04.19.09
IRC: #boycottnovell @ FreeNode: April 18th, 2009
To use your own IRC client, join channel #boycottnovell in FreeNode.
| oiaohm | Here is the problem with TPB. There are a lot of online shops that are really nothing more than middle men. If the link argument worked. The online shops could push for it. Since they don’t store make or even ship the product to you. | Apr 18 00:01 |
|---|---|---|
| oiaohm | Once you start saying a person is not responsable for what they are doing you are on a very fast slope to problems. | Apr 18 00:01 |
| MinceR | nice evasion of the real point there. | Apr 18 00:04 |
| MinceR | the real point being _what_ are they doing really | Apr 18 00:04 |
| oiaohm | MinceR do I really care about the data they are sharing. | Apr 18 00:05 |
| MinceR | i thought that was what the discussion was about | Apr 18 00:05 |
| oiaohm | Really the only thing I care about is that they take care of there end users. | Apr 18 00:05 |
| oiaohm | From defective items. | Apr 18 00:06 |
| MinceR | what they do is help peers locate each other to share data. | Apr 18 00:06 |
| oiaohm | Same with a online shop helps locate items you want to buy MinceR | Apr 18 00:06 |
| MinceR | nope, an online shop has to do a lot more if it is to be a _shop_ | Apr 18 00:07 |
| MinceR | such as making sure the items get delivered and arranging payment | Apr 18 00:07 |
| oiaohm | What is TPB VPN network. | Apr 18 00:08 |
| oiaohm | Getting paid and making sure of delivery. | Apr 18 00:08 |
| oiaohm | They basically have become a shop just hidding where they are taking there percentage from. | Apr 18 00:09 |
| oiaohm | Even a shop give links to free samples is responsable for the link. | Apr 18 00:09 |
| oiaohm | Would you class it as fine for a shop to give you links to fake programs that said you were virus infected to sell you an anti-virus? | Apr 18 00:11 |
| MinceR | we weren’t discussing the VPN | Apr 18 00:11 |
| MinceR | the VPN is a service facilitating getting around fascist swedish law. | Apr 18 00:11 |
| MinceR | their government has decided that the privacy of their citizens is worthless | Apr 18 00:11 |
| oiaohm | If they were not charging for it. Then it was just avoiding law. | Apr 18 00:12 |
| oiaohm | Once you charge for something game is different. | Apr 18 00:12 |
| MinceR | interesting — you were attacking them as if it was no different before you mentioned the VPN service. | Apr 18 00:12 |
| oiaohm | Once they started the VPN service they basically become a shop. | Apr 18 00:13 |
| oiaohm | Risk of them winning the just a link argument increased. | Apr 18 00:14 |
| *trmanco has quit (“ERROR: crap-talking overflow – Aborting”) | Apr 18 00:15 | |
| oiaohm | If they had stayed just a no charge setup. Them winning did make on-line shops very simply get the same loop hole. | Apr 18 00:15 |
| MinceR | you mean decreased | Apr 18 00:15 |
| tacone | increased | Apr 18 00:15 |
| *MinceR doesn’t get it | Apr 18 00:16 | |
| tacone | ops. no, decreased O:-) | Apr 18 00:16 |
| MinceR | oh. | Apr 18 00:16 |
| MinceR | IPREDator allows access to more than just TPB, doesn’t it? | Apr 18 00:17 |
| oiaohm | Yes other users inside the vpn. | Apr 18 00:17 |
| oiaohm | They had taken reponsiablity for deliviery and was charging for it. | Apr 18 00:18 |
| oiaohm | Ie shop. | Apr 18 00:18 |
| MinceR | so the VPN itself doesn’t have a gateway to the internet? | Apr 18 00:18 |
| oiaohm | Nop. | Apr 18 00:19 |
| MinceR | that doesn’t serve their standpoint at all. | Apr 18 00:19 |
| oiaohm | Nop in the sence no link from the vpn back to internet just to other members in the vpn. | Apr 18 00:20 |
| oiaohm | So it was purely for sharing | Apr 18 00:20 |
| MinceR | but does the actual content get routed through the VPN? | Apr 18 00:20 |
| oiaohm | Yes. | Apr 18 00:20 |
| MinceR | sounds like it defeats the whole purpose of bittorrent | Apr 18 00:21 |
| oiaohm | VPN can operate with decentrised linking. | Apr 18 00:21 |
| MinceR | ic | Apr 18 00:21 |
| MinceR | well, got to catch some sleep already | Apr 18 00:22 |
| MinceR | gn | Apr 18 00:22 |
| oiaohm | Before vpn the argument was just over if it was free speech. | Apr 18 00:22 |
| oiaohm | After the vpn you have a shop providing free stuff talking no responsablity for the quality of it. | Apr 18 00:24 |
| MinceR | with the VPN they only facilitate the authentication of peers and key exchange, don’t they? | Apr 18 00:25 |
| MinceR | that’s hardly “taking care of delivery” | Apr 18 00:25 |
| oiaohm | Why are people buying the VPN. | Apr 18 00:25 |
| MinceR | so that they can communicate with the other people who pay for the VPN securely | Apr 18 00:26 |
| MinceR | i’m not sure if excluding untrustworthy people is part of the plan, probably not | Apr 18 00:26 |
| MinceR | (that is, state/MAFIAA/whatever observers who would buy the service) | Apr 18 00:27 |
| MinceR | the delivery itself still relies on the same network for the most part | Apr 18 00:27 |
| MinceR | and comes from the same source | Apr 18 00:27 |
| oiaohm | Like a shipping company is not responsable for items they ship up until a point. As soon as shiping company gives you list of items you can buy they are responsable for them even if they just ship them. | Apr 18 00:28 |
| oiaohm | This is the problem TPB case threated to undo lots of protections. | Apr 18 00:28 |
| oiaohm | Real world protections. | Apr 18 00:29 |
| MinceR | TPB is not an ISP | Apr 18 00:29 |
| MinceR | neither are they the content provider | Apr 18 00:29 |
| oiaohm | TPB become a shipping company providing a list as soon as they become a vpn. | Apr 18 00:30 |
| MinceR | how so? | Apr 18 00:30 |
| oiaohm | ISP is just a shipping company does not really provide you with a list. | Apr 18 00:30 |
| MinceR | what sort of shipping does TPB do? | Apr 18 00:30 |
| oiaohm | vpn network. That is basically certified devery. | Apr 18 00:31 |
| MinceR | you still haven’t explained why that would be. | Apr 18 00:31 |
| MinceR | they don’t control what goes on in the VPN, only who gains access to it. | Apr 18 00:32 |
| oiaohm | Same argument has been used by shipping companies. | Apr 18 00:32 |
| MinceR | because (as you said) linking is decentralised | Apr 18 00:32 |
| oiaohm | They transport the box. | Apr 18 00:32 |
| oiaohm | Or provide a way for the box to be transported. | Apr 18 00:32 |
| oiaohm | Note the or. | Apr 18 00:33 |
| MinceR | that’s subcontracting | Apr 18 00:33 |
| MinceR | TPB does not subcontract any ISPs | Apr 18 00:33 |
| MinceR | all they need to do is give their customers a certificate or a key | Apr 18 00:33 |
| oiaohm | They don’t have to subcontract ISPs. | Apr 18 00:33 |
| oiaohm | Do they provide a way for the box to be transported yes the VPN. | Apr 18 00:34 |
| MinceR | no they don’t | Apr 18 00:34 |
| MinceR | they don’t provide the network links nor anything about them | Apr 18 00:35 |
| MinceR | only the data necessary to set up session keys | Apr 18 00:35 |
| MinceR | they don’t even necessarily know what goes on over the link | Apr 18 00:35 |
| oiaohm | Can you operate a cerfified shipping company having user directly pay another shipping company to move the item. | Apr 18 00:36 |
| oiaohm | Answer is yes. | Apr 18 00:36 |
| oiaohm | So no they don’t need to own the links. | Apr 18 00:36 |
| MinceR | wow, usian antitrust laws are working really great >> http://yro.slashdot.org/article… | Apr 18 00:37 |
| oiaohm | If they were just operating a vpn no legal problem. | Apr 18 00:37 |
| MinceR | does the certified shipping company pay the other shipping company to move the item? yes they do | Apr 18 00:37 |
| oiaohm | If they were just operating a list site they had a chance of winning. | Apr 18 00:37 |
| MinceR | do they arrange for that service? yes they do. | Apr 18 00:37 |
| MinceR | does TPB pay the network operators, ISPs along the way to transport the data? no they don’t | Apr 18 00:38 |
| oiaohm | Some certified shipping companys just inspect the goods at each end. | Apr 18 00:38 |
| MinceR | all they do is facilitate the encryption and integrity protection of the data along the way | Apr 18 00:38 |
| oiaohm | And carry out the dispute with the shipping compnay if something gets damaged. | Apr 18 00:38 |
| MinceR | and the other companies just do work for them for free, without needing to be asked? | Apr 18 00:39 |
| oiaohm | No person using the service pays the company doing the shipping directly. | Apr 18 00:39 |
| MinceR | is TPB responsible if enough routers on the path to the other peer die and the other peer becomes unreachable? no they aren’t | Apr 18 00:40 |
| MinceR | of course not directly. indirectly. | Apr 18 00:40 |
| MinceR | in the case of the VPN this payment does not happen through TPB. | Apr 18 00:40 |
| MinceR | it happens through the ISPs the peers have contracted. | Apr 18 00:40 |
| MinceR | they are the ones who provide the transportation service. | Apr 18 00:41 |
| oiaohm | Has TPB got directly involed in avoiding ISP filters and the like | Apr 18 00:41 |
