03.09.09
IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: March 9th, 2009 – Part 2
To use your own IRC client, join channel #boycottnovell in FreeNode.
| schestowitz | W’ere in the front page of LinuxToday today,. | Mar 09 19:35 |
|---|---|---|
| schestowitz | PetoKraus: I don’t think he did. | Mar 09 19:35 |
| trmanco | presto? ugh | Mar 09 19:36 |
| *schestowitz has modpoint to spare | Mar 09 19:36 | |
| schestowitz | Prescott | Mar 09 19:36 |
| PetoKraus | schestowitz: you’re in manc? | Mar 09 19:36 |
| PetoKraus | *are you | Mar 09 19:36 |
| schestowitz | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/talking_… | Mar 09 19:36 |
| schestowitz | Yes. | Mar 09 19:36 |
| schestowitz | Here’s Prescott’s egg attack | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | i’m thinking of terrible coincidence | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | schestowitz: did he look like http://photos-b.ak.fbcdn.net/photos-ak-snc… | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | top right | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | that’d be a stretch | Mar 09 19:37 |
| schestowitz | No, who’s that? | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | but if it was him, that’s brilliant | Mar 09 19:37 |
| schestowitz | Which one is you? | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | my former classmate | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | none | Mar 09 19:37 |
| PetoKraus | he’s in manc, he goes to gym, and he is quite talkative | Mar 09 19:38 |
| schestowitz | Xandros PR submitted by http://www.technologyreview.com/ | Mar 09 19:38 |
| PetoKraus | but i guess there’s more than one gym in manc  |
Mar 09 19:38 |
| PetoKraus | alright | Mar 09 19:38 |
| PetoKraus | talk to you later | Mar 09 19:38 |
| schestowitz | They also link to th Presto homepage | Mar 09 19:40 |
| schestowitz | Not just to the submitter’s article | Mar 09 19:40 |
| schestowitz | Sounds like PR fluff | Mar 09 19:40 |
| schestowitz | PetoKraus: this guy was Asian. | Mar 09 19:41 |
| schestowitz | “CeBIT 2009 numbers drop 100,000″ | Mar 09 19:42 |
| schestowitz | http://www.hungry-hackers.com/2009/03/5-myt… “Myth 2 – I can protect my PC if I disconnect from the Internet or turn it off when I’m not using it.” | Mar 09 19:47 |
| schestowitz | Shillderle in the BBC pimping Vista: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/tech… | Mar 09 19:49 |
| *_Hicham_ (n=hicham@41.249.41.238) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 19:57 | |
| _Hicham_ | Hi All! | Mar 09 19:57 |
| trmanco | hello _Hicham_ | Mar 09 19:58 |
| schestowitz | Hey, wb | Mar 09 19:58 |
| _Hicham_ | how r u doing Roy? | Mar 09 19:58 |
| schestowitz | The patent mafia of Philips strikes again: http://www.pcworld.com/article/160908/no_mo… | Mar 09 19:58 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: I’m all right | Mar 09 19:58 |
| schestowitz | The world turns to ‘funny money’ and bogus assets now | Mar 09 19:59 |
| _Hicham_ | I just tried tried Debian Lenny and right now I am on Fedora 10 | Mar 09 19:59 |
| schestowitz | http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/32… CeBit photos | Mar 09 20:01 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: how is it? | Mar 09 20:01 |
| schestowitz | http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/49544… “The former detainee disclosed in a newspaper interview how he was shackled in a squat position and made to listen to an album by American rap artist Eminem “non-stop, 24 hours a day”. “ | Mar 09 20:02 |
| schestowitz | It’s nice, isn’t it? They use your music to torture people. | Mar 09 20:02 |
| _Hicham_ | Roy : Debian is a little bit outdated, but Fedora 10 rocks | Mar 09 20:03 |
| _Hicham_ | I never thought Fedora would become that easy | Mar 09 20:04 |
| schestowitz | F11 is coming soon. | Mar 09 20:04 |
| schestowitz | F10 was a good success. Debian is just rigorously stable, so you compromise cutting edge for polish | Mar 09 20:04 |
| trmanco | https://bugs.edge.launchpad.net/ubun… | Mar 09 20:05 |
| trmanco | ICQ pulls a Microsoft | Mar 09 20:05 |
| _Hicham_ | but Debian was more trouble | Mar 09 20:05 |
| _Hicham_ | I ve had problems with the soundcard | Mar 09 20:05 |
| schestowitz | Isn’t ICQ AOL now? | Mar 09 20:06 |
| _Hicham_ | because of their policy | Mar 09 20:06 |
| schestowitz | They bought Mirabbilis (Spelling), no? | Mar 09 20:06 |
| trmanco | ICQ, yes I think so | Mar 09 20:06 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: the “don’t buy hardware from FOSS haters” policy  |
Mar 09 20:07 |
| schestowitz | Sold for like $200m IIRC | Mar 09 20:07 |
| _Hicham_ | I dont understand | Mar 09 20:07 |
| schestowitz | Before the dot com bubble burst | Mar 09 20:07 |
| _Hicham_ | both Fedora and Debian are strong FOSS defenders | Mar 09 20:07 |
| trmanco | “In 1998, after two years of amazing growth, ICQ was acquired by AOL LLC. “ | Mar 09 20:07 |
| _Hicham_ | but Debian have a stricter policy | Mar 09 20:07 |
| schestowitz | I think so | Mar 09 20:08 |
| schestowitz | they compromised though | Mar 09 20:08 |
| trmanco | AIM is working fine though | Mar 09 20:08 |
| schestowitz | You could post to forms of the HW company | Mar 09 20:08 |
| _Hicham_ | Roy : it is just a firmware question | Mar 09 20:09 |
| schestowitz | Something along the lines of “I paid you for the hardware, can’t you at least give me code to make it work?” | Mar 09 20:09 |
| _Hicham_ | they removed alsa firmware from official repos | Mar 09 20:09 |
| schestowitz | alsa is aging | Mar 09 20:09 |
| _Hicham_ | but it is widespread | Mar 09 20:09 |
| *schestowitz on pulseaudio | Mar 09 20:09 | |
| schestowitz | Fedoa project BTW. They ‘bought out’ the guy | Mar 09 20:10 |
| _Hicham_ | who’s guy? | Mar 09 20:10 |
| schestowitz | pulseaudio, I think | Mar 09 20:10 |
| schestowitz | http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki… | Mar 09 20:10 |
| schestowitz | http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Intervi… | Mar 09 20:11 |
| schestowitz | b0rgshot: http://fedoraproject.org/w/uploads/e/ea/I… | Mar 09 20:11 |
| schestowitz | http://www.ipjur.com/2008/01/ffii-pre… | Mar 09 20:13 |
| _Hicham_ | wow | Mar 09 20:13 |
| _Hicham_ | that is great | Mar 09 20:13 |
| schestowitz | “EXTERNAL LINKa notice on a boad Wiki which is (at least currently) readable by the public, showing that Mr Pilch vigorously criticises Mr Barrionuevo, demanding that presidency should be taken over by the 1st vice president, Ms Laura Creighton.” | Mar 09 20:14 |
| schestowitz | zoobab01: what’s up with FFII? | Mar 09 20:14 |
| _Hicham_ | the problem with fedora is their packaging system | Mar 09 20:15 |
| _Hicham_ | and the lack of repo | Mar 09 20:15 |
| _Hicham_ | repos | Mar 09 20:15 |
| schestowitz | Mandriva’s great. | Mar 09 20:17 |
| *JoeSandwich (n=chrome@p54BD4B3F.dip.t-dialin.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 20:18 | |
