yes the theme is important, it needs to look good!Mar 01 00:07
_Goblinstandby...just looking at my other rig....Mar 01 00:08
bruce89gcc may have a part in that possibly maybeMar 01 00:08
sebsebsebschestowitz: ok it uses Mono, however this is actsually the first time they have a game that doesn't totally suck in the default installMar 01 00:08
sebsebsebbefore it was just the Gnome gamesMar 01 00:08
sebsebsebwhich suckMar 01 00:08
bruce89how so?Mar 01 00:08
_Goblinyou have solitaireMar 01 00:08
_Goblinthe brain gameMar 01 00:09
_Goblinmine sweeper...Mar 01 00:09
sebsebsebbruce89: Windows XP comes with better default games than Ubuntu/GnomeMar 01 00:09
_Goblinsome sort of word gameMar 01 00:09
sebsebsebI mean how XP does Freecell and suchMar 01 00:09
MinceRshould ubuntu install Nexuiz by default? :>Mar 01 00:09
sebsebsebMinceR: noMar 01 00:09
sebsebsebMinceR: they need games that are 100% family friendly by defaultMar 01 00:09
_GoblinI think it was originally 5 or 6...although Ive removed some...Mar 01 00:09
bruce89there's a gnome-game freecellMar 01 00:09
sebsebsebbruce89: yes I played it or whateverMar 01 00:10
sebsebsebXP still wins for the card games how they are doneMar 01 00:10
MinceRhow's that going to help with the "games which suck" problem? :>Mar 01 00:10
_Goblinsebsebseb: but who plays those soppy run once games?Mar 01 00:10
sebsebsebVista they change  them, and it's like uhMar 01 00:10
bruce89gnome-games isn't really supposed to be exciting or whateverMar 01 00:10
bruce89although the use of clutter in them may helpMar 01 00:10
_Goblinsebsebseb: I will conceed and say Solitaire should stay...the rest though? is there any need?Mar 01 00:10
sebsebsebbruce89: clutter?Mar 01 00:10
sebsebseb_Goblin: what would be good is if when installing Ubuntu, it asked people what  they wanted to installMar 01 00:11
_Goblinmany if mono was removed along with its few dependent packages, then there would be enough room for gimp?Mar 01 00:11
_Goblin*maybeMar 01 00:11
bruce89there's an exampleMar 01 00:11





Boycott Novell logo

IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: March 1st, 2010

DaemonFCschestowitz, They added a new one in LucidMar 01 12:11
DaemonFCschestowitz, They added gbrainy to the default installMar 01 12:12
DaemonFChttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GbrainyMar 01 12:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Gbrainy - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia .::. Size~: 29.72 KBMar 01 12:13
DaemonFCschestowitz, http://tirania.org/blog/archive/2008/Jan-03.htmlMar 01 12:13
phIRCe-BNcTitle: Mono on the OLPC - Miguel de Icaza .::. Size~: 13.86 KBMar 01 12:13
DaemonFCinfecting the OLPC with MonoMar 01 12:14
DaemonFCtalks about gbrainyMar 01 12:14
schestowitzMono?Mar 01 12:17
cubezzzvia arm laptop, 117.59 (USD) shipping includedMar 01 12:17
schestowitzDefault?Mar 01 12:17
DaemonFCschestowitz, yes to bothMar 01 12:18
DaemonFCschestowitz, So they're not moving away from Mono, they're adding more apps to the default install which require MonoMar 01 12:19
DaemonFChttp://img268.imageshack.us/img268/6000/screenshotol.pngMar 01 12:29


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