| oiaohm | So taking up the dispute. | Apr 18 00:41 |
| oiaohm | Its no different to a certified shipping company trying to sneak stuff that they should not though mail and the like. | Apr 18 00:42 |
| MinceR | if you transport a shipment in a box and buy a lock to secure the box, do you hold the manufacturer of the lock responsible for failure to deliver the box after the lock was applied to it? | Apr 18 00:43 |
| oiaohm | Transporters are not responsiable if they don’t know the possiable contents of what they are shipping. | Apr 18 00:43 |
| oiaohm | As soon as you start transporting and you know then you are in legal trouble. | Apr 18 00:44 |
| MinceR | so who’s responsible then? | Apr 18 00:45 |
| oiaohm | Person who sets up the transport. | Apr 18 00:45 |
| oiaohm | Person providing the items. | Apr 18 00:45 |
| MinceR | which isn’t TPB | Apr 18 00:45 |
| oiaohm | Person recieving the times. | Apr 18 00:46 |
| oiaohm | VPN is setting up a transport system. | Apr 18 00:46 |
| MinceR | all those people are peers, not TPB. | Apr 18 00:46 |
| MinceR | nope | Apr 18 00:46 |
| MinceR | VPN is setting up encryption and integrity protection of the data transported | Apr 18 00:46 |
| oiaohm | Stealthing the transport. | Apr 18 00:46 |
| oiaohm | Anyone doing that is also at risk. | Apr 18 00:47 |
| MinceR | does your ISP refuse to let your packets through if it can’t decrypt the contents? | Apr 18 00:47 |
| oiaohm | ISP’s don’t have to. | Apr 18 00:47 |
| MinceR | then your analogy has failed. | Apr 18 00:47 |
| oiaohm | Do they know that the contents in that encrypted transport contain items that it should not. | Apr 18 00:47 |
| oiaohm | ISP don’t. | Apr 18 00:48 |
| MinceR | does the certified shipping company know if the box is locked with a lock they can’t open? | Apr 18 00:48 |
| oiaohm | The difference here TPB is not operating with a pure locked box. | Apr 18 00:49 |
| oiaohm | If TPB had no way to know any of the contents inside the VPN no legal trouble. | Apr 18 00:49 |
| oiaohm | They have put two incompadible items teoghter trying to avoid law. | Apr 18 00:50 |
| MinceR | they have no way to know | Apr 18 00:50 |
| MinceR | and they don’t want to have any way to know that | Apr 18 00:50 |
| oiaohm | Do they not provide a list of avalid items to be shipped. | Apr 18 00:50 |
| MinceR | and depending on how key exchange happens, that box can be pretty well locked up. | Apr 18 00:51 |
| oiaohm | List + vpn dead meat. | Apr 18 00:51 |
| MinceR | you’re still leaping to conclusions. | Apr 18 00:51 |
| MinceR | but i don’t think i can convince you anyway. good night | Apr 18 00:51 |
| oiaohm | Its not conclusions past cases with shipping companies covered the same line TPB tried. MinceR | Apr 18 00:52 |
| oiaohm | You cannot say you don’t know what is in any of the boxs if you provide a list of items for people to get and some of them should not be sent. Ok you don’t know what boxes. | Apr 18 00:53 |
| oiaohm | But some boxs you are shipping are problems. That is what the past cases said. | Apr 18 00:54 |
| oiaohm | In that case you are still reposnable to correct your list. Or pay the price. | Apr 18 00:54 |
| oiaohm | Laws don’t let sitting on hands and doing nothing. | Apr 18 00:56 |
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| schestowitz | MinceR: antitrust is OK | Apr 18 00:59 |
| schestowitz | After Vista7 there might not be much left | Apr 18 00:59 |
| schestowitz | So why bother with another Unisys? | Apr 18 00:59 |
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| schestowitz | gn | Apr 18 01:16 |
| silentivm | gn | Apr 18 01:16 |
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| _Hicham_ | Hi oiaohm | Apr 18 01:23 |
| oiaohm | Hi _Hicham_ | Apr 18 01:25 |
| _Hicham_ | any news? | Apr 18 01:30 |
| oiaohm | Nothing much. | Apr 18 01:32 |
| oiaohm | Just lining up to build gimp. | Apr 18 01:34 |
| _Hicham_ | why build gimp? | Apr 18 01:35 |
| _Hicham_ | did u patched it? | Apr 18 01:35 |
| oiaohm | verse patch. | Apr 18 01:37 |
| oiaohm | Same reason why I patch blender. | Apr 18 01:38 |
| _Hicham_ | verse patch? | Apr 18 01:38 |
| oiaohm | Means to directly edit textures on a 3d model. | Apr 18 01:38 |
| oiaohm | Ie paint in gimp have it show up on blender straight away. | Apr 18 01:39 |
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| woofy | kewl | Apr 18 02:17 |
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| schestowitz | Hey | Apr 18 07:08 |
| PetoKraus | schestowitz: did you read the facebook documents? | Apr 18 08:13 |
| PetoKraus | i see you voted | Apr 18 08:14 |
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| schestowitz | PetoKraus: heck no, I didn’t read and I have FB | Apr 18 08:16 |
| schestowitz |  |
Apr 18 08:16 |
| PetoKraus |  |
Apr 18 08:16 |
| PetoKraus | i’m just reading trough it | Apr 18 08:16 |
| PetoKraus | just to see what they came up with | Apr 18 08:16 |
| PetoKraus | lol | Apr 18 08:21 |
| PetoKraus | “4.4 You will not use Facebook if you are a convicted sex offender.” | Apr 18 08:21 |
| schestowitz | Novell Won’t Coordinate Releases with Canonical/Ubuntu < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/… > | Apr 18 08:22 |
| schestowitz | PetoKraus: for each new term there’s a story | Apr 18 08:23 |
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| oiaohm | Novell not as dumb as they seam. | Apr 18 08:29 |
| oiaohm | By Coordinating releases whould have ment never for sure having a tech advantage. | Apr 18 08:29 |
| schestowitz | Former Microsoft cronies attack mjasay: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/1… | Apr 18 08:35 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: true | Apr 18 08:35 |
| schestowitz | What’s dumb about that? | Apr 18 08:35 |
| oiaohm | Some people tried in another channel to make it that it was dumb not to line up releases. | Apr 18 08:36 |
| oiaohm | Sorry wrong note wrong channel. | Apr 18 08:36 |
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| _boo_ | oiaohm, invite them here | Apr 18 09:03 |
| _boo_ | we will have fun to watch dat | Apr 18 09:03 |
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| _boo_ | and in either case… i’m just intersted to see what linus told about gplv3 | Apr 18 09:15 |
| _boo_ | even though i know that he’s against it | Apr 18 09:16 |
| _boo_ | seems like linus is a big problem from gpl3 to spread | Apr 18 09:17 |
| _boo_ | but he’s not that big for gpl3 to spread | Apr 18 09:18 |
| _boo_ | and there should be even gpl4 | Apr 18 09:19 |
| _boo_ | people are afraid of authorities | Apr 18 09:19 |
| _boo_ | even “free” authourities | Apr 18 09:19 |
| _boo_ | linus, you effing shouldn’t feel effed up when someone is trying to enforce what your really wanted | Apr 18 09:21 |
| oiaohm | Linus has problems with the anti tivo in GPL3 | Apr 18 09:22 |
| oiaohm | Spliting OS secuirty from DRM protections is hard. | Apr 18 09:23 |
| _boo_ | lol | Apr 18 09:23 |
| _boo_ | drm protections… | Apr 18 09:23 |
| _boo_ | you either support ‘em or not | Apr 18 09:23 |
| oiaohm | TPM | Apr 18 09:30 |
| oiaohm | TPM prevents system from being altered. | Apr 18 09:30 |
| oiaohm | Good from a secuirty point of view. | Apr 18 09:30 |
| oiaohm | Also good from a person wantting a DRM system. | Apr 18 09:31 |
| schestowitz | _boo_: I could share some things from Linus correspondence | Apr 18 09:34 |
| schestowitz | And yes, GPLv4 might come in the not–so-distant future. | Apr 18 09:34 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, I raised that point too to him. | Apr 18 09:34 |
| schestowitz | Linus: “I would hope that people start soem critical thinking, and realize that while the GPLv3 may be better in patent language, it’s a lot worse in other respects.” | Apr 18 09:35 |
| schestowitz | I agree that there are other issues, such as the ‘Googlisation’ of source code (GPLv3 does not go this far). To prevent leveraging of one’s work to exclude him/her, look no further than BSD and Mac OS X. But that’s another issue. The subject of DRM aside, I think it boils down to considering and weighing pros and cons. | Apr 18 09:35 |
| schestowitz | Alan Cox reached a different conclusion. I really hate software patents, but I realise they are a huge issue and they are not going away in this corruptible system we live in; hopefully we can stop them from _expanding_. | Apr 18 09:36 |
| oiaohm | Problem with DRM is DRM was designed as a secuirty system. | Apr 18 09:36 |
| oiaohm | Usage by media companies was not its first usages. | Apr 18 09:36 |
| schestowitz | Yup | Apr 18 09:36 |
| schestowitz | he doesn’t seem to understand everything | Apr 18 09:37 |
| schestowitz | Did you see his rants in Groklaw? | Apr 18 09:37 |
| schestowitz | PJ deleted his comment | Apr 18 09:37 |
| schestowitz | it was about DRM BTW | Apr 18 09:37 |
| schestowitz | Linus (yesterday): “I let people know what my issues were with the drafts. They had their idiotic dead horse to flog, and the end result is a GPLv3 that is crap.” | Apr 18 09:37 |