| _Hicham_ | yes, mandriva has a lot of packages | Mar 09 20:18 |
| trmanco | http://bugs.kde.org/show_bug… | Mar 09 20:19 |
| schestowitz | They don’t let me have mysql from the repo unless I pay | Mar 09 20:19 |
| schestowitz | Fair enough, they just leave me to build or get my own | Mar 09 20:20 |
| schestowitz | Obama et al will hopefully offer no bailout to Microsoft & surroundings | Mar 09 20:20 |
| _Hicham_ | wow | Mar 09 20:20 |
| schestowitz | Let bad companies starve | Mar 09 20:20 |
| _Hicham_ | that is not good | Mar 09 20:20 |
| schestowitz | Then, people will raise the industry the right way | Mar 09 20:20 |
| _Hicham_ | you dont have to pay for mysql | Mar 09 20:20 |
| schestowitz | Mandriva to devour lots of XP machines (because VIsta was shunned all along) | Mar 09 20:21 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: no, but to get it from the repos (about 100MB) I need a non-free (gratis) version of Driva | Mar 09 20:21 |
| schestowitz | I can still get it | Mar 09 20:21 |
| _Hicham_ | that what took me away from Mandriva | Mar 09 20:22 |
| _Hicham_ | they are not 100% FOSS | Mar 09 20:22 |
| _Hicham_ | some of their behaviors are suspects | Mar 09 20:23 |
| _Hicham_ | they are trying to make money the MS way | Mar 09 20:23 |
| schestowitz | Not really | Mar 09 20:23 |
| schestowitz | It just needs server edition of something. | Mar 09 20:23 |
| schestowitz | *or | Mar 09 20:23 |
| _Hicham_ | you have to pay to access the repos | Mar 09 20:23 |
| schestowitz | Repos are a nice bonus not a guarantee or obligation | Mar 09 20:23 |
| schestowitz | And this packages is large | Mar 09 20:24 |
| schestowitz | Let me check what it says | Mar 09 20:24 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: no, not paid | Mar 09 20:24 |
| schestowitz | Let me check. | Mar 09 20:24 |
| JoeSandwich | Paying for OSS software is totally legit | Mar 09 20:24 |
| schestowitz | Yes, it is | Mar 09 20:24 |
| JoeSandwich | especially paying for server access | Mar 09 20:24 |
| JoeSandwich | Bandwidth costs etc. | Mar 09 20:25 |
| _Hicham_ | pay as a donation | Mar 09 20:25 |
| _Hicham_ | not forced to | Mar 09 20:25 |
| JoeSandwich | Thats not correct | Mar 09 20:27 |
| schestowitz | Gives me another message now | Mar 09 20:27 |
| schestowitz | I’m not sure why | Mar 09 20:27 |
| schestowitz | The repos have been fantastic anyway | Mar 09 20:27 |
| schestowitz | They contain everything I ever needed, including obscure packages like mhonarc. | Mar 09 20:27 |
| _Hicham_ | I know that there are | Mar 09 20:28 |
| _Hicham_ | but don’t you have to pay to update? | Mar 09 20:28 |
| schestowitz | Companies shouldn’t use donation as abusiness model | Mar 09 20:28 |
| schestowitz | It doesn’t work | Mar 09 20:28 |
| schestowitz | I’ve known projects that tried | Mar 09 20:28 |
| schestowitz | It’s better to offer Free software and then sell skills or features or be employed by companies that benefit | Mar 09 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Like Red Hat does | Mar 09 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Sun too. | Mar 09 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Enterprisedb (posrgres) | Mar 09 20:29 |
| _Hicham_ | but Mandriva doesn’t do like RedHat | Mar 09 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Updates are free | Mar 09 20:29 |
| _Hicham_ | is PowerPack FOSS? | Mar 09 20:29 |
| schestowitz | Never did any harm, either | Mar 09 20:29 |
| schestowitz | At any level. Just worked nicely and quietly. | Mar 09 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Yes, it ought to be | Mar 09 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Maybe it contained codecs  |
Mar 09 20:30 |
| schestowitz | I just get mine with Kaffeine and Amarok. | Mar 09 20:30 |
| schestowitz | But I keep my files in ogg where possible | Mar 09 20:30 |
| schestowitz | Since is comes with nvidia-driver and flashplayer you could claim that Mandriva is not FOSS | Mar 09 20:31 |
| schestowitz | Same goes for mist distros with blobs as drivers in the kernel | Mar 09 20:31 |
| schestowitz | gnewsense is FOSS | Mar 09 20:31 |
| _Hicham_ | but it is useless | Mar 09 20:31 |
| schestowitz | Slated is the developer of BLAG now. That’s FOSS too | Mar 09 20:31 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: not useless at all. | Mar 09 20:32 |
| schestowitz | But a PC with it preinstalled | Mar 09 20:32 |
| _Hicham_ | you can’t surf the web without flash | Mar 09 20:32 |
| _Hicham_ | you can’t watch DVDs without codecs | Mar 09 20:32 |
| schestowitz | https://www.fsf.org/blogs/communit… | Mar 09 20:32 |
| schestowitz | You can with gnash and swfdec | Mar 09 20:32 |
| _Hicham_ | gnash is just unready | Mar 09 20:33 |
| schestowitz | For stupid videos that could just be embedded in ogg | Mar 09 20:33 |
| schestowitz | It does youtube | Mar 09 20:33 |
| _Hicham_ | i tried it on GoogleVideo | Mar 09 20:33 |
| _Hicham_ | it was a big mess | Mar 09 20:33 |
| _Hicham_ | yes, it does SOME of youtube | Mar 09 20:33 |
| schestowitz | That’s one of the few things contaminated by needed swfs | Mar 09 20:33 |
| _Hicham_ | it doesnt do youku at all | Mar 09 20:33 |
| schestowitz | Firefox 3.1 might changew this | Mar 09 20:33 |
| _Hicham_ | it support swf up to version 7 | Mar 09 20:33 |
| _Hicham_ | yes | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | Ogg support on man platforms | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | Google needs to be pressure | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | Download Ogg streams in YouTube or stream it on page | Mar 09 20:34 |
| _Hicham_ | i tried it on olpc.dailymotion.com | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | To show they support standard Web. | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | Which I doubt | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | Google ain’t what it used to be | Mar 09 20:34 |
| schestowitz | It doesn’t even give valid HTML | Mar 09 20:34 |
| _Hicham_ | but is Ogg ready for streaming? | Mar 09 20:34 |
| _Hicham_ | I think that there should an alternative technology for flash | Mar 09 20:35 |
| schestowitz | “This means reciting a specific machine or a particular transformation of a specific article in an insignificant step, such a data gathering or outputting, is not sufficient to pass the test. ” http://www.patentlyo.com/patent/2009/03… | Mar 09 20:38 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: yes, it should | Mar 09 20:38 |
| schestowitz | Apple and MS won’t allow it | Mar 09 20:38 |
| schestowitz | Nokia too sued to fight it | Mar 09 20:38 |
| schestowitz | But Nokia is now doubting DRM, so there is hope | Mar 09 20:38 |
| schestowitz | http://www.w3.org/2007/08/video/p… | Mar 09 20:38 |
| schestowitz | Stephan Wenger, Nokia: “Compatibility with DRM. We understand that this could be a sore point in W3C, but from our viewpoint, any DRM-incompatible video related mechanism is a non-starter with the content industry (Hollywood).” | Mar 09 20:39 |
