Bonum Certa Men Certa

Anonymous Commenters Debate Whether Battistelli's EPO Can Revoke Pensions of Dismissed Employees Who Dare -- GASP -- Find Alternative Employment

"Disaster for the EPO."

Siege Philips Amsterdam
No people jump through the windows of this building, where Dutch law is still applicable (unlike the EPO)



Summary: A look at causes for desperation and immense pressure at the EPO, where pensions can be cut as means of reprisal and people can be denied employment even after they leave the European Patent Office (EPO)

THE EPO is still in a state of crisis, based on what Board 28 said. Nothing has improved since.



Battistelli found a regime at a level low enough even for him, having just visited Morocco (warning: epo.org link, also published separately in French). To be fair, after ignoring or breaking European laws he can't make friends. Not many politicians would wish to be associated with him in any way if they actually did their homework. Battistelli is somewhat of an outcast except within circles of dyed-in-the-wool patent maximalists and large patents-hungry corporations such as Philips.

Battistelli's mistreatment of his own workers has earned him a zero (yes, 0%) approval rate/level, based on a recent extensive study (thousands of respondents). He not only abuses the staff while this staff works for the Office but also when the staff is ill. He is punishing them even after leaving the Office for good (after dismissing them under highly controversial circumstances). What kind of 'President' is this? Maybe the kind of ruler one might expect to find in Morocco or Tunisia.

Reflecting or remaking on the mistreatment of former EPO staff, several comments in IP Kat were too good to ignore. One person wrote:

Here's an interesting question: what would be the consequence if an EPO employee (let's assume for the moment a member of DG3) were to defy a "ban" imposed by the EPO president on taking up new employment?

Presumably, it would be impossible for the EPO to take legal action against their former employee. This is because such action would need to be launched before the national courts, which apply national laws and not EPO internal rules. (Plus, of course, the EPO might be reluctant to take action in the light of the very high likelihood that the EPO's rules would be found to be contrary to national laws.)

Would that mean that the only action that the EPO could take would be depriving their ex-employee of the benefit of a pension from the EPO? If so, that could be a risky strategy - as it could open the door to legal action against the EPO. In such a situation, what defence could the EPO mount against an accusation of "stealing" acquired rights from their ex-employee? If the answer is their internal rules, then we return to the question of whether they would really want to try to justify those rules before a national court...

An issue here could perhaps be the challenge of getting a national court to accept jurisdiction for the dispute. However, it is arguable that the EPO's immunity would not apply to disputes involving the proposed, new rules. This is because immunity of the Organisation applies only within "the scope of its official activities" (Art. 3(1) PPI). Further, such "official activities" are defined in Art. 3(4) PPI as "such as are strictly necessary for its administrative and technical operation, as set out in the Convention". It is hard to see how it could possibly be argued that the new rules could be argued to be "strictly necessary" when the EPO has functioned perfectly well for decades without them!


Here is a response to this:

The Office would simply start disciplinary action and decide to cut the pension. And if you think you have a legal way out of that via the national courts, I suggest you inform the people recently dismissed about your findings.

Yes: I know about Art. 3(4) PPI. In practice, it is never applied. May I remind you that the Office was condemn by a Dutch court and that the Vice President said in front of Dutch TV that they will not follow the judgment? What more do you need?


There is also this:

Suing a former employee by the EPO may not be so easy, but withholding the pension = income is an extremely severe punishment for any former employee, but especially so for pensioners who want to continue e.g. as patent agents. And it such a case it is the EPO that has to be sued by the former employee, which, as we all know, takes years. By the time the pensioner has won that case, he is dead.


The issue of taking away people's pension attracted some attention earlier this week. "This is quite an important question," one person told me and another said [1, 2, 3]: "True as far it concerns national law procedure however they would immediately start an intern. disciplinary procedure and decide to cut your pension! Most probably without success! Sad but true this is Europe anno 2016 ! Hold your breath and be prepared it will even get nastier in the near future!"

Further (more recent comments) spoke about Ms. Hardon's pension cut:

you may well be right. However, the only pension that I am aware of having been "cut" (that of Ms. Hardon) was apparently restored. I doubt that Monsieur le President reversed his decision purely out of the kindness of his heart... which might mean that there were other (e.g. legal) reasons that left him with no choice but to hand over what, in any event, were acquired rights.

The question of whether the EPO respects the judgement of a national court is, ultimately, a matter for the AC. That is, they have the power to order the president to respect any judgement - and to eject him if he refuses to do so and/or to lift his immunity. I guess that whether the AC decides to take any action depends upon how much political pressure they feel under from their bosses back home. Not the most ideal set-up for ensuring that fundamental rights are respected at the EPO, but not entirely hopeless.

Here is another interesting point: the proposed, new conditions of employment (including what those in private practice might see as an equivalent of a restrictive covenant for DG3 members... and perhaps others) were not those that EPO employees agreed to when signing up. Imposing restrictions on future employment is a very serious matter, and so requires the explicit (and informed) consent of any employee to be bound by such restrictions. With this in mind, how could the AC even contemplate rubber-stamping the unilateral imposition of such restrictions by way of "new rules" that have not received the consent of the employees that they affect?