| oiaohm | I agree with Linus that gpl3 don’t fit well with at OS core. | Apr 18 09:37 |
| schestowitz | He also said he *liked* tivoization | Apr 18 09:37 |
| schestowitz | GPLv3 does have its flaws, but so are other things like patent law. Additionally, as time goes by, there is the compatibility issue. Other projects choose GPLv3 simply because they objectively prefer it. This may be obnoxious, but just like patent law, it’s a very obnoxious reality. | Apr 18 09:38 |
| oiaohm | Linux big market is the device market. | Apr 18 09:38 |
| schestowitz | There’s also copyright assignment with other companies | Apr 18 09:38 |
| schestowitz | Like those giving drivers | Apr 18 09:38 |
| oiaohm | So killing tivoization would effect that market. | Apr 18 09:38 |
| schestowitz | It harms a migration plan | Apr 18 09:38 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, so…? | Apr 18 09:38 |
| schestowitz | He knows about Android now | Apr 18 09:38 |
| schestowitz | Linus tells me: “If they had _just_ updated the patent language, this just wouldn’t be an issue. But nooo, there was a religious agenda to it, and the other updates made the GPLv3 unusable in my opinion.” | Apr 18 09:39 |
| schestowitz | That’s selfish of him… in a way | Apr 18 09:39 |
| oiaohm | Patent language was a even bigger killer. | Apr 18 09:39 |
| schestowitz | Some other developers care about those other changes (fewer people also choose AGPLvx). This is a form of teamwork where compromises need to be made; just as it’s pointless to slam/dismiss GNOME as “GUI Nazis” only to find that their work is valuable and necessary, it’s dangerous to completely disregard parts of the operating system that enrich it and appeal to a userbase. | Apr 18 09:39 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: bigger issue? | Apr 18 09:40 |
| schestowitz | How so? | Apr 18 09:40 |
| schestowitz | I don’t think he understands it fully | Apr 18 09:40 |
| schestowitz | he’s not into politics remember. | Apr 18 09:40 |
| schestowitz | He brags about doing just the “engineering” | Apr 18 09:40 |
| oiaohm | Patent langauge was not selective enough | Apr 18 09:40 |
| schestowitz | But here’s the thing | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | To show you he misunderstands | Apr 18 09:41 |
| oiaohm | Someone designed a device patented it and had closed source userspace driver for it. | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | He wrote: “I also think that the SFLC is rather self-serving, and populated mostly by people who want to push the GPLv3 whether it makes sense or not. The fact is, the GPLv3 wouldn’t actually have helped in the tomtom case anyway. At best, it might have put Tomtom’s back to the wall – without any actual improved outcome. What’s the advantage of that?” | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: yes, but that’s another issue | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | And Linux should requested unencumbered code | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | Remember the petition | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | many Linux devs signed it BUT NOT LINUS | Apr 18 09:41 |
| schestowitz | conspicuously missing | Apr 18 09:41 |
| oiaohm | For device makers the need for encombered code is sometimes required. | Apr 18 09:42 |
| schestowitz | He is not against blobs in the kernel, hardly even as a preference. | Apr 18 09:42 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: too bad, eh? |
Apr 18 09:42 |
| oiaohm | He is against blobs where able in kernel space. | Apr 18 09:42 |
| schestowitz | Anyway, See http://truthhappens.redhat.com/2008/06… “Red Hat Patent Settlement Compatible with GPLv3″ | Apr 18 09:42 |
| schestowitz | Linus didn’t understand this, I think | Apr 18 09:42 |
| _boo_ | lol | Apr 18 09:42 |
| schestowitz | This basically means that a settlement with a company like TomTom would not leave other companies susceptible/vulnerable to similar offensive action. It defangs Microsoft as an effective patent aggressor and prevents more patent deals. | Apr 18 09:42 |
| _boo_ | i agree that gplv3 is not as goood as it should be | Apr 18 09:43 |
| _boo_ | tat’s kinda obvious | Apr 18 09:43 |
| schestowitz | I think he just sees Stallman’s face in GPL and he regrets it | Apr 18 09:43 |
| _boo_ | from the first reading | Apr 18 09:43 |
| schestowitz | Look at old interviews where he talks about it | Apr 18 09:43 |
| _boo_ | schestowitz | Apr 18 09:43 |
| schestowitz | Linus (yesterday, though maybe it’s too harsh): “But the GPLv3 people never seem to actually think things through. They just shout “GPLv3! GPLv3! Everything is better in GPLv3!”” | Apr 18 09:43 |
| _boo_ | he’s just awaiting for a good gplv4 | Apr 18 09:43 |
| schestowitz | Why would it be ‘better’? | Apr 18 09:44 |
| _boo_ | nooo | Apr 18 09:44 |
| schestowitz | It would still oppose tivoisation | Apr 18 09:44 |
| oiaohm | There would have been room for like a LGPL version for patents. | Apr 18 09:44 |
| schestowitz | “Better” is very subjective and there are different parts as well as different projects to consider. | Apr 18 09:44 |
| oiaohm | Ie cannot apply patent agianst the soruce code. | Apr 18 09:44 |
| _boo_ | it just should fix the problems gpl3 has | Apr 18 09:44 |
| oiaohm | If using it. | Apr 18 09:44 |
| oiaohm | Items out side source code not effected. | Apr 18 09:44 |
| schestowitz | Linus will have the upgrade. He spoke about it in the context of OpenSolaris. When I corresponded with Marten Mickos it seemed as though he too realised that this issue of compatibility won’t go away. Maybe it sucks for particular projects, but it could suck a lot more. | Apr 18 09:44 |
| schestowitz | _boo_: would v3 be compatible with v4 then? | Apr 18 09:45 |
| _boo_ | yea | Apr 18 09:45 |
| schestowitz | Software patents also suck and I come across more devices and businesses that try to change Linux so as to own (control) it a little better with their hooks. | Apr 18 09:45 |
| schestowitz | Linus WILL care | Apr 18 09:45 |
| _boo_ | but gplv4 should be a lot more making sense | Apr 18 09:45 |
| schestowitz | When he realised how he’s being ripped off by Oracle or whoever | Apr 18 09:46 |
| schestowitz | Like if they screw Red hat and suddenly he loses developers | Apr 18 09:46 |
| schestowitz | Oracle is in OIN, but it could do funny things if it wanted to. Like TiVoised Unbreakable servers | Apr 18 09:46 |
| schestowitz | To sell h/w | Apr 18 09:46 |
| _boo_ | gplv3 is not flawless | Apr 18 09:47 |
| schestowitz | Actually, it’s different | Apr 18 09:47 |
| _boo_ | that’s what i’ve learned from reading it | Apr 18 09:47 |
| schestowitz | Oracle could generally use locking mechanisms to sell its ‘improved’ Linux with better btrfs (better fs) | Apr 18 09:47 |
| _boo_ | that’s why it’s kinda spamming to make everybody to move to gplve | Apr 18 09:47 |
| _boo_ | gplv3 | Apr 18 09:47 |
| _boo_ | do when sane gplv4 is out i suspect that even linus will move to that | Apr 18 09:48 |
| schestowitz | “Spamming” means something else altogether | Apr 18 09:48 |
| _boo_ | and even if he won’t he will be forced to | Apr 18 09:48 |
| schestowitz | You meant “nagging”, I think | Apr 18 09:48 |
| _boo_ | by the community | Apr 18 09:48 |
| _boo_ | just remember my words | Apr 18 09:49 |
| oiaohm | Linux still could add a extra patent clause to GPLv2 | Apr 18 09:51 |
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| schestowitz | “More benefits to Microsoft questioned at the Portuguese national parliament”: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/… | Apr 18 09:57 |
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| schestowitz | Microsoft is such a poor crocodile: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/0… | Apr 18 10:14 |
| schestowitz | Here are some reviews of my favourite distro, Mandriva http://www.techenclave.com/open-source/… http://news.softpedia.com/news/Softpedi… | Apr 18 10:16 |
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| Omar87 | Hi all. | Apr 18 10:22 |
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| DaemonFC | schestowitz: Not counting the couple hundred separate hotfixes | Apr 18 10:23 |
| DaemonFC | just SP1 and 2 alone fix 1,398 bugs in Vista | Apr 18 10:24 |
| Omar87 | Hi | Apr 18 10:34 |
| schestowitz | I heard about 2000 bugs | Apr 18 10:39 |
| schestowitz | Hi, oiaohm | Apr 18 10:39 |
| schestowitz | *Omar87: | Apr 18 10:39 |
| schestowitz | There was chatter about over 2000 bugs a few months ago | Apr 18 10:39 |
| Omar87 | Yes, schestowitz? | Apr 18 10:40 |
| schestowitz | They should call it Windows 2000, not 7, but that would ruin the comparable reputation of win2k | Apr 18 10:40 |
| schestowitz | Omar87: any news? | Apr 18 10:40 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: I’m not sure, lol. |
Apr 18 10:40 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: Oh, yeah, have you heard of the programming concert sponsored by Microsoft? | Apr 18 10:41 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: The one called “Imagine Cup”. | Apr 18 10:41 |