| schestowitz | Android G1 just sued: http://www.crunchgear.com/2009/03/06/g1-tr… | Mar 09 20:40 |
| _Hicham_ | wow | Mar 09 20:41 |
| schestowitz | The Microsoft shills lobby for patents in WIPO: http://www.wipo.int/export/sites/www/… | Mar 09 20:44 |
| schestowitz | “Thus, all patents potentially inhibit the ability of third parties to compete with the patent owner by using the patented technology without the permission of the patent owner.” | Mar 09 20:44 |
| _Hicham_ | so gnash is threatened? | Mar 09 20:45 |
| schestowitz | http://mjg59.livejournal.com/… “Right now the fact that Android is based on Linux is doing almost nothing to benefit the larger Linux community. What could have been a valuable opportunity for us to gain understanding of an interesting problem has instead ended up as yet another embedded vendor kernel, despite all the assurances I got from various people at Google.” | Mar 09 20:47 |
| schestowitz | No, gnash is fine. | Mar 09 20:47 |
| trmanco | http://marketshare.hitslink.com/mo… | Mar 09 20:50 |
| schestowitz | Oh no.. don’t fuel them.. Microsoft and IDG already do that | Mar 09 20:57 |
| schestowitz | Glyn Moody linked to this too x-| | Mar 09 20:57 |
| schestowitz | No More Police Raids: China and Europe Agree to Talk < http://www.pcworld.com/article/160908/no_mor… > For conspirators: http://www.sisvel.com/Microsoft.pdf | Mar 09 21:00 |
| JoeSandwich | Ha yeah our police usually raids the chinese in every other trade show | Mar 09 21:03 |
| JoeSandwich | They steal all our designs! | Mar 09 21:04 |
| schestowitz | “PC World owner DSGi has decided not to renew its call centre outsourcing contract with Capita and will instead bring 1,300 staff back in house.” http://www.channelregister.co.uk/2… | Mar 09 21:04 |
| schestowitz | JoeSandwich: “steal” sometimes means “make cheaper” | Mar 09 21:05 |
| schestowitz | Except for copycats and counterfeiting | Mar 09 21:05 |
| JoeSandwich | The are counterfeiters! | Mar 09 21:05 |
| JoeSandwich | the literally copy the plastic molds | Mar 09 21:05 |
| schestowitz | http://www.theregister.co.uk/200… “Cebit 09 too dead to trash says Greenpeace” | Mar 09 21:06 |
| JoeSandwich | On all kinds of electronics, or tools | Mar 09 21:06 |
| schestowitz | Didn’t the US do similar things? | Mar 09 21:06 |
| JoeSandwich | Not that I know of | Mar 09 21:06 |
| schestowitz | Because the definition of hypocrite comes to mind. | Mar 09 21:06 |
| JoeSandwich | Why? | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | The US ‘stole’ from the UK | Mar 09 21:07 |
| JoeSandwich | I am not American | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | Also, the Chinese ‘stole’ from The japanese | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | And Japan ‘stole’ from the US | Mar 09 21:07 |
| JoeSandwich | They sell actual counterfeit tools in the hardware stores here. Like Chainsaws and such. | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | Everyone is ‘steating’ ideas | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | Restricting thought is very hard | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | Sharing might be easier | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | But it neglects the id or ego | Mar 09 21:07 |
| schestowitz | People want to own stuff | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | So then there’s stuff like GPL | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | Which encourages collective ownership | Mar 09 21:08 |
| JoeSandwich | It is not wrong to get inspired by a design | Mar 09 21:08 |
| JoeSandwich | It is not okay to copy it 1:1 | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | You own everything you create and so does everyone else | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | Hoarding is hardly permitted | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | JoeSandwich: agreed | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | Also the branding/visual identity isssue | Mar 09 21:08 |
| schestowitz | Loreal has just sued ebYa | Mar 09 21:09 |
| JoeSandwich | Yeah but this is what the chinese do | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | For selling fake products | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | China made some exact copycats of iPods | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | iPod Shuffles | Mar 09 21:09 |
| JoeSandwich | yeah for exaple | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | Among other thngs | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | Got sued | Mar 09 21:09 |
| JoeSandwich | Or they use the graphics from mac in so many PMPs | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | Blackberry and iPhone may be other examples | Mar 09 21:09 |
| schestowitz | JoeSandwich: hehe. yeah, that too. | Mar 09 21:10 |
| JoeSandwich | http://www.engadget.com/tag/keep… look at this it is ridiculous | Mar 09 21:10 |
| schestowitz | I sometimes sympathise with those who are oppressed | Mar 09 21:10 |
| schestowitz | Though I fear the Chinese are not oppressed per se any longer | Mar 09 21:10 |
| schestowitz | Just bad distribution of wealth in vast populations. | Mar 09 21:10 |
| schestowitz | I’d be abused when CHina buys GM | Mar 09 21:10 |
| JoeSandwich | Or do you know the Polystation? It is an NES put into the case of a playstation. The packaging is also that of a playstation. It is crudely copied. | Mar 09 21:11 |
| JoeSandwich | http://hardgamer.files.wordpress.com/2… | Mar 09 21:11 |
| JoeSandwich | This stuff is made to fool and rip people off | Mar 09 21:11 |
| schestowitz | http://www.johannes-eva.net/images/2008_… | Mar 09 21:12 |
| schestowitz | RedOffice | Mar 09 21:12 |
| schestowitz | Looks familiar? | Mar 09 21:12 |
| JoeSandwich | lol | Mar 09 21:12 |
| MinceR | schestowitz: remember they still have censorship and only one party to “choose” from | Mar 09 21:12 |
| JoeSandwich | I don’t care if chinese copy the stuff and sell it in their own country | Mar 09 21:12 |
| JoeSandwich | It’s their problem | Mar 09 21:12 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: yes, I know. | Mar 09 21:13 |
| schestowitz | NWO done the wrong way | Mar 09 21:13 |
| schestowitz | “Subscribers to the popular micro-blogging site received malicious messages from compromised accounts inviting them to visit a pornographic website.” http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/03/09/… | Mar 09 21:14 |
| schestowitz | The 100s of links I have to “Firefox 3.1″ in BN need updating http://www.linuxworld.com/news/2009/030909… | Mar 09 21:16 |
| *JoeSandwich is now known as proximity | Mar 09 21:16 | |
| schestowitz | There is no Firefox 3.1. Ever. | Mar 09 21:16 |
| *_Hicham_ has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Mar 09 21:24 | |