That alone would appear to be a very good reason for the AC to simply dismiss the proposed rules out of hand.


"Batistelli has recently denied the AC the power to tell him what to do," one person then added. "Disaster for the EPO." Here is the full comment:

First, very good reasons have not been the guidance followed by the AC for a long time, even less so under the Batistelli administration. Second, Batistelli has recently denied the AC the power to tell him what to do. So what is the sum total of this picture? Disaster for the EPO.



In relation to the Boards, which we wrote about in the weekend and early this week [1, 2, 3], one person said:

About the boards of appeal and the UPC: the UPC, as the EPO board of appeal and the German "Bundespatentgericht" foresees legal and TECHNICAL members. Finding legal members should not be too much of a problem (although the language requirements may prove to be a problem), but finding technical members will probably be. The technical members need to be: -trained technically, basically they should have an engineering diploma -fluent in the 3 official languages and -trained legally (although not as much as a legal member). Basically the idea is that the courts should have specialists able to understand in details what the Patent is about (especially important in difficult subject matter like chemistry, biotech, computers...). In the EPO board of appeal and the Bundespatentgericht, the technical members were recruited from examiners.

The EPO board of appeal is the single largest collection of people filling the requirements of TECHNICAL members (especially when one considers language requirements).

Now Battistelli, being motivated by his personal vendetta against the board of appeal, has caused a major problem. In a well run office, the board of appeal would be sufficiently staffed, so that a fraction of their members could be sent to the UPC to train future staff and deal with the first cases. Battistelli closed that route twice: by making sure that they will be legally excluded to do so and by refusing to staff the EPO board of appeal for years. None of this is proper management: every manager knows that when a new branch is started, training new staff is a bottleneck. It is in all the management books.


There are quite a few other comments on this subject which we didn't mention, but many seem to suggest that "Battistelli, being motivated by his personal vendetta against the board of appeal, has caused a major problem." (or something along these lines)

We sure hope that EPO staff, including the Boards of Appeal, will fight back against Battistelli and his 'baby', the antidemocratic UPC. We welcome leaks relating to this subject. The UPC would be sunk if more of the European public knew the truth about the UPC force-feeding and what forces motivate this whole push.

Recent Techrights' Posts

Generation Chaff - Phase V: Censorship of Dissent (Painted as Harassment or Terrorism)
Censorship is all around us now
Generation Chaff - Phase IV: Apps Only Few Companies Decide On
Tools are being collectively confiscated, under the premise or false prospect of "security"
Why We Support Richard Stallman and You Probably Should Too
It's not about being "Richard Stallman fan", it is about maintaining the right to hold positions (on technology) like his
Some Large German Media Covers Richard Stallman's Talks in Germany Earlier This Week
LLM-based chatbots are just "bullshit generators" (as he has long called them)
Trouble in Red Hat/IBM and a Retreat to Ponzi Economics in Search of Wall Street Market Heist
Would you invest your life savings in this kind of crap?
Who Asked Software in the Public Interest (SPI) for a Refund? ($100,000, Resulting in Losses of $267,201 in 12 Months, Highest-Ever Losses)
The IRS does not reveal who or what's tied to this refund (or the cause/reason)
 