| schestowitz | Oh yeah | Apr 18 10:44 |
| schestowitz | It makes me sick when I see it | Apr 18 10:44 |
| schestowitz | Making the criminal some kind of althete superstar | Apr 18 10:44 |
| schestowitz | it addresses the ignorant followers of stuff like Windows, which is the only thing they know. It’s ugly form of PR. | Apr 18 10:45 |
| Omar87 | schestowitz: I bet it’s just another tactic for Microsoft to hunt some naive victims to steal their ideas like it did with Gary Killdall. | Apr 18 10:45 |
| schestowitz | Not only Microsoft does this, BTW | Apr 18 10:45 |
| schestowitz | It’s worse when Microsoft uses handicapped people to conceal its crimes and damages to society | Apr 18 10:45 |
| *amarsh04 is verifying the cause of a kernel bug that made his new machine only use 1 of 2 cpu cores | Apr 18 10:46 | |
| Omar87 | Yeah, much worse. | Apr 18 10:46 |
| *amarsh04 still has to contact Bdale Garbee about linux.corp.hp.com running on iis when it states “powered by Debian” | Apr 18 10:47 | |
| schestowitz | Turning a perfectly fine nation into “banana republic” (Microsoft in the US): http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/mi… | Apr 18 10:52 |
| schestowitz | amarsh04: Microsoft pressured Intel to move to IIS hosting | Apr 18 10:52 |
| schestowitz | Maybe it did the same thing with HP | Apr 18 10:52 |
| DaemonFC | schestowitz: Always wait for SP1 | Apr 18 11:04 |
| DaemonFC | is what you’ll hear from any person that uses Windows | Apr 18 11:04 |
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| schestowitz | Or Second Edition (98) | Apr 18 11:08 |
| schestowitz | The “let’s try this again” edition | Apr 18 11:08 |
| schestowitz | SP2 = “this time we try to get it right” edition | Apr 18 11:09 |
| schestowitz | SP3 (XP): “our current OS is rubbish, so we decided to maintain old ones” | Apr 18 11:09 |
| schestowitz | Of course, it’s not graven in stone | Apr 18 11:09 |
| schestowitz | Vista 7= Vista SP2 | Apr 18 11:10 |
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| schestowitz | Microsoft’s plan for Xen backfires (a little late though): http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/… | Apr 18 11:14 |
| oiaohm | Me was afk. | Apr 18 11:16 |
| oiaohm | Xen back fire is more tech one. | Apr 18 11:17 |
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| oiaohm | idea of hypervisor having its own kernel has a major draw back that memory management and the like is not shared with Linux. | Apr 18 11:18 |
| oiaohm | Xen is more dieing on tech grounds. | Apr 18 11:19 |
| oiaohm | I think its funny MS has copied the design that cannot cope. | Apr 18 11:19 |
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| schestowitz | BoycottNovell celebrates 6000 posts: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/… I think I can pace myself up a bit. | Apr 18 11:28 |
| trmanco | :O | Apr 18 11:29 |
| trmanco | 6000 | Apr 18 11:29 |
| trmanco | wow | Apr 18 11:29 |
| schestowitz | Yes, how it flew by | Apr 18 11:29 |
| schestowitz | At about 10/day, it’s 3600/year | Apr 18 11:29 |
| PetoKraus | you’re efficient spammer | Apr 18 11:29 |
| PetoKraus |  |
Apr 18 11:29 |
| schestowitz | In USENET it’s about 50000 in 3 years | Apr 18 11:29 |
| schestowitz | PetoKraus: it’s not spam. It’s a mashup blogging style. Perfectly acceptable. See Slashdot or Boingboing | Apr 18 11:30 |
| PetoKraus | just joking man |
Apr 18 11:32 |
| PetoKraus | easy | Apr 18 11:32 |
| schestowitz | I know, I know. | Apr 18 11:33 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: dragged me into microblogging too | Apr 18 11:34 |
| trmanco | |
Apr 18 11:34 |
| schestowitz | So I no longer do the old-generation stuff like Digg, which is looking for people to just submit snippets of interest | Apr 18 11:34 |
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| schestowitz | It ssems like twitter et al are exploding while Digg and Slashdot continue declining | Apr 18 11:35 |
| schestowitz | Digg barely makes news headlines anymore. It’s all “twitter” in the news. It’s the new Digg as a media darling. Facebook is another. | Apr 18 11:35 |
| trmanco | http://tinyurl.com/d7eq4d | Apr 18 11:36 |
| schestowitz | You could count in Google news the recurrence of the different sites (FB, Digg, Twitter) and see how it changes over time, but there is no Google Trends for news items alone AFAIK, just for search volume/queries | Apr 18 11:36 |
| schestowitz | We need to have Marti provide a good translation | Apr 18 11:37 |
| schestowitz | It’s an IDG site BTW | Apr 18 11:37 |
| schestowitz | They might make an English version at some stage | Apr 18 11:37 |
| PetoKraus | i dunno | Apr 18 11:37 |
| PetoKraus | i have been trough quite awkward situations lately | Apr 18 11:37 |
| PetoKraus | so i considered micro-blogging it | Apr 18 11:37 |
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| PetoKraus | or at least doing a blogpost with satire about it | Apr 18 11:37 |
| schestowitz | DaemonFC: your post is in Vista 7 death watch: http://www.mixx.com/stories/477… | Apr 18 11:38 |
| schestowitz | PetoKraus: for me, it mostly overlaps what I write here in IRC too. But many people don’t IRC, so there it goes… | Apr 18 11:39 |
| tacone | na | Apr 18 11:39 |
| tacone | usually it’s non-english website to copy english websites | Apr 18 11:40 |
| oiaohm | http://blog.xen.org/index.php/2009/… | Apr 18 11:48 |
| oiaohm | Its not like xen is not making type II VMM | Apr 18 11:48 |
| oiaohm | So far only for windows. | Apr 18 11:49 |
| schestowitz | Maureen O’Gara: Novell Client for Windows Revved (still obsessed with MSNovell) | Apr 18 11:49 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: of course | Apr 18 11:49 |
| schestowitz | Citrix hates Linux | Apr 18 11:49 |
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| schestowitz | http://linux.sys-con.com/node/554197 “”Virtualization Is Now a Key Strategic Theme,” [for Windows] Says Citrix CTO” | Apr 18 11:51 |
| oiaohm | Xen suxs | Apr 18 11:52 |
| oiaohm | Really suxs | Apr 18 11:52 |
| oiaohm | 4 gb of real memory. All hosted OS must get there memory. | Apr 18 11:52 |
| oiaohm | So running more than 8 OS on a Xen with 4 G of memory is death wish. | Apr 18 11:53 |
| oiaohm | Yet vmware can handle a lot more. | Apr 18 11:53 |
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| tacone | schestowitz: ping | Apr 18 11:58 |
| schestowitz | ACK | Apr 18 11:59 |
| schestowitz | Sorry, got distracted | Apr 18 11:59 |
| tacone | schestowitz: remember zeitgeist ? | Apr 18 11:59 |
| schestowitz | yes | Apr 18 11:59 |
| schestowitz | python | Apr 18 11:59 |
| tacone | the python etc thing | Apr 18 11:59 |
| schestowitz | yes | Apr 18 11:59 |
| tacone | here’s an article | Apr 18 11:59 |
| tacone | http://seilo.geekyogre.com/2009… | Apr 18 11:59 |
| tacone | the last part is “Now the fun part…” | Apr 18 11:59 |
| tacone | actually something funny’s in there. | Apr 18 11:59 |
| schestowitz | “Jason Smith is working on a new project in Mono that uses the Zeitgeist engine.” | Apr 18 12:01 |
| tacone | right | Apr 18 12:01 |
| schestowitz | I remember the abstraction thing | Apr 18 12:01 |
| schestowitz | Is anyone ELSE making a front end? | Apr 18 12:01 |
| tacone | lol i dunno | Apr 18 12:01 |
| schestowitz | http://jassmith.wordpress.com/ | Apr 18 12:01 |
| tacone | i guess zeitgeist has already a frontend by the original developers | Apr 18 12:02 |
| schestowitz | http://jassmith.wordpress.com/?s=novell Not Found. | Apr 18 12:02 |
| tacone | http://jassmith.wordpress.com/?s=zeitgeist 404 | Apr 18 12:02 |
| trmanco | trmanco@trmanco-desktop:~$ time oowriter m1.484s | Apr 18 12:03 |
| trmanco | user0m0.024s | Apr 18 12:03 |
| trmanco | sys0m0.048s | Apr 18 12:03 |
| trmanco | that’s oo3 | Apr 18 12:03 |
| schestowitz | 3.1 should be faster (maybe plat-dependent). I think it’s out this month | Apr 18 12:11 |
| schestowitz | Jordan named All-Star < http://www.journalgazette.net/article/2009… >. There’s this basketball player called Novell who keeps showing up | Apr 18 12:12 |
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| MinceR | schestowitz: that’s only a speculation. antitrust authorities shouldn’t operate on speculations. they should oversee m$ until they lose their dominance on all markets. | Apr 18 12:19 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.computerworld.com/action/ar… The value of Microsoft-related skills/certifications took the biggest tumble. | Apr 18 12:29 |
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| MinceR | hay | Apr 18 12:52 |
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| schestowitz | See http://www.noooxml.org/forum/t-148110… | Apr 18 12:54 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is crime | Apr 18 12:54 |
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| schestowitz | BSI member testifies the BSI is a farce: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/o… | Apr 18 13:27 |
| oiaohm | openxml is not MS first cheat. | Apr 18 13:46 |