| *easy has quit (“Leaving”) | Mar 09 21:26 | |
| schestowitz | PCLinuxOS 2009 (GNOME) has just been release. Major one… | Mar 09 21:37 |
| schestowitz | First SCO, now SUN… Linux is eclipsing UNIX. | Mar 09 21:37 |
| schestowitz | http://www.tectonic.co.za/?p=4330 (Is Red Hat ready to overtake Sun?) | Mar 09 21:37 |
| trmanco | Mozilla Patches Fastest. NOT!: http://www.computerworld.com/action/article.d… | Mar 09 21:44 |
| trmanco | let me laugh… | Mar 09 21:44 |
| trmanco | ” [DISCLOSURE: Jeff Jones is a director at Microsoft. You can learn more about him at his technet blog.]“ | Mar 09 21:44 |
| trmanco | idiot | Mar 09 21:44 |
| trmanco | phony reports sponsored by Msofties | Mar 09 21:45 |
| *_Hicham_ (n=hicham@adsl196-116-20-217-196.adsl196-9.iam.net.ma) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 21:48 | |
| schestowitz | IDG gives him a plafform | Mar 09 21:49 |
| schestowitz | it did this last month too | Mar 09 21:49 |
| schestowitz | IDG is a money buddy of Microsoft | Mar 09 21:49 |
| schestowitz | He should reminds people that many of these flaws are Windows-only, i.e. they are caused by his employer’s own incompetence, not Mozilla. | Mar 09 21:50 |
| trmanco | he should blog on his own stupid platform (ASP,IIS) instead of going to computerworld (Apache,php) | Mar 09 21:52 |
| trmanco | http://arebentisch.wordpress.com/2009… | Mar 09 21:53 |
| *mib_qq08cj (i=a6d65642@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-a340b509516067ee) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 21:54 | |
| schestowitz | trmanco: it’s IDC | Mar 09 21:55 |
| schestowitz | They are friends of Microsoft, which wanted to ‘moderate’ this discussion. Hey, who needs journalists anyway? Just need their platform |
Mar 09 21:55 |
| trmanco | … | Mar 09 21:55 |
| schestowitz | Besides, nobodys reads Jones’ blog | Mar 09 21:56 |
| schestowitz | Those who do are in the choir | Mar 09 21:56 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft employees | Mar 09 21:56 |
| schestowitz | I once tried to leave a comment in his blog (long, polite) and he rejected it | Mar 09 21:57 |
| schestowitz | Wow. Microsoft censorship. Say it ain’t so, Virginia! | Mar 09 21:57 |
| trmanco | lol | Mar 09 21:58 |
| *mib_qq08cj has quit (Client Quit) | Mar 09 21:59 | |
| schestowitz | Were they confident of their future, they would not need to infiltrate other people’s press while deleting anything ‘alien’ on their own. | Mar 09 22:00 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: identi.ca won’t allow downloading more than just 50 recent entires: http://identi.ca/schestowitz/rss | Mar 09 22:01 |
| schestowitz | That’s what I suspected | Mar 09 22:01 |
| schestowitz | So the data gets jammed in their DB | Mar 09 22:01 |
| trmanco | I’ll check if there is any export feature in future releases | Mar 09 22:02 |
| schestowitz | http://identi.ca/notice/2694452 | Mar 09 22:03 |
| schestowitz | The PCLOS site says nothing about their release | Mar 09 22:04 |
| schestowitz | I couldn’t easily access their mailing lists either. it must be announced in their forums somewhere. | Mar 09 22:05 |
| trmanco | cache maybe | Mar 09 22:05 |
| trmanco | schestowitz, http://laconi.ca/trac/ticket/1231 | Mar 09 22:08 |
| trmanco | Milestone: 1.0 | Mar 09 22:08 |
| trmanco | http://laconi.ca/trac/ticket/803 | Mar 09 22:09 |
| trmanco | this one is already due | Mar 09 22:09 |
| schestowitz | This is brilliant, thanks trmanco | Mar 09 22:10 |
| trmanco | I’m not done yet | Mar 09 22:11 |
| trmanco | stay tunned I’ll tweet something more | Mar 09 22:11 |
| schestowitz | Posted: identi.ca full data export is already being worked on: http://laconi.ca/trac/ticket/803 http://laconi.ca/trac/ticket/1231 Thanks @trmanco | Mar 09 22:12 |
| trmanco | ahh, I just saw that  |
Mar 09 22:13 |
| schestowitz | “TAGS IN TRMANCO’S NOTICES: fail gmail google” | Mar 09 22:15 |
| schestowitz | Google haters supermo | Mar 09 22:15 |
| trmanco | schestowitz, no that was me responding to the people that were saying that | Mar 09 22:16 |
| schestowitz | Yes, unfortunate tagging there. | Mar 09 22:16 |
| trmanco | I think I tweeted saying that everything was fine using IMAP | Mar 09 22:16 |
| schestowitz | “wine” <- that’ll impress potential employers | Mar 09 22:17 |
| trmanco | oops | Mar 09 22:17 |
| trmanco | it really is huge | Mar 09 22:17 |
| trmanco | I’ll try to bury that somehow | Mar 09 22:18 |
| trmanco | LOL | Mar 09 22:18 |
| schestowitz | Climate Change Affecting Europe’s Birds Now, Say Researchers < http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20… > | Mar 09 22:20 |
| schestowitz | Drink your problems away. Wash it off with tags | Mar 09 22:21 |
| trmanco | I guess tha got that big because a lot a people where also tweeting it | Mar 09 22:21 |
| schestowitz | The 50,000 Signatures Campaign for Muntataha Zaidi < http://www.ipetitions.com/petition… > The shoe thrower who challenged an invader | Mar 09 22:21 |
| schestowitz | *show | Mar 09 22:21 |
| trmanco | shoe thrower, that remind me of something | Mar 09 22:22 |
| trmanco | *s | Mar 09 22:22 |
| schestowitz | He threw a shoe and threw quite a show too | Mar 09 22:22 |
| schestowitz | Mediterranean Sea Level Could Rise By Over Two Feet, Global Models Predict < http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/… > | Mar 09 22:23 |
| schestowitz | Here come the junk scientists. Cue entry in 3.. 2… 1.. | Mar 09 22:23 |
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| *Balrog_ (n=Balrog@pool-68-238-234-58.phil.east.verizon.net) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 22:29 | |
| schestowitz | EXCELLENT comment from Michael Tiemann (harsh words from head of OSI): http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.php3?l… | Mar 09 22:31 |
| trmanco | very well put | Mar 09 22:33 |
| proximity | I have to disagree | Mar 09 22:37 |
| proximity | Microsoft treats its Employees well | Mar 09 22:37 |
| proximity | The xbox does lose money, but not as much as the PS3 | Mar 09 22:38 |
| Balrog_ | I heard reports that there’s so much red tape in MS that even though employees *want* to do stuff, they can’t | Mar 09 22:38 |
| Balrog_ | (from firsthand sources) | Mar 09 22:38 |
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| oiaohm | schestowitz: I forgot to say the big difference between Australian Patent law and USA one. It effectively makes all MS patents Null and Void. | Mar 09 22:39 |
| schestowitz | Posted to BN just now. | Mar 09 22:39 |
| schestowitz | proximity: two negatives don’t make a positive | Mar 09 22:40 |
| Balrog_ | and what about the Nintendo Wii? | Mar 09 22:40 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: really? How so? | Mar 09 22:40 |
| proximity | The Wii Hardware is a joke | Mar 09 22:40 |
| schestowitz | Balrog: works well for Nintendo | Mar 09 22:40 |