Coping With the Site Going More Mainstream
Fame is no laughing matter
They Never 'Put Down' Corporations
There are "pests" that are traded in Wall Street
21 Pages in Less Than 7 Hours is No Joking Matter
We've become a lot more effective and efficient
Correct Information is a Valued Asset in the Age of Slopfarms and Public Relations (PR) or Spin
Publishing suppressed facts is never easy
The Register MS Continues to Bag Money to Promote a Ponzi Scheme, Even Money From China
Today in the front page
analytics.usa.gov: The Only Supported Version of Windows (This Past Week) is Only Used by About 13.9% of People in the US, the Home Base of Windows
Even Vista 7 is still used more
Rust is Very Secure
If only Rust itself is secure
Who Will be Held Accountable for Breaking Ubuntu by Imposing Rust on Otherwise-Functional Programs, in Effect Replacing GNU With Proprietary Microsoft (GitHub)?
they're practical people who merely point out that a bunch of buffoons not only ruin Ubuntu but also every future distro based on Ubuntu
Generation Chaff - Phase VIII: In Summary
Like "Science" with a capital "S", what we see here commercial interests usurping everything
Generation Chaff - Phase VII: Curtailing Alternative Media
There was always an obligation - a collective duty of sorts - to uphold independent journalism
Generation Chaff - Phase VI: Centralisation of Information (X, Cheetok/Fentanylware)
Would you trust information when controlled by such people?
Generation Chaff - Phase III: Slop and Plagiarism
A lot of the current so-called 'economy' is built upon false valuations
Generation Chaff - Phase II: "Cloud", Blockchains and Other Hype
For those of us who turned down those propositions there was a struggle; we needed to justify not having skinnerboxes or "social" accounts in some site run by a private company
Generation Chaff - Phase I: Social Control Media
IRC predates the Web
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Thursday, October 23, 2025
IRC logs for Thursday, October 23, 2025
More Clues Shed on Collapse of Microsoft XBox
XBox is basically circling down the drain as Microsoft implements 2-3 waves of layoffs each month
'Vibe Coding' Doesn't Work
In a lot of ways, so-called 'Vibe Coding' is already considered vapourware or a passing fad promoted in the media by managers who try to justify mass layoffs, especially ridding companies of "very expensive" software engineers
Links 24/10/2025: Microsoft's Killing of XBox Connected to Revenue/Profit Problems, "How Elon Musk Ruined Twitter"
Links for the day
Gemini Links 24/10/2025: 86,400 Seconds and "Society's Task"
Links for the day
Slopwatch: Google News and Slopfarms That Relay Nonsense From LLMs
Google News, which once prioritised or used to care about provenance and quality, is feeding slopfarms
Links 23/10/2025: More Health Concerns Over Dumb Chatbots (LLMs) and "Talking Cars" as Latest Buzz
Links for the day
Gemini Links 23/10/2025: Daylight Savings Time and Duration Shorthand
Links for the day
Links 23/10/2025: LLM 'Hallucinations' (Defects) in Practical Code 'Generation', China Becomes More Economically and Technologically Independent
Links for the day
Linux Foundation Uses LLM Slop to Promote Microsoft in Linux.com (Again), Rendering It a Linux-Hostile Slopfarm
Openwashing with slop by "Linux.com Editorial Staff", which basically seems to be a bot
Links 23/10/2025: Windows TCO Galore and "The Internet Is Going to Break Again"
Links for the day
Social engineering attack: Debian voted to trick you on binary blobs
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Techrights Will Always Stand for Women's Rights
We even invest money - personal savings that it - in our principles
Certified Lawyers Should Know Better (Than to Intimidate Us With Man Who Drives on Motorcycle Through a Really Bad Storm Between Distant Cities, Then Collects Photos of Our Home)
Mentioning someone was in prison for bad things isn't a crime, it's a public service
The "AI" (Slop) Bubble is Already Imploding
"ChatGPT Usage Has Peaked and Is Now Declining, New Data Finds"
The So-called "Sexy" Buckets (AI, Quantum) Cannot Save IBM From Reality, Shares Tank
"No matter how much financial hocus-pocus they use to reclassify revenues to land in the "sexy" buckets (AI, Quantum), it still smells old and musty - just like this company."
Paul Krugman is Wrong About the Scope of Mass Layoffs in the United States
A few years ago society was accelerating its journey towards feudalism, boosted by COVID-19
Links 23/10/2025: Proprietary Blunders and CISA's Latest Disclosure of Holes
Links for the day
Gemini Links 23/10/2025: Fast Past (F1), 99.9% Uptime
Links for the day
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Wednesday, October 22, 2025
IRC logs for Wednesday, October 22, 2025
Slopwatch: Google News is Promoting Fake 'Articles' About Fake Xubuntu, Fake Articles About Replacing Windows With GNU/Linux
The quality of the Web deteriorates and unless someone cleans up the mess, real sites will lose an incentive to produce anything
When "AI Layoffs" Mean Layoffs Due to the "AI" Bubble Popping
many people that are laid off by Microsoft claim to be specialists in "AI"
Mysterious grant forfeited, $100,000 from Software in the Public Interest accounts 2023
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Evidence: bullying, student union behaviour: Armijn Hemel's FSFE resignation
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Evidence: psychological abuse, stalking, Galia Mancheva, Susanne Eiswirt ignored by FSFE judgment for Matthias Kirschner
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Helping FSFE scam victims and conference organisers
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Nigerian fraud in FSFE constitution
Reprinted with permission from Daniel Pocock
Worrying and Amusing Stories of "Clown Computing" Gone Awry
Many of these disasters could be avoided
Links 22/10/2025: Amazon Plans to Replace Workers With Robotics, AWS and Clown Computing in General Ridiculed
Links for the day
Gemini Links 22/10/2025: Niri Completely Changes Multitasking and Overview of Diff-ers
Links for the day
Links 22/10/2025: Study on Misinformation by Slop and Heavily Debt-Sabbled Microsoft OpenAI (ClosedSlop) Uses "Browser" as Gimmick/Distraction
Links for the day
They've Already Spent Close to a Million Dollars on Lawyers and Sent Us About 50 KG of Legal Papers (Sponsored by Mysterious Third Party) to Try to Censor Techrights, Without Success
They try to overcompensate with sheer volume for a lack of solid, clear arguments (we are the victims here)
12 Months Ago the 'Hulk Hogan of UEFI' Officially Went 'Tag-Team'
We're actually sort of flattered or proud that such despicable people are so desperate to censor us
"Cloud Computing" Was Always a Joke, But This Week Was the Punchline
Maybe stop following tech trends and fashions
"Cloud Computing" Does Not Mean Safety
Fault tolerance is related to the notion of software freedom
Over at Tux Machines...
GNU/Linux news for the past day
IRC Proceedings: Tuesday, October 21, 2025
IRC logs for Tuesday, October 21, 2025
The Fall of Windows: From Something to Nothing
Of course Microsoft will pretend everything is fine and "just trust the hey hi" (AI)