| oiaohm | Everyone forgets RTF. | Apr 18 13:47 |
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| oiaohm | http://www.microsoft-watch.com/content/… I like this. Starting to wake up what netbooks are about. | Apr 18 13:57 |
| schestowitz | http://www.youtube.com/watch?… | Apr 18 14:07 |
| schestowitz | oiaohm: I think I read it | Apr 18 14:07 |
| schestowitz | Just briefly | Apr 18 14:07 |
| schestowitz | He sometimes admits the turth about Microsoft | Apr 18 14:08 |
| schestowitz | Unlike blind fans like Ina Shiels | Apr 18 14:08 |
| schestowitz | He taught me that only Windows and Ofifce make much profit for Microsoft | Apr 18 14:08 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft is hiding this pretty aptly | Apr 18 14:08 |
| schestowitz | Merging of units too | Apr 18 14:08 |
| schestowitz | Newspapers fight just like the Luddites once fought the machines. | Apr 18 14:09 |
| oiaohm | Linux guy there and Windows guy there goes head to heat. | Apr 18 14:13 |
| oiaohm | Gets very flaming between them when 1 lies badly. | Apr 18 14:14 |
| oiaohm | One place with true blanced reporting. | Apr 18 14:14 |
| oiaohm | I really wish I would make them share articals. | Apr 18 14:15 |
| oiaohm | Secound I them | Apr 18 14:16 |
| schestowitz | Where specifically? | Apr 18 14:19 |
| schestowitz | And yes, it’s sad when reporting becomes some sort of a cockfight | Apr 18 14:19 |
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| schestowitz | Wikis are a place where opinions can coverage | Apr 18 14:19 |
| oiaohm | Between Linux watch and Microsoft watch it happens from time to time. | Apr 18 14:21 |
| oiaohm | Both own to eweek. | Apr 18 14:22 |
| oiaohm | Both have learned its better to report something you don’t like and it be the truth than start a flame war because you missed it. | Apr 18 14:22 |
| oiaohm | Of course they still put spin on. | Apr 18 14:22 |
| oiaohm | I was commneting on were the truth comes from in Microsoft watch. | Apr 18 14:27 |
| MinceR | http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl… | Apr 18 14:45 |
| oiaohm | Yes could. | Apr 18 14:49 |
| oiaohm | Difference here Google has never refused taken down requests over items. | Apr 18 14:49 |
| schestowitz | Not just eWeek does this | Apr 18 14:49 |
| schestowitz | [Ziff Davis] | Apr 18 14:50 |
| schestowitz | Almost any news network plays the good cop, bad cop game | Apr 18 14:50 |
| schestowitz | It brings them traffic from both side and makes them defensile | Apr 18 14:50 |
| schestowitz | It’s trolling | Apr 18 14:50 |
| oiaohm | Not exactly trolling. It was not exactly good cop bad cop. Both were ripping out what the other had missed. | Apr 18 14:53 |
| oiaohm | Ending up with windows supports and linux supporters starting to hate both of them. | Apr 18 14:54 |
| oiaohm | So not good for traffic. | Apr 18 14:54 |
| oiaohm | Ziff Davis kinda manages it so it don’t kinda don’t get out of control. | Apr 18 14:55 |
| oiaohm | eweek leaves it to authors to show restraint. | Apr 18 14:55 |
| oiaohm | Flame war between authors would have been a better term. | Apr 18 14:56 |
| oiaohm | Yes when you want news you don’t want page after page of flamewar. | Apr 18 14:56 |
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| _boo_ | news were always not about news… | Apr 18 15:35 |
| schestowitz | What about were they then? | Apr 18 16:04 |
| Omar87 | What is the only good thing Apple has ever done for the humanity? | Apr 18 16:10 |
| Omar87 | The development of the the Common Unix Printing System, which is licensed under GPL. |
Apr 18 16:13 |
| amarsh04 | they bought that from Easyprint | Apr 18 16:14 |
| Omar87 | amarsh04: I know. | Apr 18 16:14 |
| Omar87 | amarsh04: And that’s why I didn’t say they built it, because they didn’t. | Apr 18 16:14 |
| amarsh04 | it was fairly mature by the time Apple bought it… of course, ongoing development is welcome | Apr 18 16:15 |
| Omar87 | amarsh04: From Wikipedia: “In February 2007, Apple Inc. hired chief developer Michael Sweet and purchased the CUPS source code.”. What exactly does that mean? | Apr 18 16:18 |
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| Omar87 | amarsh04: I mean, what exactly do they mean by “purchased the CUPS source code”? The code is GPL’ed, so, how exactly did they buy it? | Apr 18 16:19 |
| MinceR | they bought the copyright | Apr 18 16:21 |
| MinceR | so that they could distribute the binaries without the source | Apr 18 16:22 |
| Omar87 | Oh, okay. | Apr 18 16:22 |
| schestowitz | I’m amending BN slightly | Apr 18 16:34 |
| schestowitz | metatags ixed Can you check? |
Apr 18 16:35 |
| schestowitz | We used to have sitemap.xml, but the site is too big for the sitemap plugin now (CPU limits). Google grabs 300k pages/month anyway. | Apr 18 16:35 |
| schestowitz | Categories and calendar added. | Apr 18 16:35 |
| schestowitz | It means more database load, but it ought to be fine overall. | Apr 18 16:35 |
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| good morning, roy | Apr 18 16:40 | |
| amarsh04 | copyright for CUPS project source was assigned to Easyprint, so it could be sold by Easyprint’s owner(s) | Apr 18 16:41 |
| CUPS is GPL, from /usr/share/doc/cups-common/copyright, “The Common UNIX Printing System(tm), (“CUPS(tm)”), is provided | Apr 18 16:45 | |
| under the GNU General Public License (“GPL”) and GNU Library | Apr 18 16:45 | |
| General Public License (“LGPL”), Version 2, with exceptions for | Apr 18 16:45 | |
| Apple operating systems and the OpenSSL toolkit.” | Apr 18 16:45 | |
| |
Apr 18 16:46 | |
| So, you own CUPS. | Apr 18 16:46 | |
| Non free software makers will run out of money before they can really disrupt the free software world through purchasing companies they think are weak points. | Apr 18 16:48 | |
| schestowitz | Is there any WordPress plugin that take categories and makes summaries from headers in them or something of this sort? | Apr 18 16:56 |
| schestowitz | Hi, twitter | Apr 18 16:57 |
| schestowitz | How’s Microsoft?  |
Apr 18 16:57 |
| schestowitz | I saw the Vista/MS logs cited in some sites this morning. The Slashdot ones… | Apr 18 16:57 |
| schestowitz | amarsh04; Omar87: Apple has many reasons to not say the “L” word. Apple is scared of Linux and CUPS was about benefit to Apple. Apple realises that people can’t afford Macs right now, so Linux would be tempting to them | Apr 18 16:58 |
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| amarsh04 | My impression of Apple Macintoshes was that they were supposed to “just work” and with OS X being BSD-based, CUPS was a natural fit for printing from Macs | Apr 18 17:01 |
| Cool. Got links to those sites? | Apr 18 17:01 | |
| You have been doing a good job of tracking M$ while I’ve been busy. Thanks! | Apr 18 17:02 | |
| Just updated the Windows 7 Failure Log. http://slashdot.org/~twitter/jo… | Apr 18 17:03 | |
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| _boo_ | i can’t agree that 7 is vista2.0 | Apr 18 17:04 |
| _boo_ | it’s rather vista 1.1 | Apr 18 17:04 |
| non free software companies hype version numbers. I’d call it Windows 0.14 by now. | Apr 18 17:05 | |
| schestowitz | Watch Microsoft crash: http://news.prnewswire.com/DisplayRe… | Apr 18 17:06 |
| Their UI needs lots of love to get up to Enlightenment 0.16 quality standards. | Apr 18 17:06 | |
| schestowitz | while it lasts anyway | Apr 18 17:06 |
| broken link | Apr 18 17:06 | |
| schestowitz | “Description: An application error occurred on the server. The current custom error settings for this application prevent the details of the application error from being viewed remotely (for security reasons). It could, however, be viewed by browsers running on the local server machine. “ | Apr 18 17:06 |
| nice | Apr 18 17:07 | |
| I get ” Sorry, the requested story has not been found. Please click here to go back.” | Apr 18 17:07 | |
| schestowitz | Firefox just crashed with over 1000 tabs | Apr 18 17:07 |
| schestowitz | *100 | Apr 18 17:07 |
| schestowitz | twitter: yes, they seem to have changed something | Apr 18 17:07 |
| _boo_ | yeah, that’s a big flaw in ff design | Apr 18 17:08 |
| schestowitz | That’s why there was a need to hurry | Apr 18 17:08 |
| _boo_ | people usually use 3k tabs | Apr 18 17:08 |
| schestowitz | _boo_: I’m testing URLs in my posts | Apr 18 17:08 |
| that’s a lot of tabs. how many desktops and browser windows do you lay them out over? | Apr 18 17:08 | |
| schestowitz | twitter: in this case it’s a case of mass-checking links | Apr 18 17:08 |
| schestowitz | And one oft hem gave a .NET crash | Apr 18 17:08 |
| schestowitz | Recgonisable page | Apr 18 17:09 |
| ha ha. | Apr 18 17:09 | |
| !NET sucks | Apr 18 17:09 | |
| I generally lay mine tabs out 10 to 20 per instance of Konqueror but it’s rare that I have more than four or five. | Apr 18 17:09 | |
| 10 to 20 is a max. | Apr 18 17:10 | |
| Usually, I keep the tabs to a more sane 5 to 10 | Apr 18 17:10 | |
| _boo_ | i usually parse html with bare hands | Apr 18 17:11 |