| oiaohm | You are required if something you make is using your own patents to include there numbers on your item or in the documentation or on packaging. | Mar 09 22:40 |
| Balrog_ | each system sold makes Nintendo $25 in profit. | Mar 09 22:40 |
| schestowitz | proximity: it’s about gameplay | Mar 09 22:41 |
| proximity | Yeah because it is made out of crap | Mar 09 22:41 |
| schestowitz | Lots of the market are not about blowing people’s heads off. | Mar 09 22:41 |
| proximity | Not for me it is | Mar 09 22:41 |
| schestowitz | Unless you target hardcore gamers (small audience) | Mar 09 22:41 |
| oiaohm | If you don’t person can use your application or device as basically reference without any legal issues. | Mar 09 22:41 |
| proximity | gameplay is important, but if technical advance did not account for success, we’d all stil be playing pacman | Mar 09 22:41 |
| schestowitz | Balrog: they earn from games. they all do. | Mar 09 22:41 |
| oiaohm | Because it classes as attempted entrapment not to label the patents on your device. | Mar 09 22:41 |
| Balrog_ | I know the hardware is not as powerful … but the software is (a) less expensive, (b) easier to write, (c) remote is certainly innovative | Mar 09 22:42 |
| schestowitz | proximity: macman can be fun. | Mar 09 22:42 |
| Balrog_ | and games are better | Mar 09 22:42 |
| proximity | The core gamers are who brought this business where it is today: On par with hollywood | Mar 09 22:42 |
| oiaohm | schestowitz: find the list of patents Vista uses. | Mar 09 22:42 |
| oiaohm | There is no list. | Mar 09 22:42 |
| Balrog_ | but many of those gamers are now using PC. | Mar 09 22:42 |
| proximity | Pacman IS fun, I don’t challenge that | Mar 09 22:42 |
| schestowitz | LXer has a DB for patents Microsoft infringes. | Mar 09 22:42 |
| proximity | No they aren’t, PC is half-dead and many games are console-only. | Mar 09 22:43 |
| schestowitz | Lots of games are about vanity | Mar 09 22:43 |
| schestowitz | If not to peer than to self | Mar 09 22:43 |
| Balrog_ | well, way too many | Mar 09 22:43 |
| schestowitz | Boys love violent games | Mar 09 22:43 |
| schestowitz | *then | Mar 09 22:43 |
| Balrog_ | *most | Mar 09 22:43 |
| Balrog_ | I dislike violent games. | Mar 09 22:43 |
| schestowitz | I don’t | Mar 09 22:44 |
| schestowitz | But I see the futility of them | Mar 09 22:44 |
| oiaohm | Ok some of the best nexuiz players I know are Ladies. | Mar 09 22:44 |
| schestowitz | I was addicted to some | Mar 09 22:44 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: maybe they like shooting males |
Mar 09 22:44 |
| Balrog_ | they just don’t appeal to me | Mar 09 22:44 |
| proximity | Games serve no purpose other than entertainment | Mar 09 22:44 |
| Balrog_ | (violent ones) | Mar 09 22:44 |
| proximity | If they entertain you, they are not futile | Mar 09 22:44 |
| schestowitz | Been there done that since Wolfenstein (the first) | Mar 09 22:44 |
| Balrog_ | proximity: what about all the PS3′s that sold as BD players? | Mar 09 22:45 |
| oiaohm | Female football players are also not the people to insult either. | Mar 09 22:45 |
| proximity | Balrog: Those are even worse for Sony, because they don’t create income by game licensing fees | Mar 09 22:45 |
| *toros has quit (“leaving”) | Mar 09 22:45 | |
| proximity | Sony loses money with every PS3 built | Mar 09 22:45 |
| proximity | They will never make it profitable, if you ask me | Mar 09 22:46 |
| proximity | Well the PS3 business | Mar 09 22:46 |
| oiaohm | Currently Sony is breaking even on PS3 production. | Mar 09 22:46 |
| proximity | Not Playstation in general | Mar 09 22:46 |
| oiaohm | Cost of parts that go into has droped. | Mar 09 22:46 |
| schestowitz | Vista7 laptop/bribe recipient on VIsta death to another huge chain: http://technologizer.com/2009/03/07/t… | Mar 09 22:46 |
| Balrog_ | proximity: that has changed since they removed PS2 support | Mar 09 22:46 |
| Balrog_ | and yes, the cost has dropped too. | Mar 09 22:46 |
| proximity | yes, but in order to stay competitive they must still lower prices further | Mar 09 22:47 |
| Balrog_ | (new PS3′s can’t play PS2 games) | Mar 09 22:47 |
| proximity | No, that has not changed because of that | Mar 09 22:47 |
| oiaohm | Sony sells PS3 as game and movie player. | Mar 09 22:47 |
| proximity | It saved a few bucks | Mar 09 22:47 |
| proximity | but they still lose a lot | Mar 09 22:47 |
| oiaohm | Nop they don’t need to drop it more. | Mar 09 22:47 |
| proximity | The bluray drive alone is very expensive, especially in the beginning of the PS3 it was | Mar 09 22:48 |
| oiaohm | Japan market treated the PS3 ok. | Mar 09 22:48 |
| oiaohm | Xbox 360 is not designed to fit that market. | Mar 09 22:48 |
| proximity | Xbox 360 actually had a large success in Japan | Mar 09 22:48 |
| oiaohm | Wii caused sony trouble in that market. | Mar 09 22:48 |
| proximity | Japanese usually wouldn’t buy a foreign console | Mar 09 22:48 |
| oiaohm | That they bough any was a success | Mar 09 22:49 |
| proximity | Xbox 360 is remarkable, for Japan | Mar 09 22:49 |
| oiaohm | Numbers of Xbox 360 sold really was not that great. | Mar 09 22:49 |
| schestowitz | There is something spooky about the photos. | Mar 09 22:49 |
| Balrog_ | some say that the estimated sales numbers are units shipped to stores | Mar 09 22:49 |
| proximity | At one time there were more Xbox360 sold than PS3 in Japan | Mar 09 22:49 |
| oiaohm | Wii kicking PS3 but made Xbox360 numbers look good. | Mar 09 22:49 |
| Balrog_ | not units actually sold | Mar 09 22:49 |
| oiaohm | Issue in Japan is space. | Mar 09 22:50 |
| schestowitz | The end of an era… shop that won’t be used by anyone else (real estate crisis), people who don’t buy even in closing down sales because they save up, many out-of-work tellers, etc. | Mar 09 22:50 |
| proximity | That is always the case balrog | Mar 09 22:50 |
| proximity | In every sales statistic | Mar 09 22:50 |
| oiaohm | Wii and PS3 can both surf the net and do other things out side gaming. | Mar 09 22:50 |
| schestowitz | proximity: that’s because Microsoft sort of dumped | Mar 09 22:50 |
| oiaohm | Small houses your devices need to do more than 1 thing well. | Mar 09 22:50 |
| schestowitz | They lowered the price and then issued lots of brainwash | Mar 09 22:51 |
| proximity | Yeah but that doesn’t give SONY any money | Mar 09 22:51 |
| schestowitz | To pretend it was a natutal thing | Mar 09 22:51 |
| schestowitz | Not just the result of a huge suden price drop | Mar 09 22:51 |
| schestowitz | *sudden | Mar 09 22:51 |
| proximity | They Xbox360 is actually a way more sensible piece of hardware | Mar 09 22:51 |
| oiaohm | How so | Mar 09 22:52 |
| proximity | The PS3 design is a disaster | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | not really, considering the monthly fees attached to it | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | none of the other systems have that | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | (wii or ps3) | Mar 09 22:52 |