| When I run Konq, I usually start an independent browser for each window. One crash does not take the others down. | Apr 18 17:11 | |
| boo, it might be easier to use a text based browser and parse with grep | Apr 18 17:12 | |
| _boo_ | nooo it’s for lazys | Apr 18 17:12 |
| *magentar has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Apr 18 17:12 | |
| schestowitz | The error in PRnewswire definitely changed | Apr 18 17:13 |
| schestowitz | twitter: I see obs that SPECIFICALLY require knowledge of HTML, not front ene | Apr 18 17:13 |
| schestowitz | *ends | Apr 18 17:13 |
| schestowitz | BTW, FF 2.0 was more table than 3.0 for me. 2.0 was SUPER stable. Comparably, FF3 is not the same; it rarely runs for 1 whole week without a crash | Apr 18 17:14 |
| schestowitz | A good metric might be something like crash/pageload | Apr 18 17:15 |
| !NET aps crash at least once a day for me. | Apr 18 17:15 | |
| I got three failures one day. | Apr 18 17:15 | |
| _boo_ | i’m obviously doing smth wrong… ff doesn’t crash for me | Apr 18 17:28 |
| Can’t say. Still have FF2 but mostly others | Apr 18 17:29 | |
| speaking of doing it wrong, http://slashdot.org/firehose.pl… | Apr 18 17:30 | |
| I liked the “you’re better off taking the family to pizza” angle. | Apr 18 17:31 | |
| Slogan “The Internet does not start with an e” | Apr 18 17:32 | |
| or just “Internet does not start with an e” | Apr 18 17:32 | |
| |
Apr 18 17:33 | |
| Avoid broken browsers, Internet does not start with an e. | Apr 18 17:33 | |
| Avoid broken OS, freedom ends where restrictions begin. | Apr 18 17:34 | |
| MinceR | “Everything Starts With An E” | Apr 18 17:34 |
| oh my | Apr 18 17:35 | |
| Everything bad starts with an e | Apr 18 17:35 | |
| MinceR | (…and ends with a g) | Apr 18 17:35 |
| When your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a nail. | Apr 18 17:36 | |
| “Everything starts with an E” Did the M$ people really come up with that? | Apr 18 17:36 | |
| It sounds like them. | Apr 18 17:37 | |
| MinceR | nope | Apr 18 17:38 |
| schestowitz | Someone wants me to change the theme in BN. It’s too complicated to change the theme in BN because some choice of colours and CSS styles were made with this theme in mind. | Apr 18 17:38 |
| MinceR | it’s the title of an Alice Deejay song | Apr 18 17:38 |
| Eruaran | Quote of the day at work: “I think the same people who work at Microsoft also work at Symantec” | Apr 18 17:38 |
| All part of the same echosystem | Apr 18 17:39 | |
| sic | Apr 18 17:39 | |
| Eruaran | It was a joke about the quality of the software | Apr 18 17:39 |
| echo my eco | Apr 18 17:40 | |
| Eruaran | we had a customer whose computer wouldn’t boot | Apr 18 17:40 |
| common | Apr 18 17:40 | |
| Eruaran | He had Vista… AND Norton 360… (glutton for punishment) | Apr 18 17:41 |
| nice | Apr 18 17:41 | |
| Eruaran | Had problems with Norton so he called Symantec and let them remote into his system | Apr 18 17:41 |
| did he haul it in an SUV? | Apr 18 17:41 | |
| Eruaran | After that it was totally screwed | Apr 18 17:41 |
| Eruaran | haha | Apr 18 17:41 |
| Eruaran | He brought it to us | Apr 18 17:42 |
| I wonder if they tried to remove SP1. | Apr 18 17:42 | |
| Eruaran | those dumbasses at Symantec… seriously | Apr 18 17:42 |
| Eruaran | they tried to install a newer version after uninstalling the old one | Apr 18 17:43 |
| That was the advice given to a friend of my by Dell…. no boot. | Apr 18 17:43 | |
| Eruaran | but… you can’t “uninstall” Norton | Apr 18 17:43 |
| Eruaran | you have to use the removal tool | Apr 18 17:43 |
| Is there a restrictions song out there yet? | Apr 18 17:43 | |
| Eruaran | and then Norton blocked the network | Apr 18 17:44 |
| MinceR | DRM song? | Apr 18 17:44 |
| MinceR | or what? | Apr 18 17:44 |
| Restrictions on my computer, restrictions in my dreams…. | Apr 18 17:44 | |
| Eruaran | We had a Vista system saying “media disconnected” | Apr 18 17:44 |
| Eruaran | because of Norton | Apr 18 17:44 |
| Yeah, I’m wondering if anyone wrote a DRM theme song. | Apr 18 17:44 | |
| Eruaran | Boot from a live Ubuntu CD | Apr 18 17:45 |
| Eruaran | Network works fine | Apr 18 17:45 |
| Eruaran | but anyway | Apr 18 17:45 |
| Should have installed it as Vista SP2 | Apr 18 17:45 | |
| Eruaran | we fixed it for him | Apr 18 17:45 |
| told them that they would have to use a compatibilty mode called Wine for their old software. | Apr 18 17:46 | |
| MinceR | strange, digg lied that they’d remove the diggbar for anonymous visitors | Apr 18 17:46 |
| then tell them that they should take up problems with compatiilty with M$ themselves. | Apr 18 17:47 | |
| MinceR | well, Fuck The MPAA by Futuristic Sex Robotz does mention DRM | Apr 18 17:47 |
| MinceR | but it’s mostly about the MAFIAA | Apr 18 17:47 |
| Imagine the phone calls. “I’m using Vista SP2, code named Ubuntu. Why won’t Office 2007 work with Wine?” | Apr 18 17:47 | |
| |
Apr 18 17:48 | |
| MinceR | http://www.rockpapercynic.com/index.php | Apr 18 17:48 |
| thanks | Apr 18 17:48 | |
| MinceR | np | Apr 18 17:49 |
| _boo_ | maphiaaa | Apr 18 18:11 |
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| schestowitz | EU Commission: SCO’s “Contractual Relationship with Microsoft Invoking Restraints of Competition” < http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/e… > | Apr 18 18:34 |
| *twitter has quit (Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)) | Apr 18 18:35 | |
| schestowitz | I’ve been trying to see if there were automated ways of extracting something structural and useful, but it proved too hard. I reorganised the site a bit this afternoon (see if you can find the diffs). | Apr 18 19:00 |
| *Omar87 has quit (“Leaving.”) | Apr 18 19:02 | |
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| schestowitz | The USA and UK are a mess. It’s too hard to organise their mischiefs. | Apr 18 19:10 |
| schestowitz | Guess who’s promoting Microsoft software, other than Novell? http://boycottnovell.com/2009/04/18/n… | Apr 18 19:11 |
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| _boo_ | lol, i’ve got banned from #socialites because i’m intolerant to fags | Apr 18 19:26 |
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| schestowitz | IDC is not reliable, but it claims a steep decline in Russia too (PC shipments): http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/ne… | Apr 18 19:56 |
| _boo_ | it’s because they raised prices after the new year | Apr 18 19:58 |
| _boo_ | and only now they are somewhat near to what they were before the new year | Apr 18 19:59 |
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| _boo_ | the prices were higher like about 25% | Apr 18 20:03 |
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| schestowitz | Gavin Clarke still plays cheerleader for MS in El Reg: “Microsoft targets Barmy Army with Silverlight” When did Reg wrong? | Apr 18 20:03 |
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| schestowitz | http://labs.daylife.com/journal… | Apr 18 20:07 |
| schestowitz | Whenever he writes about Linux he’s being a f*ckwit, just polluting the Linux news with sick humour. | Apr 18 20:09 |
| schestowitz | “RT @remixtures: Miltos Manetas is dedicating the First Internet Pavilion at the Venice Biennial to The Pirate Bay cause >>and now it’s art” http://twitter.com/glynmoo… | Apr 18 20:11 |
| schestowitz | Update on wikileaks in Germany: Alternative DNS/de < http://wikileaks.org/wiki/Alte… > | Apr 18 20:13 |
| schestowitz | Turns out the man who was killed in G20 protests had a stomach-related problem, probably caused by the police | Apr 18 20:13 |
| schestowitz | “Net books (Asus EEPC) 10m sold worldwide 2008. 2009 21m predicted.” | Apr 18 20:14 |
| schestowitz | here’s Microsoft’s tool for software patents in the EU: http://www.euractiv.com/en/enlargement… | Apr 18 20:25 |
| schestowitz | Why the Pirate Bay verdict is GOOD for piracy < http://neteffect.foreignpolicy… >. Will Google be sued next? | Apr 18 20:25 |
| schestowitz | http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england… “Wiltshire Police officers have been banned from listening to music after the force received a £32,000 bill from the Performing Rights Society (PRS).” | Apr 18 20:27 |
| schestowitz | making money from people’s ignorance: UK wine-sellers declare that wine has horoscopes, advise wine-drinkers to avoid certain moon-days < http://www.boingboing.net/2009/04/1… > | Apr 18 20:29 |
| schestowitz | http://www.flickr.com/photos/norm… | Apr 18 20:32 |
| schestowitz | Two technologists of Indian origin to decide for the US as CIO and CTO (good choices) http://blogs.wsj.com/digits/2009/04… | Apr 18 20:36 |
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| amarsh04 | after wasting a lot of time with re-installation, kernel bisection and possible bugs, I now conclude that the problem I had with the new pc was not resetting the BIOS to defaults after a BIOS upgrade | Apr 18 20:39 |
| schestowitz | Balrog: new FUD against Apple: http://www.linuxtoday.com/news_story.ph… | Apr 18 20:40 |
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| schestowitz | http://www.google.com/news?hl=en&… | Apr 18 20:40 |
| schestowitz | amarsh04: why did you update the BIOS? | Apr 18 20:41 |
| schestowitz | Rebuttal to the Apple accusations: http://maratux.blogspot.com/2009/04… | Apr 18 20:42 |
| amarsh04 | I was having some “fun” getting sound working and handling ACPI, schestowitz | Apr 18 20:42 |
| Balrog_ | FUD against Apple, FUD against Linux, more FUD means they’re getting desperate | Apr 18 20:42 |
| amarsh04 | I’d rather test the bleeding edge and keep it working on my own pcs than first encounter issues when someone else asks for help | Apr 18 20:43 |
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| schestowitz | Washington seems to be too corrupt to cater for its citizens’ needs: http://www.tuxmachines.org/node/35935 | Apr 18 21:19 |
| schestowitz | KDE is collecting lots of new ideas for v4: http://blog.sayakbanerjee.com/?p=247 | Apr 18 21:25 |
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| schestowitz | No ARM for OLPC? XO Laptop Gen 1.5: with VIA C7-M 1GHz Performance!! < http://www.olpcnews.com/laptops/xo… > | Apr 18 21:38 |
| Balrog_ | ??? | Apr 18 21:43 |
| schestowitz | Dumping Windows for Ubuntu < http://livewithoutwork.com/2009/04/d… > \o/ | Apr 18 21:47 |
| schestowitz | Balrog: !!! | Apr 18 21:48 |
| schestowitz | “After playing around with Ubuntu for a week, and noticing further deteriorations (either that, or I was just not in the mood for being sympathetic with Windows) I decided that it was time for another wipe all, reinstall all session, only this time, I decided that I wasn’t going to reinstall Windows at all, I was going to have a Ubuntu only machine. “ | Apr 18 21:49 |
| Balrog_ | that’s good. | Apr 18 21:51 |
| amarsh04 | schestowitz, original announcement at http://lists.laptop.org/piperma… if olpc news doesn’t reference it | Apr 18 21:54 |
| schestowitz | Fist mono, now this? Dconf in GNOME 3.0 : one step further to Windows registry ? < http://www.linux-wizard.net/blog-dconf_in_g… > | Apr 18 21:55 |
| schestowitz | Putting/mapping the day Magee left the Reg and INQ, I can make sense of the change. Those two publications might be worth dumping now…  |
Apr 18 21:56 |
| schestowitz | Collapse of the economy using bar analogy: http://treebeard31.wordpress.com/200… “Oh come on, the crisp sound of the effervescence rising to the mouth of the bottle, now THAT is the most satisfying sound on the entire planet.” punchline: “The recession is worse than a divorce.You lose h | Apr 18 22:00 |
| schestowitz | alf your fortune and still have your wife” | Apr 18 22:00 |
| *magentar has quit (Remote closed the connection) | Apr 18 22:02 | |
| schestowitz | Hmmm.. this didn’t quite work: Switching To KDE From Gnome < http://www.customdistros.com/2009/0… > | Apr 18 22:02 |
| schestowitz | “…Then they fight you” — Microsoft’s Inferiority Complex On Display in New Ads < http://www.daniweb.com/blogs/ent… > | Apr 18 22:07 |
| MinceR | they don’t have inferiority complex. they’re inferior. | Apr 18 22:10 |
| schestowitz | Well, that’s saying the same thing. | Apr 18 22:13 |
| schestowitz | “35% of NHS organisations already use Linux in the backbone” http://blog.procurementleaders.com/proc… | Apr 18 22:23 |
| schestowitz | ZDNet UK seems to have added an anti-Linux/FOSS writer, Jonathan Bennett. | Apr 18 22:26 |
| schestowitz | MOG’s blog on Linux features more Linux poison from Lori MacVittie: “Dear Slashdot: You Get What You Pay For” | Apr 18 22:29 |
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| schestowitz | Hi | Apr 18 22:30 |
| trmanco | lol | Apr 18 22:30 |
| schestowitz | hehe | Apr 18 22:30 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: what did you mean earlier? | Apr 18 22:30 |
| ScrewMSFT | hi | Apr 18 22:30 |
| schestowitz | About changing? | Apr 18 22:30 |
| schestowitz | Oh, Iseee.. | Apr 18 22:30 |
| trmanco | schestowitz, that dconf thing | Apr 18 22:30 |
| schestowitz | ” Make a change to a different desktop manager, maybe KDE…” | Apr 18 22:30 |
| schestowitz | KDE is also getting something similar though | Apr 18 22:31 |
| schestowitz | As in GCong evolution | Apr 18 22:31 |
| trmanco | it’s like the title suggests, first mono then dconf | Apr 18 22:31 |
| schestowitz | Liqidat wrote about it last year | Apr 18 22:31 |
| schestowitz | trmanco: later ActiveHacks | Apr 18 22:31 |
| trmanco | ok so maybe I should go back to plain text? | Apr 18 22:31 |
| schestowitz | “At Microsoft I learned the truth about ActiveX and COM and I got very interested in it inmediately [sic].” –Miguel de Icaza | Apr 18 22:31 |
| ScrewMSFT | wtf #boycottnovel?? | Apr 18 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Aye |
Apr 18 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Why WTF? | Apr 18 22:32 |
| ScrewMSFT | i must be in the wrong place | Apr 18 22:32 |
| schestowitz | Based on the nick it sounds right though  |
Apr 18 22:32 |
| ScrewMSFT | i thought this was a microsoft hatemongering channel | Apr 18 22:32 |
| trmanco | this is the right place to say “ScrewMSFT” | Apr 18 22:32 |
| ScrewMSFT | oh sweet | Apr 18 22:33 |
| ScrewMSFT | yeah… um… Screw Microsoft!! | Apr 18 22:33 |
| trmanco | I’ll brb | Apr 18 22:33 |
| ScrewMSFT | i mean MSFT | Apr 18 22:33 |
| schestowitz | As the price of Windows dives close to $0 MSFT’s last resort is making GNU/Linux expensive. | Apr 18 22:33 |
| schestowitz | And some people wonder why Microsoft is the issue | Apr 18 22:33 |
| schestowitz | And now Adobe for exampel.. | Apr 18 22:33 |
| schestowitz | schestowitz: well, if we discuss particulars it helps a lot | Apr 18 22:34 |
| ScrewMSFT | imagine if m$ made their own branded linux flavour to break the unix market | Apr 18 22:34 |
| schestowitz | We often discuss here what Microsoft is thinking, scheming and executing | Apr 18 22:34 |
| schestowitz | schestowitz: where would the margins be? | Apr 18 22:34 |
| schestowitz | What about sw compat? | Apr 18 22:34 |
| schestowitz | They are stuck with TudOS | Apr 18 22:35 |
| schestowitz | They can TurdOS or Vista7 | Apr 18 22:35 |
| schestowitz | That does not change the internals much. | Apr 18 22:35 |
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| schestowitz | Linux Foundation using Drupal < http://buytaert.net/linux-founda… > | Apr 18 22:38 |
| schestowitz | T’so won’t like this: Linux: Drivers Should NOT be Closed Source < http://doctormo.wordpress.com/2009/… > | Apr 18 22:38 |
| schestowitz | Android all over the news and Google reports good results http://www.eetimes.eu/consumer/216500223 http://www.linuxdevices.com/news/… http://ostatic.com/blog/confirmation… http://www.eweek.com/c/a/Search-Eng… | Apr 18 22:39 |
| MinceR | T’so wants proprietary drivers? | Apr 18 22:40 |
| schestowitz | You didn’t hear? Let me find it | Apr 18 22:47 |
| schestowitz | http://thunk.org/tytso/blog/… | Apr 18 22:48 |
| schestowitz | I’ll do a quick pass through MSFT news. Should be lots of fun… | Apr 18 22:50 |
| schestowitz | very little news from them this week, matching “microsoft”. Just 430 | Apr 18 22:51 |
| schestowitz | used to be ~600 at times (last year) | Apr 18 22:51 |
| schestowitz | Slicing on “Vista” I hold 5 results | Apr 18 22:51 |
| schestowitz | Let’s look.. | Apr 18 22:51 |
| schestowitz | Just fluff and “Vista capable” | Apr 18 22:52 |
| schestowitz | Wow. Only 3 matches for “Windows 7″ this week | Apr 18 22:53 |
| schestowitz | Windows 7 used to outnumber Vista by a factor of 3-5. Maybe Edelman and the other shills didn’t pressure enough journalackeys this week (Easter) | Apr 18 22:53 |
| schestowitz | That new survey totally rained on Vista7. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/30229756/ | Apr 18 22:54 |
| schestowitz | Vista Class Action Reaches End of the Road < http://www.consumeraffairs.com/ne… > | Apr 18 22:55 |
| schestowitz | “Microsoft will NOT offer free support or warranty coverage on the XP software once I install it.” http://www.capitolhillblue.com/node/17347 | Apr 18 22:56 |
| schestowitz | XBox has already cost MSFT about $7bn in losses and XBox360 still defective http://www.businessinsider.com/microsoft-s… Microsoft Stuck Fixing Broken Xbox 360s For Free, Again (MSFT) | Apr 18 22:58 |
| schestowitz | Yahoo and Microsoft… two nagetives don’t make positives… How Microsoft and Yahoo! Let Google Win < http://www.ebizq.net/blogs/conne… > | Apr 18 23:01 |
| *trmanco has quit (“ERROR: crap-talking overflow – Aborting”) | Apr 18 23:02 | |
| MinceR | i’d sentence people asking for proprietary drivers in linux to use crap like the official nvidia drivers | Apr 18 23:04 |
| MinceR | and cope with the gazillion bugs in it | Apr 18 23:04 |
| MinceR | and ask them if KMS works in the official proprietary nvidia and ati drivers, and if it doesn’t, why | Apr 18 23:04 |
| schestowitz | Barclays says “near-term results could disappoint.” [for Microsoft] | Apr 18 23:05 |
| schestowitz | Results should be out very shortly, I thin | Apr 18 23:05 |
| schestowitz | *think | Apr 18 23:05 |