| oiaohm | Its locked from being retasked proximity | Mar 09 22:52 |
| oiaohm | PS3 and Wii both can be retasked. | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | though the Wii is also locked | Mar 09 22:52 |
| proximity | Yeah Xbox Live sucks, I agree | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | and you have to pay for it … there’s no free option | Mar 09 22:52 |
| proximity | PS3 as a linux box is a joke | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | |
Mar 09 22:52 |
| proximity | 256MB ram? lol | Mar 09 22:52 |
| Balrog_ | I have a 16MB linux box that does stuff (actually a small NAS box) |
Mar 09 22:53 |
| oiaohm | PS3 boxs with Linux on have a use. | Mar 09 22:53 |
| Balrog_ | the GPU is powerful | Mar 09 22:53 |
| Balrog_ | that’s what matters | Mar 09 22:53 |
| Balrog_ | (and CPU) | Mar 09 22:53 |
| oiaohm | Biggest problem on the PS3 for Linux is the GPU is locked off from Access | Mar 09 22:53 |
| proximity | the GPU cannot even be accessed in linux | Mar 09 22:53 |
| proximity | the CPU has its use though | Mar 09 22:53 |
| oiaohm | 256 megs of ram is more than enough to run linux realluy. | Mar 09 22:53 |
| proximity | Not enough to use it as a desktop computer | Mar 09 22:54 |
| oiaohm | Cell based 3d video is required for PS3 to come into its own. | Mar 09 22:54 |
| oiaohm | Really proximity | Mar 09 22:54 |
| proximity | Yeah really | Mar 09 22:54 |
| oiaohm | I still have a desktop with Linux here that runs well with only 128 megs of ram. | Mar 09 22:54 |
| Balrog_ | proximity: yes, 256MB is plenty for a desktop linux computer | Mar 09 22:54 |
| schestowitz | jstedfast turns out to be a Novell Moonlight developer now. | Mar 09 22:54 |
| proximity | Come on my few firefox tabs already take up 200MB | Mar 09 22:54 |
| oiaohm | Under 128 its trouble. | Mar 09 22:54 |
| schestowitz | I though he did just Mono. | Mar 09 22:54 |
| proximity | Yaou can’t get that much 3d performance out of a cell | Mar 09 22:55 |
| oiaohm | Use KDE webbrowser | Mar 09 22:55 |
| proximity | Not enough for proper games | Mar 09 22:55 |
| oiaohm | Firefox still has darn memory leaks in it. | Mar 09 22:55 |
| proximity | KDE webbrowser? That thing is total crap. | Mar 09 22:56 |
| oiaohm | konquerer | Mar 09 22:56 |
| Balrog_ | well at least it works | Mar 09 22:56 |
| Balrog_ | decently | Mar 09 22:56 |
| oiaohm | Same engine as crome. | Mar 09 22:56 |
| proximity | No it just takes memory to render webpages… | Mar 09 22:56 |
| oiaohm | No where near firefox proximity | Mar 09 22:56 |
| oiaohm | Yes under 128 megs of ram it works ok. | Mar 09 22:56 |
| proximity | I bet webkit takesabout as much memory as Firefox | Mar 09 22:57 |
| proximity | And anyway | Mar 09 22:57 |
| oiaohm | Nop | Mar 09 22:57 |
| oiaohm | Webkit takes way less. | Mar 09 22:57 |
| proximity | A Computer that can’t open 20 Firefox tabs isn’t worth 400$ | Mar 09 22:57 |
| oiaohm | It don’t leak memory. | Mar 09 22:57 |
| proximity | Alright, I’ll check it out myself | Mar 09 22:57 |
| Balrog_ | Safari here uses 261MB (a mac) … 10 tabs open though |
Mar 09 22:57 |
| Balrog_ | often I have like 30 – 40 tabs open |
Mar 09 22:58 |
| oiaohm | Safari has rendered page caching. | Mar 09 22:58 |
| Balrog_ | ah. | Mar 09 22:58 |
| oiaohm | Turn that off and its memory usage drops massively. | Mar 09 22:58 |
| Balrog_ | that’s in Safari or WebKit? | Mar 09 22:58 |
| oiaohm | Webkit can have it enabled or disabled. | Mar 09 22:59 |
| Balrog_ | and there’s an off switch…? | Mar 09 22:59 |
| Balrog_ | where? | Mar 09 22:59 |
| oiaohm | I can remember were firefoxs one is at moment not Safaris | Mar 09 22:59 |
| Balrog_ | o ok. | Mar 09 22:59 |
| oiaohm | There is a switch to turn it off in all webbrowser that have it. | Mar 09 23:00 |
| schestowitz | Just in: Google’s Android OS is coming to the desktop this year < http://practical-tech.com/operating-… > | Mar 09 23:00 |
| Balrog_ | OK. | Mar 09 23:00 |
| oiaohm | konq from KDE automatically turns it off if it detects low memory. | Mar 09 23:00 |
| oiaohm | Reason why it can operate in 64 megs of ram. | Mar 09 23:00 |
| oiaohm | Safari and Firefox not that smart | Mar 09 23:00 |
| Balrog_ | about the wii: http://hackmii.com/2009/02/why-the-… | Mar 09 23:01 |
| proximity | it takes the same amount of memory | Mar 09 23:01 |
| Balrog_ | I had Safari run with not much free RAM… | Mar 09 23:01 |
| Balrog_ | a CPU that’s bogged down is worse though. | Mar 09 23:01 |
| proximity | 3 webpages, chrome and firefox both 90MB | Mar 09 23:01 |
| Balrog_ | chrome on windows…right? | Mar 09 23:02 |
| proximity | yes | Mar 09 23:02 |
| Balrog_ | it uses multiple processes | Mar 09 23:02 |
| Balrog_ | that adds overhead | Mar 09 23:02 |
| proximity | yeah I know | Mar 09 23:03 |
| proximity | Doesn’t it under linux? | Mar 09 23:03 |
| oiaohm | Again chrome page cache enabled. | Mar 09 23:03 |
| Balrog_ | (on windows, multiple processes leads to a lot of overhead) | Mar 09 23:03 |
| proximity | I’m sure it does | Mar 09 23:03 |
| _Hicham_ | Chrome? | Mar 09 23:03 |
| proximity | okay | Mar 09 23:03 |
| _Hicham_ | Chrome is not available for Linux | Mar 09 23:03 |
| Balrog_ | on linux, multiple processes lead to very little overhead | Mar 09 23:03 |
| _Hicham_ | and probably won’t be | Mar 09 23:03 |
| Balrog_ | still a bit, but not much | Mar 09 23:03 |
| oiaohm | Crome also has debuging. | Mar 09 23:04 |
| oiaohm | Chrome also has debuging information enabled. | Mar 09 23:04 |
| proximity | And firefox has an sql engine.. whatever | Mar 09 23:04 |
| _Hicham_ | Multiple processes is a good idea | Mar 09 23:04 |
| Balrog_ | It is a good idea … except for the overhead :/ | Mar 09 23:04 |
| oiaohm | So that firefox an Chrome are ths ame size is a sign of a major problem in firefox. | Mar 09 23:04 |
| proximity | Point of the matter is, if you want to surf the web with a 256MB PS3 it will suck | Mar 09 23:05 |
| oiaohm | Not really. | Mar 09 23:05 |
| Balrog_ | what about a 128MB iphone….? | Mar 09 23:05 |
| oiaohm | I have surfed with a PS3 | Mar 09 23:05 |
| Balrog_ | it doesn’t suck that bad, or people wouldn’t do it | Mar 09 23:05 |
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| proximity | Iphone doesn’t compare | Mar 09 23:05 |
| oiaohm | Remember konq is built for embeded use. | Mar 09 23:05 |
| Balrog_ | or a G1 | Mar 09 23:05 |
| _Hicham_ | is there firefox mobile? | Mar 09 23:05 |
| proximity | Compared to a desktop, Iphone sucks too of course | Mar 09 23:05 |
| Balrog_ | yeah, they’re working on it | Mar 09 23:05 |
| oiaohm | So its built to run on like a Iphone. | Mar 09 23:05 |
| Balrog_ | yeah but rendering on iphone is reasonably fast and stable | Mar 09 23:06 |
| *DontTaseMeBro (i=4859c2a5@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-bb2ed649062cf422) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 23:06 | |
| oiaohm | Application for use. | Mar 09 23:06 |
| Balrog_ | true, there’s no JS or Flash but that slows down even desktops | Mar 09 23:06 |
| proximity | lol the Iphone can only handle 1 task | Mar 09 23:06 |
| oiaohm | Light end applications work quite well on low ram. | Mar 09 23:06 |
| Balrog_ | it can handle multiple tasks | Mar 09 23:06 |
| proximity | Or at least it only allows one | Mar 09 23:06 |
| proximity | yeah yeah | Mar 09 23:06 |
| Balrog_ | the mail app runs in the background | Mar 09 23:06 |
| proximity | oh wow | Mar 09 23:06 |
| Balrog_ | so then jailbreak it | Mar 09 23:06 |
| Balrog_ | I have |
Mar 09 23:06 |
| Balrog_ | then you can make any app run in the background | Mar 09 23:07 |
| proximity | I wouldn’t buy such a device that doesn’t allow me running my own code in the first place | Mar 09 23:07 |
| proximity | Don’t you lose your warranty? | Mar 09 23:07 |
| Balrog_ | the G1 doesn’t allow running your own code… | Mar 09 23:07 |
| Balrog_ | no, it’s all software. After a restore, they won’t know. | Mar 09 23:07 |
| oiaohm | Also using the for of Firefox built for embeded. | Mar 09 23:08 |
| proximity | What if you can’t restore? | Mar 09 23:08 |
| oiaohm | As you can under Linux. Uses way less ram. | Mar 09 23:08 |
| proximity | Because your device is BROKEN?? | Mar 09 23:08 |
| Balrog_ | (and about bricking … unlocking can lead to bricking the baseband chip [which is the radio], but the main hardware has a *burned-in-ROM* recovery mode) | Mar 09 23:08 |
| oiaohm | Price using embeded from of Firefox. No extentions allowed. | Mar 09 23:08 |
| Balrog_ | so you can drop into recovery mode and restore, as it’s in ROM | Mar 09 23:09 |
| Balrog_ | that’s why there’s no way to brick an iPod touch (with software) | Mar 09 23:09 |
| oiaohm | Still can use NSplugins that is it. | Mar 09 23:09 |
| proximity | It can still break | Mar 09 23:09 |
| proximity | fuses blow whatever | Mar 09 23:09 |
| Balrog_ | that’s hardware | Mar 09 23:09 |
| proximity | Thats what warranty is for | Mar 09 23:09 |
| Balrog_ | yeah. But then they can’t access flash anyway | Mar 09 23:10 |
| Balrog_ | (if a fuse is blown) | Mar 09 23:10 |
| Balrog_ | they just replace the board / device | Mar 09 23:10 |
| proximity | Yeah probably | Mar 09 23:10 |
| *oiaohm has quit (“by all”) | Mar 09 23:10 | |
| Balrog_ | I think every such device should have a ROM recovery mode | Mar 09 23:11 |
| proximity | So you really can’t code for the G1? | Mar 09 23:11 |
| Balrog_ | that way there would be few bricks | Mar 09 23:11 |
| Balrog_ | yes you can, in a Java sandbox | Mar 09 23:11 |
| proximity | Isn’t Android 90% Java anyway` | Mar 09 23:11 |
| Balrog_ | there’s no root access without jailbreaking | Mar 09 23:12 |
| Balrog_ | *sandbox*? | Mar 09 23:12 |
| proximity | Hmm. That sucks too. | Mar 09 23:12 |
| proximity | So I guess I’ll go with windows mobile then |
Mar 09 23:13 |
| Balrog_ | yes, you can jailbreak, but it’s not a 1-2-3 step process as in the iphone (you have to get an older OS, emergency-mode flash it, then use the telnet exploit, then update with a patched OS) | Mar 09 23:13 |
| Balrog_ | You can get the dev android but then you can’t use paid apps | Mar 09 23:13 |
| proximity | That sucks | Mar 09 23:14 |
| Balrog_ | or just jailbreak | Mar 09 23:14 |
| proximity | I think there should be a little chip, like a microSD card that holds all the DRM shit | Mar 09 23:14 |
| Balrog_ | that’s the best way to do stuff. | Mar 09 23:14 |
| proximity | If you don’t want it, throw it out | Mar 09 23:14 |
| proximity | if your device breaks, the chip remains | Mar 09 23:15 |
| Balrog_ | heard of the Adobe PDF DRM getting broken? | Mar 09 23:15 |
| Balrog_ | (it’s just a bunch of python scripts :P) | Mar 09 23:15 |
| proximity | No? | Mar 09 23:15 |
| Balrog_ | was on slashdot | Mar 09 23:15 |
| Balrog_ | http://it.slashdot.org/article.pl?s… | Mar 09 23:15 |
| proximity | haha | Mar 09 23:16 |
| Balrog_ | taken down, but search for ‘pastebin’ in the comments on that page |
Mar 09 23:16 |
| proximity | drm in text/pictures makes no sense anyway | Mar 09 23:16 |
| proximity | Lets put DRM in HTML!! | Mar 09 23:17 |
| proximity | DRHTML! | Mar 09 23:17 |
| Balrog_ | won’t work |
Mar 09 23:17 |
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| schestowitz | When You Treat Your Customers Like Criminals, Don’t Be Surprised When They Go To Different Suppliers < http://techdirt.com/articles/2009… > | Mar 09 23:22 |
| schestowitz | http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/m… (UN accuses Britain of condoning torture) | Mar 09 23:22 |
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| Balrog_ | HTML has to be an open standard to work. Silverlight can be considered a type of DRM, but it’s a binary plugin | Mar 09 23:25 |
| Balrog_ | Moonlight is still not there. | Mar 09 23:25 |
| Balrog_ | (yet) | Mar 09 23:27 |
| *oiaohm_ (n=oiaohm@unaffiliated/oiaohm) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 23:27 | |
| Balrog_ | but it’s all a mess | Mar 09 23:27 |
| schestowitz | Yes, it is. | Mar 09 23:27 |
| schestowitz | Worry not, Silver Lie is scarceely adopted | Mar 09 23:27 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft admits this | Mar 09 23:28 |
| schestowitz | It makes a lot PR when it BUYS customer. Adobe accused Microsoft of writing chequs for customers to avoid Flash |
Mar 09 23:28 |
| Balrog_ | unfortunately, in certain niche markets it’s the only player. | Mar 09 23:28 |
| Balrog_ | |
Mar 09 23:28 |
| schestowitz | Which reminds me of XBox360 strategy. Let them burn money. :-S | Mar 09 23:28 |
| Balrog_ | https://bnmcfiles.biotech.wisc.edu/groups/m… | Mar 09 23:29 |
| Balrog_ | ignore the cert problem | Mar 09 23:29 |
| Balrog_ | “When I asked if they support other codecs and containers such as .mov, .mp4, etc, they told me that they are pretty much a Microsoft shop. They deal exclusively with .wmv files. They are working on implementing H.264 (for version 2.1 or 2.2). This then turned into a conversation about Silverlight and what appears to be a heavy bias towards Microsoft. The lead programmer/developer at Panopto worked for Microsoft for 5 year | Mar 09 23:30 |
| Balrog_ | all the other players in this business use SL |
Mar 09 23:30 |
| Balrog_ | (silverlight) | Mar 09 23:30 |
| Balrog_ | http://www.infoworld.com/articles/hn/x… | Mar 09 23:30 |
| Balrog_ | good story | Mar 09 23:30 |
| Balrog_ | you may have seen it already | Mar 09 23:31 |
| schestowitz | Yes, I saw videos too and posted to BN | Mar 09 23:31 |
| schestowitz | Hehe. Firefox blocks the site. | Mar 09 23:32 |
| schestowitz | With insistence. | Mar 09 23:32 |
| schestowitz | Very slow on Konqueror | Mar 09 23:32 |
| Balrog_ | which one? | Mar 09 23:32 |
| schestowitz | WISC | Mar 09 23:33 |
| Balrog_ | :/ | Mar 09 23:33 |
| schestowitz | I have a habit of keeping two browsers open now | Mar 09 23:33 |