| MinceR | sure, why not put the maintenance of drivers exclusively in the hands of companies who don’t care about our platform? | Apr 18 23:05 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: T’So works for IBM. Enough said. | Apr 18 23:05 |
| schestowitz | He’s CTO for kernelFoundation now, so it’s not a very good sign. | Apr 18 23:05 |
| MinceR | we’ll see if they kill linux from within | Apr 18 23:06 |
| schestowitz | Doubtful | Apr 18 23:06 |
| MinceR | there will always be hurd :> | Apr 18 23:06 |
| schestowitz | Just change it. There’s no GPLv3 in kernelFoundation | Apr 18 23:06 |
| schestowitz | They also put their videos as blobs and patents up there | Apr 18 23:06 |
| schestowitz | [flash, no Oggs ANYWHERE] | Apr 18 23:06 |
| schestowitz | The toilet press has this headline: “Another Microsoft Enemy Joins EC Complaint” http://soa.ulitzer.com/node/924626 | Apr 18 23:07 |
| MinceR | people seeking the joys of working around bugs in proprietary drivers should just go ahead and use windows | Apr 18 23:08 |
| schestowitz | take-home message: opposing crime is being “an enemy” | Apr 18 23:08 |
| schestowitz | Let’s try some headline | Apr 18 23:08 |
| schestowitz | Anti-Reiser protesters want judtice | Apr 18 23:08 |
| schestowitz | “Enemies of tyranny complain” | Apr 18 23:08 |
| schestowitz | “Anti-death protests overwhelm streets” | Apr 18 23:08 |
| schestowitz | Remember: in Microsoft’s world, crime is good | Apr 18 23:09 |
| schestowitz | Opposition to crime is dissent | Apr 18 23:09 |
| schestowitz | [H]omer has an analogy with a cop and criminals | Apr 18 23:09 |
| schestowitz | The criminal hating the cop for catching him. That disgusting cop!! He must be so hatred. | Apr 18 23:09 |
| schestowitz | *hated | Apr 18 23:09 |
| MinceR | we have no cops though | Apr 18 23:10 |
| MinceR | only criminals and people with very few means to protect themselves | Apr 18 23:10 |
| schestowitz | Seeing lots of Apple vs Microsoft headlines makes me think of two people in their 90s fighting over who has more teeth left | Apr 18 23:11 |
| schestowitz | The press is filled with this mafufactured drama story | Apr 18 23:11 |
| schestowitz | They ignore the real competition between paradigms | Apr 18 23:11 |
| schestowitz | It reminds me of how the big press treats election as white vs black (McCain vs Obama), where both represent the same funding source and interrests. People like Nader get ignored. | Apr 18 23:12 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: so make a coalition, bring justice to consumer who can boycott or vilify, serving the role of a jury | Apr 18 23:13 |
| schestowitz | That’s the least sites like Groklaw can do | Apr 18 23:13 |
| MinceR | m$ and crApple should just step down to stop doing more damage | Apr 18 23:14 |
| MinceR | i’m starting to miss the reliability of kde3 | Apr 18 23:14 |
| schestowitz | Oh! Lookie here. CNET gives the soapbox to yet another pro-Microsoft analyst (Directions on Microsoft): http://news.cnet.com/8301-13526… | Apr 18 23:15 |
| schestowitz | Bias by sleection | Apr 18 23:15 |
| schestowitz | CNET is f*cked with or without CBS buying it | Apr 18 23:15 |
| schestowitz | All those HUGE conglomerates and scooping up all the sites and change agenda to praise the white collars. | Apr 18 23:16 |
| *schestowitz enjoys the reliability of kde3 | Apr 18 23:16 | |
| schestowitz | Can Microsoft Keep Windows Mobile Up-to-Date? < http://www.microsoft-watch.com/conten… . | Apr 18 23:17 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft wants to turn unemployed to Microsoft vassals: http://www.heraldnet.com/article… < Business Briefly: Local unemployed to get free tech training from Microsoft > | Apr 18 23:17 |
| schestowitz | http://www.14wfie.com/Global… “Champion suggests investing in spyware like AVG, which is free, to avoid future viruses, and install Microsoft updates regularly. “ | Apr 18 23:19 |
| schestowitz | Common logic suggests investing in a blank CD like Verbatim, which is free, to install Linux and avoid future viruses, and install good stuff regularly. | Apr 18 23:20 |
| schestowitz | Important question: what does gates gain from this other than PR? http://www.tulsaworld.com/news/art… | Apr 18 23:23 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft expected to post sharp drop in profit < http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/Micro… > | Apr 18 23:24 |
| schestowitz | here is the reason why Microsoft is screaming like a baby at Apple|Linux: http://www.businessweek.com/ap/f… | Apr 18 23:26 |
| schestowitz | Microsoft states the very obvious: Economic crisis threatens to spark rise in cyber crime http://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/Bu… | Apr 18 23:28 |
| schestowitz | My sister’s employer has just been infected by the beast of Redmond: http://www.tradingmarkets.com/… | Apr 18 23:33 |
| schestowitz | Mounting job losses in non-financial sectors < http://www.reuters.com/article/rbss… > | Apr 18 23:34 |
| MinceR | the linked article doesn’t seem to argue for proprietary drivers, afaict | Apr 18 23:36 |
| schestowitz | here is the Mifrosoft-run VMware already serving Windows: http://blogs.zdnet.com/Gardner/?p=2901 | Apr 18 23:37 |
| schestowitz | Is Facebook losing its glow? < http://money.cnn.com/2009/04/15/t… > | Apr 18 23:39 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: Tso? | Apr 18 23:39 |
| MinceR | indeed | Apr 18 23:39 |
| schestowitz | Whoa. Watch this headline. It looks like it came from within Microsoft which uses the term “death spiral” epically. http://www.pcmag.com/article2… | Apr 18 23:41 |
| schestowitz | “by Loyd Case” Did he learn English from Microsoft’s internal memos? He uses their terminology… | Apr 18 23:41 |
| MinceR | also, NPD | Apr 18 23:43 |
| *_Hicham_ (n=hicham@wana-132-245-12-196.wanamaroc.com) has joined #boycottnovell | Apr 18 23:44 | |
| schestowitz | wb, _Hicham_ | Apr 18 23:48 |
| schestowitz | Did NPD say something similar? | Apr 18 23:48 |
| _Hicham_ | Hi schestowitz, how are u doing? | Apr 18 23:48 |
| schestowitz | NPD is just the sort of agency you hire for a dirty job | Apr 18 23:48 |
| schestowitz | Like the mafia and a hitman | Apr 18 23:48 |
| schestowitz | Tell them what figure you want, they’ll coordinate it | Apr 18 23:48 |
| schestowitz | That’s how they make monet | Apr 18 23:49 |
| schestowitz | They can select some shops in an area that you channel-stuff | Apr 18 23:49 |
| schestowitz | They do this for all sorts of companies though. MSFT is a regular clients | Apr 18 23:49 |
| schestowitz | *client | Apr 18 23:49 |
| schestowitz | _Hicham_: I’m ok, tnx | Apr 18 23:49 |
| schestowitz | I found some very cool things tonight | Apr 18 23:50 |
| schestowitz | MS put its people as CEOs in vmware and juniper | Apr 18 23:50 |
| schestowitz | http://www.investors.com/NewsAndAnal… | Apr 18 23:50 |
| schestowitz | So now they serve Windows | Apr 18 23:50 |
| schestowitz | very easy to show, the evidence is there. | Apr 18 23:50 |
| *kentma (n=user@ellandroad.demon.co.uk) has joined #boycottnovell | Apr 18 23:50 | |
| MinceR | schestowitz: http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0… refers to NPD | Apr 18 23:53 |
| _Hicham_ | fuck vmware if it is infected with MS shit | Apr 18 23:54 |
| MinceR | vmware did one thing well: breaking after a few kernel upgrades | Apr 18 23:54 |
| schestowitz | MinceR: http://online.wsj.com/article/BT… | Apr 18 23:56 |
| schestowitz | have lots of fun | Apr 18 23:56 |
| schestowitz | like i said in usenet, make popcorn | Apr 18 23:56 |
| schestowitz | that was before these reports | Apr 18 23:56 |
| schestowitz | linux killed win margins | Apr 18 23:56 |
| MinceR | i hope the market gets the point | Apr 18 23:56 |
| MinceR | and sells MSFT shares like they’re on fire | Apr 18 23:57 |
| schestowitz | OK, I’m done with dinner. Can type with both hands now. |
Apr 18 23:57 |
| tacone | shall we expect new trials ? | Apr 18 23:57 |
| MinceR | not really | Apr 18 23:57 |
| tacone | sco/black hole effect ? | Apr 18 23:57 |
| MinceR | at least as long as obama thinks he’s paid enough | Apr 18 23:57 |
| schestowitz | tacone: some inevestors intended to sue | Apr 18 23:57 |
| schestowitz | THe ones who spoke to me | Apr 18 23:57 |
| tacone | to sue who ? | Apr 18 23:58 |
| schestowitz | Missing money, bad direction. | Apr 18 23:58 |
| tacone | oh | Apr 18 23:58 |
| schestowitz | tacone: I’lll get links | Apr 18 23:58 |
| tacone | i meant, shall we expect new trials from ms to other companies ? | Apr 18 23:58 |
| schestowitz | tacone: maybe. | Apr 18 23:58 |
| schestowitz | They opened the pandora’s box | Apr 18 23:58 |
| schestowitz | tacone: this is a recent and decent summary: http://boycottnovell.com/2009/03/0… | Apr 18 23:59 |
| schestowitz | I included there (with permission) what one representative told me. | Apr 18 23:59 |
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newsshop said,
April 19, 2009 at 6:21 pm
Mark Shuttleworth speaks to Novell about coordination, but it does not work out