| schestowitz | It was more of a stretch when I was low on RAM. | Mar 09 23:34 |
| Balrog_ | they’re using the Twisted web server | Mar 09 23:34 |
| Balrog_ | (written in Python, I believe) | Mar 09 23:34 |
| Balrog_ | and Apache (Linux) | Mar 09 23:34 |
| Balrog_ | got it working? | Mar 09 23:35 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft has stooped pretty low now: http://www.techflash.com/microsoft/Microsoft_… (Microsoft tries to entice startups to make Windows Mobile apps) | Mar 09 23:35 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft hasn’t good reputation with so-called partners | Mar 09 23:36 |
| Balrog_ | heh … the iphone has taken over there already | Mar 09 23:36 |
| schestowitz | Balrog_: Yes, it worked | Mar 09 23:36 |
| Balrog_ | and Android is quickly making way | Mar 09 23:36 |
| schestowitz | In wealthy parts of the world maybe | Mar 09 23:36 |
| Balrog_ | ok… | Mar 09 23:36 |
| schestowitz | That’s not ‘the’ world | Mar 09 23:36 |
| schestowitz | Same with Macs | Mar 09 23:36 |
| Balrog_ | I meant with phone app stores | Mar 09 23:36 |
| schestowitz | People easily forget that most of the world’s computers are old, cheap, and located far from any ‘Apple’ shop | Mar 09 23:37 |
| Balrog_ | in the ‘rest’ of the world, ‘pirated’ windows is very common | Mar 09 23:37 |
| schestowitz | Yes, in phone shops Apple does well | Mar 09 23:37 |
| schestowitz | DRM apps | Mar 09 23:37 |
| schestowitz | -DRMed | Mar 09 23:37 |
| schestowitz | You rent programs | Mar 09 23:37 |
| Balrog_ | well, there is DRM, but ask the independent developers if they want anything different | Mar 09 23:37 |
| Balrog_ | rent? explain | Mar 09 23:37 |
| schestowitz | You can’t permanently hold the apps | Mar 09 23:38 |
| Balrog_ | once you buy an app, it’s tied to your account for the life of your account | Mar 09 23:38 |
| schestowitz | Same old dilemma with proprietary apps | Mar 09 23:38 |
| schestowitz | But these are less likely to disable self (self nuke) | Mar 09 23:38 |
| Balrog_ | if you delete it, you can re-download it (if it’s still available) or re-install it if you have a backup | Mar 09 23:38 |
| schestowitz | Expiring apps are dangerous because of data that’s tied to business | Mar 09 23:38 |
| Balrog_ | I haven’t seen iphone apps that expire | Mar 09 23:38 |
| schestowitz | I like FOSS apps. You can access and modify old versions too | Mar 09 23:38 |
| schestowitz | Balrog: are they transferable? | Mar 09 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Portable? Between phones? Different versions of iPhone? | Mar 09 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Executables passable? | Mar 09 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Access to code? | Mar 09 23:39 |
| Balrog_ | they are tied to an account. They work with an unlimited number of devices authorized to that account | Mar 09 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Compare to some Palm apps that are GPLed | Mar 09 23:39 |
| Balrog_ | that? yes there are some GPL’ed apps | Mar 09 23:39 |
| Balrog_ | I believe wordpress has one | Mar 09 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Many? | Mar 09 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Oh | Mar 09 23:40 |
| schestowitz | For Palm OS.. | Mar 09 23:40 |
| Balrog_ | True, you need a cert or jailbroken device to run it | Mar 09 23:40 |
| Balrog_ | no, for iphone | Mar 09 23:40 |
| schestowitz | Well, my backup program, RedFeline is GPL | Mar 09 23:40 |
| Balrog_ | (if you compile it yourself) | Mar 09 23:40 |
| schestowitz | Not necessarily you | Mar 09 23:40 |
| schestowitz | Another programmer | Mar 09 23:40 |
| *_Hicham_ has quit (“Leaving.”) | Mar 09 23:40 | |
| schestowitz | Successor, enthusiast, whatever.. | Mar 09 23:40 |
| schestowitz | The fallacy is that you must rely on yourself alone | Mar 09 23:40 |
| Balrog_ | http://iphone.trac.wordpress.org/browser | Mar 09 23:41 |
| schestowitz | Sometimes companies can pool money to keep some abandoned software secure or implement more feature.s | Mar 09 23:41 |
| Balrog_ | explain | Mar 09 23:41 |
| Balrog_ | the DRM is there (on the iphone) because developers that sell apps (even for $1) scream when people ‘pirate’ their already-cheap apps | Mar 09 23:42 |
| schestowitz | Yes, I know. | Mar 09 23:46 |
| Balrog_ | (we’ll see how far the ‘Cydia Store’ goes ) |
Mar 09 23:46 |
| schestowitz | But it’s a matter of business models again | Mar 09 23:46 |
| *schestowitz lags cause of some news | Mar 09 23:46 | |
| schestowitz | The question is, is limitation to access the right method? | Mar 09 23:47 |
| schestowitz | Look at the media industry. | Mar 09 23:47 |
| Balrog_ | Yes. When apple removed the hated NDA from the agreement, GPL became feasible | Mar 09 23:47 |
| schestowitz | They adopt new models, they at least try | Mar 09 23:47 |
| *tessier_ is officially looking for a new job | Mar 09 23:47 | |
| Balrog_ | except that here it’s not really a ‘limitation to access’ just making it rather hard to access | Mar 09 23:47 |
| tessier_ | I’m not laid off or fired or anything. But I can tell this place is going nowhere. | Mar 09 23:47 |
| Balrog_ | it’s not very hard to ‘pirate’ apps | Mar 09 23:47 |
| Balrog_ | many developers are complaining that it’s too easy and apple should strengthen the DRM | Mar 09 23:47 |
| *oiaohm has quit (Connection timed out) | Mar 09 23:49 | |
| schestowitz | tessier: going nowhere in terms of passion from your POV? | Mar 09 23:50 |
| schestowitz | Balrog: “the drugs don’t work” | Mar 09 23:50 |
| Balrog_ | of course DRM doesn’t work | Mar 09 23:51 |
| Balrog_ | I know that | Mar 09 23:51 |
| Balrog_ | but that’s how many people feel | Mar 09 23:51 |
| schestowitz | No, I meant something else | Mar 09 23:53 |
| Balrog_ | oh…explain | Mar 09 23:53 |
| schestowitz | Like the song. They wants stronger DRM. Like that’s the solution. | Mar 09 23:53 |
| Balrog_ | yeah that’s waht I meant | Mar 09 23:53 |
| Balrog_ | it doesn’t work… | Mar 09 23:53 |
| Balrog_ | what * | Mar 09 23:53 |
| Balrog_ | (DRM) | Mar 09 23:53 |
| schestowitz | More intoxication… apropos, same with the US economy that they try to revive with more debt. | Mar 09 23:54 |
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| Balrog_ | The DRM already there is strong enough. | Mar 09 23:55 |
| *kentma (n=user@host86-152-97-249.range86-152.btcentralplus.com) has joined #boycottnovell | Mar 09 23:55 | |
| Balrog_ | make it stronger and they will crack it within a few weeks, if not sooner | Mar 09 23:55 |
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| Balrog_ | that’s true with most DRM | Mar 09 23:58 |
| Balrog_ | the whole point is to make it non-trivial | Mar 09 23:59 |
| Balrog_ | (to circumvent) | Mar 09 23:59 |
| schestowitz | Why is Jack making DE wars now?? 10 reasons why GNOME is better than KDE < http://blogs.techrepublic.com.com… > | Mar 09 23:59 |
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